car won’t start, viper 5701
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=127503
Printed Date: May 13, 2024 at 8:04 PM
Topic: car won’t start, viper 5701
Posted By: delta333
Subject: car won’t start, viper 5701
Date Posted: May 30, 2011 at 10:05 PM
My car won't start after installing a Viper 5701 Alarm with remote start. The alarm is fully functional but when I try to start the car with the remote or key, the starter doesn't even crank. The alarm involves interrupting the starter wire and the wire going into the brain has 12 volts when the key is turned to start but the wire starter output wire is not getting voltage so I believe the brain is not sending the signal. To bypass that temporarily I have unplugged the harness and jumped pin 4 to pin 5 and after doing that the car starts with the key just fine. I did not use pin 2,8, and 9. The car is a 99 Explorer and I'm using a PKALL bypass module and any help or input would be appreciated.
Replies:
Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: May 30, 2011 at 11:34 PM
Sounds like the internal relay is bad. With no power on the unit there should be 0 ohms between the green starter wire and the violet starter wire. If that connection is open the car won't crank.
Take it back to the place that installed it and have them swap the brain for a new one.
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Kevin Pierson
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 4:15 AM
X 2 with K.P. not uncommon and relates to our comments on the other post ref, end of days for DEI.
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: kreg357
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 6:58 AM
X 3 with above, ohm test the Vipers' internal starter relay.
Some more thoughts...
Is it possible you have H3/4 and H3/5 reversed?
Why isn't H3/9 connected to +12v constant?
If installed on a 99 Explorer, most wiring guides list a BLACK/ Light Green wire at the ignition switch. Bulldog lists this wire as IGN2 but DEI lists it as ACC2. Test this wire to determine which it is, ACC or IGN circuit. Program the Viper accordingly and connect H3/7 to this BLACK/ Light Green wire. Also connect H3/2 to +12v constant to power the Flex relay. ------------- Soldering is fun!
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 10:10 AM
I will check my relay, but first I'll solder the RED / black to a 12v constant, because if it powers the starter relay, that would explain why the relay isn't activating.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 8:18 PM
Well i went out and connected H3/2 and H3/9 to +12v constant and can confirm H3/7 is soldered to the BLACK/ Light Green wire, still no luck. i will be checking the relay next. It is possibility the relay as I bought the unit manufacturer refurbished.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 9:09 PM
Well I opened up the brain and this is what I'm looking at.
[IMG]https://i54.tinypic.com/29biz4o.jpg[/IMG]
When I test where H3/4 and H3/5 connect I get a reading of 0.6 ohms. Does this mean the relay is bad?
[IMG]https://i55.tinypic.com/1zd64q8.jpg[/IMG]
Posted By: kreg357
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 9:46 PM
Do you need starter kill / anti-grind? As a test you could re-connect the explorers cut starter wire and just connect the Viper H3/4 Violet wire to it. Don't use H3/5. The key start will still work. Then try a remote start.
Has the remote start ever worked? Is the Neutral Safety wire connected properly, etc?
I measured some loose 30/40 Amp SPDT relays, Pin 30 to 87A, they measured .1 Ohms. (Fluke 77)
------------- Soldering is fun!
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 10:22 PM
I'm not sure what starter kill/anti-grind is, I had thought about doing what you suggest with the starter wire but i wasn't sure what function(s) I would lose by bypassing the internal starter relay. I have not ever gotten the remote start to work or even programmed as when all the harnesses were connected the key wouldn't even start the vehicle. The neutral wire is connected and in the on position but the neutral safety (-) input wire has no connection made, I believe this is at least part of my problem because when looking at the install guide it says it must be connected to a ground source for the remote start to work. So I will ground that wire and hopefully that will fix it.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: May 31, 2011 at 11:02 PM
Well unfirtunately after grounding the neutral safety switch there's still no start. I can try your bypass method tomorrow if I still have no luck. Thanks.
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: June 02, 2011 at 9:46 AM
can you verify that you hooked 12V up to the Red, RED / White and RED / Black primary wires?? these are needed to power all XCRS relays....
------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: buddholly
Date Posted: June 04, 2011 at 12:16 PM
Well guys, if it's not going to start with the key then that would be the first issue I would address. I would eliminate the start wires on the Viper all together and just connect it back to original and try to start the vehicle by key. If it doesn't start then you have an issue.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 17, 2011 at 2:46 PM
All three wires are are connected to 12v and it when the alarm is bypassed the car starts with the key.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 17, 2011 at 3:30 PM
Either your by-pass is faulty or incorrectly wired. did you take your tach off the by-pass?
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 17, 2011 at 3:43 PM
I have not removed the tach but I thought if the bypass was the problem the starter would crank but not start. When I press the remote start button, the car makes the sound like there is a key in the ignition and I hear a relay clicking on and off several times. That's all that happens.
Posted By: smokeman1
Date Posted: June 17, 2011 at 8:32 PM
Do you get any flashing lights from the parking lights? If so, how many flashes?
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Posted By: buddholly
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 10:39 AM
So it won't start with the key either right?
Don't get why you guys are all still trying to figure out why the car won't remote start when it won't even start with the key.
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Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 11:00 AM
Bud, read an earlier post, from delta, says that "when alarm is by-passed the car starts with the key"
Could delta please explain what's meant by "by-passed"? I still think the problem is in whatever immobiliser bypass and the fact that tach hasn't been programmed.
The FIRST post mentioned running with the starter engaged. That's no tach right there.
-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 11:50 AM
The car starts with the key when pin H3/4 is jumped to H3/5. This essentially bypasses the alarm's internal starter relay and re connects the starter wire as I had to cut the starter wire to install the alarm. The parking lights flash 7 times when I press the remote start button. The unit is a PKALL and the alarm install guide said the tach did not need to be used being that it was an auto trans, Is the wire you're referring to the "(-) While Running (status)" wire on the PKALL unit?
Posted By: kreg357
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 12:04 PM
kreg357 wrote:
Do you need starter kill / anti-grind? As a test you could re-connect the explorers cut starter wire and just connect the Viper H3/4 Violet wire to it. Don't use H3/5. The key start will still work. Then try a remote start.
Has the remote start ever worked? Is the Neutral Safety wire connected properly, etc?
I measured some loose 30/40 Amp SPDT relays, Pin 30 to 87A, they measured .1 Ohms. (Fluke 77)
If the Starter Kill / Anti-Grind circuit ( Viper internal relay ) isn't working properly see paragraph 1 above.
Seven blinks means you are in Manual Tranmission mode. See programming for Menu 3, Item 1, Opt 2 for an autotrans vehicle. ------------- Soldering is fun!
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 12:16 PM
Look again at what KP and I posted on the 30th. and 31st. of May.
Then add it what Kreg just posted, do you see what we are getting at?
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 18, 2011 at 12:26 PM
Well i tested the starter relay with an ohm meter and got 0.6 ohms with no power going to the unit. I have tried to put the alarm in auto mode but if it did not work I will definitely try to do that again.
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 20, 2011 at 8:00 PM
Well I'm having an odd problem trying to put it into auto mode. When I cycle the ignition on and off the alarm chirps once (don't know why) and then it doesnt matter how long I hold the valet switch it won't do anything and then once I release is it stays solid blue until I press it again. (Note this was after i came out to find the battery completely dead for an unknown reason.)
Posted By: smokeman1
Date Posted: June 20, 2011 at 8:22 PM
Try pressing the F button twice on the remote and then press the unlock button. The solid blue light should go out. Seems to indicate the the unit is in valet mode.
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Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 20, 2011 at 8:29 PM
Well I got out of valet mode, thanks for that. I went and put it in auto mode (or I think I did). I did everything the instructions said and it seemed like it worked but when I press the remote start button the alarm instantly buzzes and the function LED lights up, the parking lights still flash seven times as well.
Posted By: kreg357
Date Posted: June 20, 2011 at 8:32 PM
Got the Door Trigger(s) connected? Needed for Step One of programming.
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Soldering is fun!
Posted By: delta333
Date Posted: June 20, 2011 at 8:47 PM
Yes, this is with everything connected.
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