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the12volt`s installbay - Mobile Electronics Forums the12volt's install bay / Car Audio

Subject Topic: 2001 Monte Carlo SS Amp/Subs (Topic Closed Topic Closed)

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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 2:47 AM - IP Logged  

Well, I have a 2001 Monte Carlo SS with the premium sound package.  It sounds pretty decent, but my problem was clipping if I either a) turned up the bass on the EQ too high, b) turned up the volume too high, or c) did both.  I figured the easiest way to resolve my issue, the one where I bring my stock speaker to within an inch of their life attempting to rip the bass from them, was to go ahead and get subs and an amp.  I looked for a while and ended up getting a Sony XM-2002GTR and a pair of Sony XS-L123P5's ( 12" ).

I know, I know... "Why, oh why!?  Friends don't let friends buy Sony."  I never knew of any issues with Sony until I started reading this site (about four hours ago) and the reviews I read for the amp/speakers were pretty decent.  Now, rather than pay for someone to install this... I figure it shouldn't be much of an issue to do it myself.  So I've tried to answer the questions I had by myself via reading these forums, but I haven't quite found the answers I was hunting for.  So here it goes.

1) When I actually mount my sub box in my trunk, which way should I face the subs?  All systems I have seen first hand, the speakers face towards the rear of the car, but I read a couple things, and had a friend tell me that it sounds better if you have the subs face the passenger compartment.  What are the sound quality differences between the two ways?  Obviously it looks nicer facing the rear, but I'm more after the sound while driving.

2) Keeping the box in one spot.  What's the best way to do this?  It's going to be mounted in my trunk, most definately.  Should I use velcro straps?  Or try to bolt it in some way?  I'm trying to avoid hacking at my car as much as possible, but safety is important.

3) When I mount the speakers inside the box, should I glue/caulk them to make sure it's air-tight?  Or will they be fine just screwed down well?

4) I am using the factory head unit, and won't be upgrading right now.  As such, I was going to tap into one of the speakers in the rear deck and run that to my amp, does it matter which speaker I use for this?

5) I am trying to avoid having to disassemble my dash to get to my stereo, since I don't have preamp outputs anyway, which leaves me wondering how to do my remote turn on for the amp.  I *believe* that my cars current amp is mounted to the top of the inside of my trunk, there is an item that appears to be an amp anyway.  Could I tap into the remote turn on there?  Or will I *have* to run a new one from my head unit?

6) Assuming I can tap into the rear speakers for my amp input, and also assuming I can tap into the amp in my trunk for the remote turn on, can I forgo an actual wiring kit?  It seems that a short piece of 20ish gauge wire would suffice for the remote turn on, and a couple pieces of 12-14g wire would be fine for tapping into my speakers.  This means I would just need to get a piece 4g (?) wire to run to my battery, with a fuse?  Or is there something else in the kits I would need?

7) Would I be able to mount my amplifier to my speaker box in some way?  Or will I need to mount it elsewhere?  As I said, I'd rather not drill/cut/molest my car if at all possible, but I want the job done right, I don't like to take shortcuts that degrade the final product, so I will do whatever I need to so it gets done correctly.

 

I'm sorry about all these questions, and I'm sure some of them are beyond obvious for all of you, but I really don't want to hurt my car, or my new equipment, so I'm trying to make sure I won't break anything from being an r-tard.  I am mechanically/electrically inclined, and I know the basics, but the intricacies of a well-done amplifier installation are somewhat beyond me.

Any and all replies/help/tips are appreciated!

Thanks in advance!


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 3:12 AM - IP Logged  

I couldn't find the edit button for some reason... Just wanted to tack on one more question...

8) Do I want to wire my subs in parallel or in series?  My amp has a rating for 2ohm impedence, which I would assume is saying it is stable at 2ohm's, so it seems I would want them in parallel.  Or would it be better/safer to run them in series for an 8ohm impedence?


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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jeffchilcott
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 10:45 AM - IP Logged  

1) I would face the subs to the rear of the trunk, I have messed with these cars and this will likely give you the best sounding results

2) velcro strips are a very good option, its less invasive then bolting or screwing boxes into the body of the car

3) If you carpet your enclosure thats typically enough of a buffer to make the sub air tight

4)Your best bet is to use an adustable Line OUt converter (LOC) as I believe this car is factory amped, and you will have to tap the bass output for the speakers not the tweeter, and it is typically best to use the 2 rear speakers, stronger signal, less chance of total failure, rear speakers are easier to get to and tap into

5)For a remote turn on the best and easiest sorce is the ciggerette lighter, tap into the wire behind the ciggerette lighter as this is a switched source, and the amp will not pull more then a few Mili-amps of current.

6)Power, Ground, and a fuse holder is basically all you are buying in a kit, and the price is typically about the same as if you were to buy all pieces individual, unless your going to buy a higher quality wire. You will need RCA's to go from the (LOC) though

7) I dont know if velcro would hold the amp to the box, but you can screw the amp to the back side of the box to keep it secure

8) If your amp is rated for a 2 ohm load, and you can achieve a 2 ohm load then go for it.    At 8 ohm that amp will not produce much power at all. You didnt specify what impedance your subs are so really cant tell you how to wire them, but there are parrallel/series calculators on the left hand toobar


wow, alot of questions hope this does it for ya!
___________________________________
2009 0-1000 Trunk WR 154.0DB 2009 1001+ Trunk WR
2007 USACI World Champion
2007 World Record
2006 USACI Finals 2nd Place
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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 12:56 PM - IP Logged  

Thanks for the reply!  My speaks are 4ohm, which from what I understand means I get either 2 or 8ohm, I think, as a result.   I have never heard of a line out converter, I would need to use one of those rather than just splicing into one of the speakers under my rear deck?

I'm getting the gear on the 22nd, so I have a little while to figure out exactly how I want to set everything up.

Thanks again!!


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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jeffchilcott
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 2:58 PM - IP Logged  

You need to insure that that the speakers are not dual voice coil, and if they are you get dual 2 ohm subs, to get a final load of 2 ohm

Line out converters can be found at any shop, or walmart in the car audio section...this would be a much better choice then just spliceing the rear wires, and that is even if the amp has a high pass input.


___________________________________
2009 0-1000 Trunk WR 154.0DB 2009 1001+ Trunk WR
2007 USACI World Champion
2007 World Record
2006 USACI Finals 2nd Place
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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 10:20 PM - IP Logged  

Here are the specs for the gear I'm getting:

Amp-

╗  2-channel car amplifier
╗  200 watts RMS x 2 at 4 ohms (250 watts RMS x 2 at 2 ohms)
╗  500 watts RMS x 1 at 4 ohms (4-ohm stable in bridged mode)
╗  low-pass crossover (50-300 Hz, 12 dB/octave)
╗  variable bass boost (0-10 dB at 40 Hz)
╗  MOSFET outputs and power supply
╗  Tri-way capable (Tri-Way Crossover required)
╗  CEA-2006 compliant
╗  speaker-level inputs with signal sensing for automatic turn-on
╗  preamp inputs and outputs
╗  fuse rating: 40A x 2

Sub (x2):

╗  12" 4-ohm subwoofer
╗  five-sided polypropylene cone with foamed rubber surround
╗  power range: 90-380 watts RMS (1,300 watts peak power)
╗  frequency response: 18-2,000 Hz
╗  sensitivity: 89 dB
╗  top-mount depth: 5-5/16"
╗  sealed box volume: 1.15 cubic feet
╗  ported box volume: 0.82 cubic feet

The subs are indeed single voice coil, not dual.

I hadn't noticed that one part on the amp specs though... "speaker-level inputs with signal sensing for automatic turn-on" which leads me to a few more questions, with numbering for convenience!

1) Does that mean that I won't need a remote turn on wire for the amp since I am not hooking it to an HU pre-amp output?

2) If I buy a LOC, will I need a remote turn on wire, assuming the above answer is a 'yes' or will I still be running it through the speaker-level inputs on the amp?

3) Since the amp is 2-channel with equal output on both channels, I should just run each speaker to the amp individually, right?  Or will I still need to wire them in series/parallel to bring it to 2 ohms?

Sorry about all the dumb questions, thanks for all the help so far!


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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jeffchilcott
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 10:55 PM - IP Logged  

I dont see in the specs that the amp is even 2 ohm stable.   therefore you will have to run one sub per channell

if it has the speaker sense I guess try it and see how it works, I havent used sony products for a long time and dont intend to either, so I dont know how well it works
___________________________________
2009 0-1000 Trunk WR 154.0DB 2009 1001+ Trunk WR
2007 USACI World Champion
2007 World Record
2006 USACI Finals 2nd Place
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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 11:02 PM - IP Logged  

From Crutchfield:

Performance

RMS Power Output (Watts x Channels) 200 x 2
Frequency Response 20-20k Hz
THD at Rated RMS Power 0.1%
Signal to Noise Ratio N/A
Input Voltage 14.4v
Peak Power Output (Watts x Channels) 400 x 2
Power at 2 Ohms (Watts x Channels) 250 x 2
Bridged Power (Watts x Channels) 500 x 1
Minimum Impedance Bridged 4
Minimum Impedance Unbridged 2

Features

Amplifier Class AB 
Tri-Way Capable Yes
Low-Pass Crossover Frequency 50-300 Hz
Low-Pass Slope (dB/octave) 12 dB
High-Pass Crossover Frequency N/A
High-Pass Slope (dB/octave) N/A
Bass Boost 0-10 dB
Bass Boost Frequency 40 Hz
Fan Cooled No 
Fuse Rating 40 x 2
Speaker Level Inputs Yes
Preamp Outputs 1 pair

Says it's stable at 2 ohms, but not in bridged mode... Meaning I can't really take advantage of it being 2 ohm stable, right?  I should just run each speaker directly to a channel for 4 ohms each?


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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jeffchilcott
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 11:07 PM - IP Logged  

yep, your right...it wont take a 2 ohm bridged load
___________________________________
2009 0-1000 Trunk WR 154.0DB 2009 1001+ Trunk WR
2007 USACI World Champion
2007 World Record
2006 USACI Finals 2nd Place
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wretchedunloved
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Posted: Decemberá19, 2006 at 11:19 PM - IP Logged  

I think I know most everything I need to install my first amp and subs, just about.  I just want to make sure I have everything figured out.  I'm just going to make a quick outline of my plan for installing this, if you could just give me a thumbs up or down, that would be great!

1) Run a 4g cable from my battery to my trunk, routed under the trim, with an 80amp fuse near the battery.

2) Splice into the rear deck speakers, connecting the left and right to the input on my amp. (( Will I need to hook the individual grounds together?  Or will a common ground/single speaker ground work for input to the amp? ))

3) Velcro my box down and wire each speaker to it's own channel.

4) Somehow mount my amp, connecting a heavy wire to the frame as the power ground.

5) Enjoy the music?

Seems... Really easy, for some reason.  A lot easier than I thought it was going to be... Am I missing something important?

Thanks so much for the responses ^^


___________________________________
2001 Monte Carlo SS
Sony XM-2002GTR
Sony XS-L123P5 x 2
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