bad wire to use?
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=38897
Printed Date: May 20, 2024 at 12:58 AM
Topic: bad wire to use?
Posted By: /R7
Subject: bad wire to use?
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 12:50 AM
i went to a local home hardware store today to pickup some 4awg wire to run from my amp to my bat as a ground rather than amp to unibody. although i had routed it from front to back within 30mins, i ran into 2 problems
a) 12feet of wire didnt cut it and i had to get more. I crappily sodered another 5 foot line to it (had payed 40+$ for it all). The label on the spool said 'welder cable' which when compared to my stinger ground wire i got connected currently, the strands are thicker in the welder cable, i thought this may reduce is efficency but i have no clue.
b) the amount of fine wire in the 4awg line was too much for my amp's input, so i was left with cutting a number of strands from around the edges to get it in.
c) (not so important, can be worked out)The cheap copper connectors you put on the end of the cable to connect to the battery is too small to fit around the top post, and too thick to hook between the nut that screws to the battery. so i gotta get a thinner connector to fix that, hopefully.
my questions are:
a) the sodering job worked well enough that a friend and i pulled hard enough on the sodering job that it didnt pull apart, and i dont mean pulled lightly by any means,would that still be sufficent for current to transfer through? think of the sodering job as 2 4awg cables mashed together and sodered up and wrapped up in electrion tape. or should i blow another 40$ and buy another 15+ft cable to run that through, or cut my sodering job and redo it somehow feasable [explination on sodering a 4awg wire with another, needed ;/]
b) will the cutting of the outter wires to fit into my ground input hinder current transfer?
c) off topic, but is .8ohm-1ohm (never balanced on just 1 figure) alright? i personally was not happy seeing 1ohm but hell after tonight i was just po'd i got nothing done ;/
if anyone can lend some info this would be most appreciated, im getting my fronts installed tomorrow so i want to know what i should do if it means continue getting my ground to the bat hooked up or not
thanks in advance.
Replies:
Posted By: chevyman26
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 1:25 AM
a.) I've had to do the same thing before, and I never had any trouble with it. As long as you're sure that it won't come apart, and sure that it won't eventually rub through the tape. Try to get some heat shrink tubing over it (not necessary, but it helps,) and make sure the wire is secured right where the splice is to prevent movement. b.) Well, that's all that the mfgr. of the amp figures is needed, then cutting the strands down to fit won't hinder the current at all, as long as you don't cut too much. c.) I have heard on this site that anything 1 or under is fine, and I've also heard that you don't want anything above .5, so we'll probably see the debates on this one. Just make sure you are probing a clean and shiny spot on the batt. terminal. ( I assume you are talking about the resistance across your ground.) ------------- You'd better get me out of this lord... or else you'll have me to deal with. -- Hunter S. Thompson "F.A.L.I.L.V."
Posted By: /R7
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 7:51 AM
thanks chevy, and yeah i was referring to the resistance of the ground wire itself.
i'll probably leave the ground alone until i get a better connector for the bat, thats probably the bigger piss-off of all, wish i had at least been able to put it on the bat, then i woulda tested it. ;/
Posted By: stevdart
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 8:30 AM
If you don't have a torch that provides sufficient heat to quickly solder a gauge that large, then it is better to securely crimp the connection instead. When you have a hard time soldering that much wire, you end up with some of the outer wires heated enough for some solder to run, but not the whole wire. And you've applied heat for a long time to the wiring which does some damage. I have a pair of 100-year old bolt cutters, the jaws are all chewed up and it doesn't close all the way. In fact the jaws have grooves of different sizes. What a tremendous torque I can get with that monster! I use it for crimping the large wires (guess what, I'm not a pro, I just make do...) And did you subtract the internal resistance of the meter when you tested the ground? I know with mine, when I test with the probes together I get a 0.8 ohm resistance...so I have to subtract that from any resistance measurement I make with it. ------------- Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.
Posted By: /R7
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 12:09 PM
ah, forgot about the subtraction, of the internal resistance, so i could be a bit lower.
i think when i get my car back (or maybe right now) i'll get a propane torch and try it again. i was using a friggin gun last night to heat it up, what a dope i am.
the crimping idea sounds alot easier though - and more efficent if properlly crimped, i can get some very powerful crimping tools from my dads shop, i may as well try that first.
Appreciate the input guys :-)
Posted By: promodeepcycle
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 12:21 PM
well first of all for 40$ you can get car audio 4awg.. but if you dont want to do that ..i can understand.....i guess.. ok at your local hardware shop you need to look in the elect. section..... "large copper 4 awg crimp type barrel" basically a butt connector and solder flux and solder.. and a propane torch if you dont have 1 .. now to crimp the connector use a hammer and go to town then grab a punch or something of that nature.. now dont drive the punch thru it just make an good indentation now peel back the insulation and heat up the wire AND connector.. brush some flux on it and start dumping in solder.. great connection...ok not great but it will work..
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dont be a pet monkey ..use your dmm
Posted By: forbidden
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 1:40 PM
Crappy tire has a bitchin butane torch for like $20.00 and cans of butane are hella cheap. This thing works awesome, I use it for all my larger wire connections when I solder my ends onto my wire. It is a little blue bugger, only about 5" tall. Use it to jump start my crappy Snap-On butane soldering iron. I would agree that unless you had a monster soldering iron, like a relly old old old did I mention old school Weller D550 soldering iron, that you probably did not reach the inner strands of wire in that connection. I would cut it out and redo the connection with the proper torch. Solder the battery termination on as well. Use a 60/40 rosin core type solder for good results.
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Top Secret, I can tell you but then my wife will kill me.
Posted By: Muffinman
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 1:50 PM
You can have a battery shop make a new Clamp that has all the wires Pressure crimped. Install all you grounds to battery and then take it up there for them to crimp. The 1 ohm or less ground is ok. If you have to make a splice go by a electric supply house. They have barrel clamps, Just install your wire in each end and clamp it. Use Heat shrink to cover it. They have a Black cover over solid copper.
Posted By: /R7
Date Posted: September 10, 2004 at 4:44 PM
im sittin @ a internet cafe` right now waiting on my car, asked the guys to put a connector onto the end of my 4guage wire, hopefully it will be thinner and i can thread the bolt back on the battery *crosses fingers*
Im thinkin of gettin one of those butane torches now that you mentioned it forbidden, but i'll have to wait till i get some $$$. come to think of it, i could probably find more than a few uses for it.
thanks for all the input everyone, learnin alot here, i'll let you know what happen(s/ed) when im done.
Peace
Posted By: /R7
Date Posted: September 11, 2004 at 1:43 AM
in short (will describe it tomorrow), im very very pleased, and i'll just say that i havent head banged to music this hard for a long time, no less in my car.
<3
Posted By: delphidoc
Date Posted: September 12, 2004 at 4:55 PM
stevdart wrote:
And did you subtract the internal resistance of the meter when you tested the ground? I know with mine, when I test with the probes together I get a 0.8 ohm resistance...so I have to subtract that from any resistance measurement I make with it.
I recently bought a Rat Shack DMM (on sale). https://www.radioshack.com/product.asp?catalog%5Fname=CTLG&category%5Fname=CTLG%5F011%5F008%5F002%5F000&product%5fid=22%2D816 When I press the leads together hard enough the resistance shows to be 0.0. Is this DMM subtracting its own internal resistance before displaying a number? -------------
Posted By: delphidoc
Date Posted: September 12, 2004 at 11:38 PM
Never mind that last post. It read 0.0 for a few seconds, then it showed 0.3. My bad. -------------
Posted By: Ravendarat
Date Posted: September 13, 2004 at 12:03 PM
I have one of those weller guns. I will die with that damn thing.
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double-secret reverse-osmosis speaker-cone-induced high-level interference distortion, Its a killer
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