1987 mazda rx-7, python 991
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=122139
Printed Date: June 02, 2024 at 9:53 AM
Topic: 1987 mazda rx-7, python 991
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Subject: 1987 mazda rx-7, python 991
Date Posted: June 04, 2010 at 3:37 AM
Hi guys,
I'm new to wiring car security up, but I have done car stereos before.
I have a few questions on the wiring of the python 991 in specific.
I am using the vehicle wiring diagram supplied by the 12volt.
First of all, are many of the wires on the alarm harness not used because of the feature not being needed? For example, on the auxiliary harness H2, the Aux 1 output and Aux 2 output are not used for a regular car alarm install?
The car in question is a 1987 mazda rx-7 with DEI 524 door lock actuators installed.
Secondly I am going to run through the harness and see if I have this correct:
H1/1: trunk release output = not used because i have a manual trunk release
H1/2: constant 12v (+) input = used
H1/3: siren output (+) = used because I need some sound for the alarm
H1/4: light flash - isolation wire- = I'm not sure about this. I have the installation diagram but I don't know what it means by lightswitch and control module in the car? Can anyone elaborate?
H1/5: chassis ground = used
H1/6: (+) door trigger input = used because my door trigger is a positive input
H1/7: trunk pin/instant trigger input = not used??? What does this do?
H1/8: (-) door trigger input = not used because door trigger is positive
H1/9: 200mA dome light output = used if i want the dome light to turn on when i lock and unlock the car??? Can anyone help me??? Uses a relay correct?? Which one and where can I buy it?
H1/10: turbo timer/remote start activation input = used if i need the turbo timer to work, but where and how do i wire this?
H1/11: parking light output = used and connected to parking light
H1/12: 500mA ground when armed output = used but where do i connect this to??
AUXILIARY HARNESS
H2/1: (-) factory alarm disarm output = not used
H2/2: (-) factory alarm output = not used
H2/3: (-) 200mA aux 1 output = not used?? what is this for??
H2/4: (-) 200mA aux 2 output = not used, same as above?
H2/5: (-) 200mA aux 3 output = not used, same as above?
H2/6: (-) 200mA 2nd unlock output = used if i want to be able to push the unlock button twice to unlock all the doors and push once for just the driver door?
H2/7: (-) disel wait to start input = not used?? only for diesel engines??
H2/8: (-) horn honk output = used if i don't want to use the siren?
HEAVY GAUGE 10-PIN CONNECTOR
H3/1: ignition 1 input/output = used
H3/2: (+) fused ignition 2 = used
H3/3: accessory output = used
H3/4: starter output = used (in between the starter input and output right?)
H3/5: starter input = used but going to the ignition switch?
H3/6: (+) (30A) fused ignition relay 1 input = Not sure what to do with this!
H3/7: (+) ignition 2 flex relay output = Not sure what to do with this!
H3/8: 87a of ignition 2 flex relay = Not sure what to do with this!
H3/9: (+) (30A) fused accessory/starter relay input = Not sure what to do with this!
REMOTE START INPUT
1: neutral safety switch input = used for remote start, but is the e-brake wire ok to use?
2: tachometer input wire = used for remote start
3: (+) brake shutdown wire = used for remote start
4: N/0 or N/C (-) hood pin switch input = used, connected to a hoodpin switch?
5: (-200) mA 2nd status/rear defogger = Not necessary to be connected, but will activate rear defroster?
REMOTE START AUXILIARY OUPUT
Harness not necessary unless additional accessories are added that require a remote start to activate it??
DOOR LOCK WIRE DIAGRAMS
Since I am using the DEI 524 N actuators, I will use a "Type D" using a DEI 451M relay.
Sorry for the very long post, but I want to be very thorough for this install. I have always been a little intimidated to install a car security, not because of my soldering abilities, but because I might not be able to locate the right wires.
Thanks a TON in advance.
Replies:
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 04, 2010 at 3:39 AM
can a mod please change the title to "Help me with a car alarm install?" thanks!
Posted By: the12volt
Date Posted: June 04, 2010 at 8:20 AM
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 04, 2010 at 2:49 PM
ahh, ok sorry these forum rules are a little more different than standard forums.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 05, 2010 at 5:35 AM
can anyone please advise?
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: June 06, 2010 at 7:27 AM
on the h1 harness, eliminate the parking light isolation wire you don't need it!
Are you sure that car is positive trigger?
For the dome light you need a single pole single throw relay or single pole double throw, doesn't matter any will do fine!
No need for the Ground when armed wire, the unit has built in immobiliser, (unless you're using it to wind up windows or something)
The turbo timer input eliminate this as well
All the heavy gauge reds go to 12 volts constant
The pink/black flex relay input, eliminate this!
------------- COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: June 06, 2010 at 9:30 AM
make sure you test your wires !
------------- Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 5:48 AM
The car has a negative door trigger.
So, is the dome light supervision wire necessary or not?
I want to have the turbo timer functional on this unit so I need to keep the tuber timer input wire. But I don't know what to do with it. Can any of you help? Also I found on this page the ground when armed output on the factory harness but I don't know if I should wire it or not, should I? Or should I leave it cut?
So, on the H1 harness, can I cut the trunk release output, the light flash isolation wire, the positive door trigger input, trunk pin/instant trigger input?
How would I go about testing the wiores for something like ignition 1 / 2 starter output?
Thanks in advance.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 4:12 PM
The trunk pin wire (blue, H1/7) connect this to trunk light trigger, microswitch) in hatch lid catch otherwise, if someone forced the trunk lid, you've no protection. On that model you have to wire back to the trunk lid catch. Cut the others.
Don't need light isolation wire.
Dome light BLACK/ white to relay 85, constant 12V+ 5amp fused to 86, ground to 87 and 30 to to green door trigger wire.
H1/10 WHITE/ blue turbo timer wire to relay 85, 30amp fused constant to 86 and 87, 30 to your ignition input/output wire. Programme that wire for approx 1 1/2 mins.
H1/12 only required with window closers.
Ignore H2/3 6 and 7.
H/3, 4 & 5 YES
H3/6 to battery.
H3/7 and 8 Do you have a second ignition wire? H3/9 to battery.
1) Yes
2)Use tach line on inst. panel for this.
3 to side of brake switch that goes 12v+ when brake pedal is depressed.
4 Yes as n/o when hood is closed (goes to ground when hood is opened,
absolutely mandatory with a remote start.
5 Probably need to feed an outboard relay which is connected to the hot window power side.
Rem start aux output..correct.
Locks. are you using a dedicated relay with them? If not use the 451.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 5:22 PM
What do you mean by the hatch lid catch?
Are you saying I need additional relays (purchased elsewhere like radio shack) for the dome light, and turbo timer??
What do you mean by a second ignition wire?
Also for the 451m, what do you connect the purple fused wire to? Do you connect it to a constant 12v or do you connect it to a switched 12 v?? I have the green and the blue wires on both actuators connected in parallel connected to the 451m and I have the other wires connected to the ground, but I haven't connected the purple wire yet because I am unsure if it needs to go to a constant 12v or a switched 12v.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 5:41 PM
since i cannot edit, i forgot to ask one more thing.
when you mean feed an onboard relay which is connected to hot power window side, what do you mean by this?
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 5:44 PM
ack,
also forgot to ask.
where do i buy the relay, and do you have a link to what I need to buy by chance?
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 5:47 PM
The questions you asked, I don't know how to put this diplomatically but your knowledge base just isn't enough to do this job.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 6:43 PM
I am new to installing a car security alarm, and I must start somewhere. Any advice and input to helping me is much appreciated.
If by second ignition, you mean the 12v supplied when in ignition 2 position, then I understand it.
And for the relays, I found a 12 volt 30 amp relay, but not a 12 volt 5 amp relay.
I am still unsure whether or not the 451m purple positive power wire connects to a constant or switched 12v.
I appreciate your help thus far.
Posted By: catback
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 9:14 PM
howie ll wrote:
H1/10 WHITE/ blue turbo timer wire to relay 85, 30amp fused constant to 86 and 87, 30 to your ignition input/output wire. Programme that wire for approx 1 1/2 mins.
I hate to question your fine expertise but H1/10 is a remote start activation INPUT
But I concur, 19rxseven87 you really need someone there to guide you. Trying to learn going this route is akin to trying to teach someone, who knows nothing about planes, to fly a boeing 747 by texting questions and answers.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 09, 2010 at 10:12 PM
I agree that I need someone to guide me, this is why I have a list of questions in hopes of people to answer my questions to guide me. There isn't much else I can do since my options where I live are limited to who I think can do a professional job with soldering, and shortening wires, using loom, etc. I absolutely hate it when "professionals" who get paid money to do this sort of job cuts corners to save time IE: just wrapping the wires and zip tying it instead of cutting it and shortening it. Or leaving wires exposed where I would prefer them to be loomed and hidden or blended in.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 1:45 AM
Catback, sorry about that, only excuse is that these units (and their Clifford and Viper clones) aren't available in Europe, I've never seen one!
Use an aux lead for the turbo timer.
RX7 you seem determined and smart enough to have a go and your soldering and looming up comments tell me you are prepared to have a go in a thorough way, so:-
All the relays you are likely to come across will be 4 or 5 terminal "Bosch" type; fuses are external so you use all the same type of relay, just different fuse capacities. Read the relay section on this site for some good background and advice. All automotive relays have the same ISO terminal markings, some you will buy are 5 terminal, in your case ignore 87a.
Constant 12v+ for 451, it's expected to work when you are remote from the car, think it through.
The hot window refers to what we call a hot window or heated front or rear window, a (comparatively) thick wire provides the pos.power. Since your aux outputs put out a low current neg, you need to provide a relay.
Having said that test as follows:-
Turn on your ignition, turn on rear window defog. Turn off ign, then on again. If switch stays illuminated or active, all you need to do is turn it on the night before, it will activate automatically with the R/S. Provided you've activated all the ignition loom leads.
One other thing, on a car of this age, I wouldn't trust some of the internal grounding points, take all constant 12v+ and grounds to the battery and ALL required fuses at the battery. Another reason for the hood switch!
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 1:47 AM
Hi guys,
Is the 451M relay module supposed to be wired like this to 2 of the DEI 524N 2-wire actuators?
WHITE/ black soldered together with BROWN / black to chassis ground
GREEN/ black to green wire of actuator
blue/black to blue wire of actuator
purple to constant 12volt
Also, are diodes required to isolate current when the 2 of the actuators are wired in parallel? IE:
green wire of actuator 1 -------\
======== GREEN/ black wire of 451M
green wire of actuator 2 -------/
Thanks in advance.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 6:45 AM
We've met before haven't we!
Yes to the first question, no to the second, what difference would diodes make apart from the fact that you would need 7-10 amp diodes rather than the normal 1 amp diodes which you will need to run across the coils on the relays you will be using for your Python.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 1:40 PM
Hehe,
Thanks again Howie.
As for the t&t tech comment, he said I should connect all heavy gauge reds to the battery (+), does he mean the RED / white, re/black and red wire? Also, no the car does not have an Ignition II position, after the Ignition I the car will start if I push the key further, so do I still have to connect the pink/white wire? t&t tech also said to eliminate the pink/black input, is this true?
For the hatch lid catch, I am unsure of where you are talking about, the hatch light uses a switched positive current to turn it on instead of a negative current, so where do I connect the trunk pin input? I have an extra hood pin from before, can I install this as a trunk pin input?
I am getting closer to finishing this, thanks guys! Thanks for not losing faith in me :D,
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 3:07 PM
T&T is absolutely right, I edited a post but said the same thing giving reasons.
The tail light should be NEG. switched, never known ANY Jap to use any other method, open the hatch, right in the centre lower section is where the lock mechanism sits, open the panel covering it and you will see
1 wire coming from it that's the one and it's NEG when the hatch is opened.
Your going about this all wrong. Ign 2 isn't a position on the key, it's a second wire that tests live (or goes HOT) when the key is in the ignition position, it dumps i.e. goes cold on cranking. Used for accessories such as heater, AC control, defog which aren't part of the ignition/start system. Test the ignition loom.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: June 10, 2010 at 4:57 PM
QUOTE {As for the t&t tech comment, he said I should connect all heavy gauge reds to the battery (+), does he mean the RED / white, re/black and red wire? } QUOTE
Yes! Along with the red on the h1 harness!
QUOTE {Also, no the car does not have an Ignition II position, after the Ignition I the car will start if I push the key further, so do I still have to connect the pink/white wire?} QUOTE
This wire will go live on the ignition position along with the true ignition wire! It isn't a mandatory connection on that vintage but it may control things that you would like to have on with the R/S!
QUOTE {t&t tech also said to eliminate the pink/black input, is this true?} QUOTE
Yes!
QUOTE {For the hatch lid catch, I am unsure of where you are talking about, the hatch light uses a switched positive current to turn it on instead of a negative current, so where do I connect the trunk pin input? I have an extra hood pin from before, can I install this as a trunk pin input?} QUOTE
You could use the method you mentioned, but i'm betting the little dignity that i have left, that is negative switched! ------------- COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 11, 2010 at 3:15 AM
when you say the heavy gauge red wires connect to the battery, does it have to be the battery directly, or can it be to something like a 10 gauge constant 12 v?
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 11, 2010 at 5:08 AM
NO! The bloody battery and I think from your replies you're assuming not testing.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 11, 2010 at 2:17 PM
Hey Howie,
I am absolutely positively 100% testing my wires before I solder them in place to make 100% sure that I have the correct wires.
So the heavy gauge red wires have to be soldered to the battery directly instead of a constant 12volt?
I don't understand why the heavy gauge red have to be soldered to the battery INSTEAD of the constant 12volt, can you explain why?
Thanks!
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 11, 2010 at 5:00 PM
If you are testing them, why did you tell us there wasn't an ignition ll because "the key goes to ign 1 then start" we meant the ignition loom so test that and test your hatch wire it goes neg when you open the trunk, not pos as you stated. I've already posted why you should go to the battery including the ground lead on a car of this age. You don't solder to the battery wires, you use M6 ring terminals, also fuse the lives within 4" (10cms) of the battery.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 11, 2010 at 7:56 PM
What I was referring to as Ignition II is a position in the key after Ignition I. Also, as for the trunk wire, I was testing the trunk light, as I am not sure where the negatively switched wire is at.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 12, 2010 at 2:56 AM
And if you'd read the alarm instructions or any other post you would realise that IGN ll is a circuit going hot on ignition that goes dead on cranking if you have more than 4 wires to your ignition switch look and TEST.
You will have 2 wires at the hatch light, one should be a constant 12v+, whether hatch is open or closed, it's the other you want.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: June 12, 2010 at 7:17 PM
Just follow howie! We're going in circles here! At the trunk light there are two wires put the a probe on each wire, when you get a positive 12volt reading connect the trunk trigger to the wire the negative (black) probe is on!
-------------
COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 12, 2010 at 7:39 PM
Howie,
You are absolutely right, I missed some of the advice that you had given me. Most of the time I was reading it, it was about 2 am + and I had very little sleep the night prior.
For the relay for the domelight, since the door trigger wire is negative, shouldn't the relay 87 wire be to a ground, not a constant 12v?
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 15, 2010 at 10:22 PM
help? polarity means whatever polarity the door trigger wire is, you connect to the battery right?
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 16, 2010 at 12:06 AM
is the ignition II wire the same as the starter wire???
i'm so close to getting this done, and appreciate all the input thus far!
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 16, 2010 at 12:14 AM
Hi guys,
Installing a security system/remote start and I have a question.
What is the difference between the Ignition 2 wire and the Starter wire on a 1987 mazda rx-7? On this car, there is no "Ignition 2" position on the ignition switch. Is the ignition 2 wire and the starter wire the same wire? And if so, since I have to cut the starter wire, which side of the starter wire do I connect the Ignition 2 wire from the alarm wiring?
Thanks.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 16, 2010 at 3:03 PM
well, the security part of the system is connected and there are a couple things that dont work.
first off, the dome light doesn't turn on when the alarm is disarmed/doors unlocked. why is this? i have the relay connected and the polarity is negative since the door trigger is negative.
secondly, the alarm will go off if the car is unlocked but the alarm is not disarmed, but i am still able to start the car with the alarm blaring. why is this? i have the starter wires cut and split to the alarm. i have the pink/white wire (ignition 2) connected to the vehicle side of the starter wire (connected with the purple wire) and the green wire connected to the key side.
i'd be willing to paypal some cash to someone if they are able to help me finish this install.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: June 26, 2010 at 2:44 AM
well,
the car alarm will still go off and the car will still be able to be started. does this have anything to do with the fact that my car can start without the clutch depressed for some reason? the DEI support told me that the only wires affecting the starter kill is the violet and green wires.
Can anyone please help? I've been having a ton of bad luck and no one is willing to help me any further.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 26, 2010 at 3:47 AM
Disconnect the pink/white from the purple.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: July 19, 2010 at 3:34 AM
I didn't have the pink/white wire connected to the purple.
I am still having problems with the alarm, still being able to start the car with the alarm blaring.
I checked the voltage using a multimeter and neither key side nor starter side gets power when the key is in "ON" or IGN1 position. The starter will only receive power when the key is turned to start the car. If I disconnect the key side of the starter wire, nothing happens. If I disconnect the starter side of the starter wire, nothing happens. If I connected everything like it's supposed to be, the car starts.
BUT now, when the alarm goes off, I can still turn the key and the car will still start.
I've already changed the brain 2 different times and still, the same problem.
Any ideas?
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: July 20, 2010 at 11:41 AM
well, i guess i'll just connect an external relay, since the onboard relay doesnt seem to be working.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: July 22, 2010 at 3:09 PM
well i figured out why the car will still starting.
when the car starts, the ignition loses power. and thus making it an unenergized coil and therefore the relay makes it so the car can start.
i have tried looping the wire for the starter wire, that way the relay is always energized whenever the car is started, however the relay makes a loud buzzing sound.
is there anyway to get around this? the relay makes a loud buzzing sound and heats up, but the car doesnt start.
any help would be much appreciative.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: July 23, 2010 at 5:39 PM
I was thinking you connected the wrong igniton wire to start with but was too lazy to go through the entire thread! LOL! You have the wrong ignition wire, which is why your starter kill on the xcrs was not functioning properly to start with! The true ignition wire does not drop out during cranking look for a wire that does that and oof you go!
-------------
COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: July 23, 2010 at 6:34 PM
And so back to my post MONTHS ago about testing ALL the wires at the ignition.
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: July 27, 2010 at 2:47 AM
Guys,
I did test the connections, and even looked at factory service manual AND the haynes service manual. Both of them told me I had the correct wire. The color matched, and so did the voltage.
I don't mean any disrespect to you guys, but I did follow your advice.
What wire could have power during the "ON" position but lose power when cranking?
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: July 27, 2010 at 3:22 AM
Accessory or Ignition 2.
-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: July 27, 2010 at 6:52 PM
Just to add howard as i learned a couple months ago right here igniton wires all read the same! So it would be only accesory wires that drop out during cranking! ------------- COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: July 27, 2010 at 7:30 PM
Nooooo...Ignition 2 except on Peugeot/Citroens and some GM will dump and the acc on BMWs and Porsche stays live.
-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: July 28, 2010 at 6:33 AM
That's what i know from being an installer, but i was corrected by a fellow 12 volter, or was I?
-------------
COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: July 28, 2010 at 8:25 AM
Me? I hope not.
-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: July 28, 2010 at 8:12 PM
No! Not you howard!
-------------
COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF.
PSALMS 37:5
Posted By: 19rxseven87
Date Posted: August 02, 2010 at 5:06 PM
last question, i promise, but does the defroster wire from the alarm connect to the output wire from the switch or to the output from the switch to the relay?
there are two outputs from the switch in my FSM. one to a relay, and one directly to the defroster.
both connect to the defroster one way or another. i think the relay is just so that when it is pushed, it wont stay on forever (is timed, i think)
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: August 02, 2010 at 5:34 PM
Aux from alarm to relay set up as latched, to 85
Ignition from alarm's pink to 86
Constant 12v+ fused at 20amps to 87 join 30 to thick wire to rear defogger.
-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
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