Diode Type Battery Isolator Wiring?
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Motorcycle Electronics
Forum Discription: Installing Stereos, Alarms, Remote Starters, Lights, Garage Door Openers and other electronics on motorcycles.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=120865
Printed Date: April 20, 2024 at 9:44 AM
Topic: Diode Type Battery Isolator Wiring?
Posted By: blkrzr
Subject: Diode Type Battery Isolator Wiring?
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 12:58 AM
It's not really a motorcycle it's a 2009 Polaris RZR UTV but anyway my problem is I'm trying to install a diode type isolator and want my starting (stock) battery completely isolated from my accessories battery (odyssey for hids, led bar, heater fan, etc.) My problem is the RZR won't charge without an acc power connected to it and then when I turn on one of my accessories it can draw from the stock starting battery freely and potentially allowing me to kill both batteries. Is there anyway to completely isolate the batteries so my stocker is just starting, and other oem functions, and the odyssey does all the extras and still allow both to charge. Thanks in advance.
Replies:
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 6:18 AM
Are you sure you have a diode type isolator? How many large terminals are on the isolator? Is it round or rectangular in shape? Does it have cooling fins?
Posted By: oldspark
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 7:13 AM
I reckon diode isolators are bad.
Although I have posted the equivalent circuit here on 12volt, for recent criticisms on diode isolators, see mp3car's 2nd car battery - cut the crap and go straight to post #14. (LOL)
Of course that is my criticism based on various reasons that have been discussed before....
But as nst6563 says in " Aux. Battery oops" as linked in the above link...
" the surepower documentation states that my alternator is "not compatible with battery isolators"...."
... his surepower being a diode battery isolator and his alternator presumable a single wire "D+" alternator.
[And the above quotes statement wrong - it should be " the surepower documentation states that my alternator is "not compatible with diode type battery isolators"...."
RTVs etc may not have charge lamps, but as I say wherever, that charge-lamp circuit relay is EXACTLY the same as most other "smart isolators" that use relays (solenoids, contactors) except that they use a voltage sensing circuit INSTEAD of the D+ or L charge-lamp circuit.
I reckon a simple MW728 "Battery Guardian" or "Protector" low-voltage cutoff can replace the D+ or L charge-lamp circuitry in such cases.
Hence get a couple of MW728s and a couple of 100A or 200A contactors also for $20 each and have an $80 system with minimal heat and losses with a complete set of spares. IE - "off the shelf" products. (I can't recall the 200A relays/contactors, but they were here on the 12volt and I was bluddy impressed when I saw them... ~$20; ~200A continuous; an indirect name = BW (Borg-Warner?) - bluddy mad cow disease!
If you need more, please ask. I have been too influenced by my idols on this forum.... though I admit is it merely $2 Chardonnay.....
(I'm only imitating the circumstance, not their class! Nor taste. hic..)
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 3:55 PM
i am an idiot wrote:
Are you sure you have a diode type isolator? How many large terminals are on the isolator? Is it round or rectangular in shape? Does it have cooling fins?
Yeah it's a diode type isolator for sure and it works fine itself my problem is the vehicle. I need to have a acc, keyed power, connected to my voltage regulator, stator output, or it will not send a charge at all so I need to know is there anyway I can have an acc powered wire without allowing the starting battery from discharging into the 2nd battery? Thanks
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:08 PM
On a diode isolator, there are only 3 large connections. One is input into the isolator, that would be the wire that comes from the stator, and connected to the original battery. You need to remove that wire from the battery and connect it to the center connection, of the isolator. Then connect one of the outer terminals back to the stock battery. Then connect the other outer terminal to the secondary battery. You should not have to disconnect any other wires from the vehicle. On a diode isolator, the second battery can not draw current from the main battery, no matter what you do.
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:21 PM
Yes this is what I have done.
My stator goes to the voltage regulator, then though 2 wired to the starter solenoid. Also connected to that post on the solenoid is an acc power and my stock battery. The acc power has to be there to start the engine and to charge. So I ran another acc power to connect to the voltage regulator output to the correct post on the diode. Without the acc power connected to the voltage reg output I don't get any charge at all. When it is connected I get voltage drop on both batteries no matter what I turn on.
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:27 PM
If the stator and the battery are both connected to the starter solenoid, You need to disconnect the stator from the solenoid and connect the wire from the stator to the center connection of the isolator. Then connect one of the outer connections of the isolator to the battery or to the solenoid (whichever is easier to get to). Leave the accessory wire where it is. You just have to have the isolator between the stator and the battery.
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:31 PM
If I don't have the acc connected to my stator out put I don't get a charge going anywhere, it just reads nothing on the meter. And I do have the other 2 posts connected to the batteries.
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:33 PM
When you move the charge wire from the solenoid to the isolator, move the accessory wire too. I do not see how that will make a difference, there will only be 1/2 volt difference between the 2 points. When I said leave the acc wire where it is, I should have said to leave it where it was originally connected. The wire that comes out of the regulator should connect to the center terminal of the isolator. And only to the center terminal of the isolator.
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:35 PM
If I don't have an acc on the solenoid the engine doesn't start
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:45 PM
Leave acc there. Disconnect the wire that comes from the regulator (the larger wire) from the solenoid. Leave the acc wire on the solenoid. Connect wire from regulator to center of iso. Wire from one of the other connections of the isolator to the solenoid. Same place you just removed the larger wire from.
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:48 PM
The acc wire will not allow the accessories to draw current from your main battery. Just connect it to the original connection point.
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 5:55 PM
Ok I'll go try that
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 6:00 PM
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 6:08 PM
i am an idiot wrote:
That is exactly what I have done
Posted By: oldspark
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 7:56 PM
Rhetorical question - but just to confirm - this is a fixed rotor - ie, a dumping or stator system.... the voltage regulator dumps (or passes) the heavy current from the stator (and hence is heatsinked etc)??
(It obviously is going by the wiring diagrams. And many RVs like snowbikes, outboards & marines seem to use the same.)
Posted By: blkrzr
Date Posted: March 22, 2010 at 8:52 PM
yes that is correct and I just ran out to make sure but yes the diagram is how I've got it done. I don't understand why it won't charge without the acc power.
Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: March 24, 2010 at 4:55 PM
Connect the acc wire to where it was initially connected. It will make no difference if it is a diode type isolator. If it were a solenoid type isolator, then yes having the coil of the isolator connected to the acc terminal could leave you stranded. It will make NO DIFFERENCE on a diode type isolator.
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