2011 Toyota Tacoma and Viper 5706v

Hello,

My Tacoma has power lock/unlock, but no keyless entry. I'm on the first stage mapping out all my wires. I'm following this guide from Tacomaworld.
https://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/audio-video/252032-how-install-viper-5704-alarm-remote-start.html

From the Viper Wires-Doorlock Harness, there are two wires ( Blue and Black, 500mA), and they both (-) Polarity. It shows that they're connecting directly to the 2 wires from the Tacoma (GREEN/ Black and Purple). After some more reading, I found this Relay Module from Amazon "451M Door Lock Relay Module".   Do I even need that Module?

Thanks

Probably just a typo, but the Viper's 3 Pin Lock connector has 2 wires, Green ( Lock ) and Blue ( Unlock ).   You can connect them
directly to the indicated Key Cylinder wires mentioned in the RefferenceSheet.PDF from your link.  No need for a 451M Door Lock
Module.

-------------
Soldering is fun!

kreg357 wrote:

---

Probably just a typo, but the Viper's 3 Pin Lock connector has 2 wires, Green ( Lock ) and Blue ( Unlock ).   You can connect them
directly to the indicated Key Cylinder wires mentioned in the RefferenceSheet.PDF from your link.  No need for a 451M Door Lock
Module.

---

Thanks for the reply. Why would one needs a 451M Door Lock Module then? What's it function?

I also need to buy a 20mp fuse, and 20 amp inline fuse holder to wire a relay for the starter. I posted the question in that forum about the products since the link has expired. Is this what I'd need here?


https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bussmann-in-line-fuse-holder-for-atc-fuses-bp-hhd-30-rp/5171326-P?searchTerm=inline+fuse+holder

https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/bussmann-fuse-pack-20-amps-5-pack-bp-atc-20-rp/25984941-P?searchTerm=20+amp+atc+fuse

There are many different styles of door locks on vehicles.  Yours operates with a low current (-) pulse.  Some systems need
a (+) pulse, while other vehicles have a resistance based "one-wire" door lock system.  If you take a look at the 451M install
guide your will see diagrams of the various systems it can handle.

Yes, the ATC style fuse folder and fuse will work nicely for your install and will match the ones on the Viper.

-------------
Soldering is fun!

kreg357 wrote:

---

There are many different styles of door locks on vehicles.  Yours operates with a low current (-) pulse.  Some systems need
a (+) pulse, while other vehicles have a resistance based "one-wire" door lock system.  If you take a look at the 451M install
guide your will see diagrams of the various systems it can handle.

Yes, the ATC style fuse folder and fuse will work nicely for your install and will match the ones on the Viper.

---

Awesome, Thanks!!

Another question to follow up:

I'm mapping out my wires right now. I've looked at the wiring diagram for my 2011 Tacoma from this link:

https://www.S P A M.com/2011-toyota-tacoma-remote-start-wiring-guide/

and also from Bulldogsecurity website. Everything is lined up between the two site, except for one:

from Modified Life:

Automobile Second Engine Starter Wire (-): GREEN/ Black
Automobile Second Engine Starter Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness

from Bulldogsecurity:
STARTER GREEN/ BLACK (+) @ IGNITION SWITCH HARNESS, WHITE 8-PIN PLUG, PIN 7


With one stated as (-) and one stated as (+). I believe this wire needs to connect to the Violet (+) starter output from Viper. Is this going to be a problem with the discrepancy of (-) and (+)?

As you noticed, the various wire guide listings have conflicting information and sometimes flat out wrong info.  It is always
prudent to make up a wiring sheet compiled from the various available sources, noting the discrepancies, and then use a
DMM to locate and verify each wire.  From my review of the .pdf file mentioned above, that info looks accurate.  Here is a
another consistently accurate source for wire info :  https://www.readyremote.com/main.asp?make=Toyota&model=Tacoma

This is what you should find during DMM testing :
12volts WHITE/ red (30A) (+)    ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 5
Starter GREEN/ black  +            ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 7  
Second Starter             BLACK/ white  +   ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 3  
Ignition   BLACK/ red  +    ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 6  
Second Ignition            blue / YELLOW  +   ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 1  
Third Ignition       N/A       
Accessory        WHITE/ green  + ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 2

-------------
Soldering is fun!

kreg357 wrote:

---

As you noticed, the various wire guide listings have conflicting information and sometimes flat out wrong info.  It is always
prudent to make up a wiring sheet compiled from the various available sources, noting the discrepancies, and then use a
DMM to locate and verify each wire.  From my review of the .pdf file mentioned above, that info looks accurate.  Here is a
another consistently accurate source for wire info :  https://www.readyremote.com/main.asp?make=Toyota&model=Tacoma

This is what you should find during DMM testing :
12volts  WHITE/ red (30A) (+)    ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 5
Starter  GREEN/ black  +            ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 7  
Second Starter             BLACK/ white  + ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 3  
Ignition BLACK/ red  +    ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 6  
Second Ignition blue / YELLOW  + ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 1  
Third Ignition N/A       
Accessory     WHITE/ green  +  ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 2

---

30A for 12 volts WHITE/ red? What kind of DMM would measure that much current? I have a craftsman 82140, and it would measure the current up to 10A only. Is it necessary to check for the current if you can identify the voltage?

OK.  For sake of argument, we will take some information on pure faith.  As +12V professionals, the marking of "30 Amp" could
be verified several ways, some of them destructive tests.  For our purposes, we will locate that wire, verify that is shows +12V
all the time and looks to be sufficient gauge to support a 30 Amp draw.  If you had the full factory wiring diagrams for the truck,
you would find that that wire has a 30 Amp fuse on it somewhere.  The important thing is that that wire can support most of the
current needs of all the ignition circuits in that connector.  If you were adding door lock actuators and a couple of big sirens,
you might want to use another +12V constant source.  In the write-up you you are following, the OP does just that.  For his Starter2
relay he draws +12V constant from the fuse box.

The basic DMM tests to locate & verify vehicle wires goes like this :
When testing for a wire that is +12V, set the DMM to 20V DC, connect the Black test lead to chassis ground and use the Red test
lead to probe for the wire.  The DMM will show +12V when it finds it.  ( Ignition wires are in this category. )

When testing for a (-) type wire ( door locks are one example ), our DMM set-up is slightly different.   ( How do you measure nothing?)
In this case we connect the Red test lead to +12V constant and the Black test lead to the suspect wire.  What happens is, whenever
the suspect goes goes to (-), the DMM circuit path is completed and the DMM shows +12V.

There are additional wires that we really can't test without special test equipment, wires like the transponders TX and Code ( RX ).
For those wires, we must apply all our talents in locating the wires as per the bypass modules install guide.  Fortunately, the
bypass companies are very good at this ( except XpressKit, IMHO ).  You might have to go into full detective / deductive reasoning
mode to find the correct plug and wires, looking at various bypass module guides for the same install.  ( This is another area were
the +12V Professional earns his keep, experience and resources are very important.)  The OP has a nice picture of the transponder
plug and as long as the number of pins and wire color and pin locations match-up with the install guide, you are good to go.

-------------
Soldering is fun!

Thank you sir ! I really appreciate for all the feed back. I'll attempt with the install this weekend. I'm sure I'll have more questions follow up. Luckily, I don't need a by pass module so there will be less wire for me to solder. Thanks again.

I'm doing the installation today and a bit concern at the naming calling out on the Ignition, Ignition 2, Engine Starter , and Engine Starter 2.

Vehicle Ignition Wire (+): Blue / YELLOW
Vehicle Ignition Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness
Vehicle Second Ignition Wire (+): BLACK/ Red
Vehicle Second Ignition Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness
Vehicle Accessory Wire (+): WHITE/ Green
Vehicle Accessory Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness
Vehicle Second Accessory Wire (+): N/A
Vehicle Second Accessory Wire Location: N/A
Automobile Engine Starter Wire (+): BLACK/ White
Automobile Engine Starter Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness
Automobile Second Engine Starter Wire (-): GREEN/ Black
Automobile Second Engine Starter Wire Location: Ignition Switch Harness


As you can see above (from S P A M . com), it's calling out different from Bulldog security website and the link you provided above. It's call out Engine Starter Wire : BLACK/ White, where the link you provided call it Second Starter........ Could you help me clarify this please? I've check out the voltages, and it's all checked out, just the naming that make me uncomfortable. Thanks

kreg357 wrote:

---

OK.  For sake of argument, we will take some information on pure faith.  As +12V professionals, the marking of "30 Amp" could
be verified several ways, some of them destructive tests.  For our purposes, we will locate that wire, verify that is shows +12V
all the time and looks to be sufficient gauge to support a 30 Amp draw.  If you had the full factory wiring diagrams for the truck,
you would find that that wire has a 30 Amp fuse on it somewhere.  The important thing is that that wire can support most of the
current needs of all the ignition circuits in that connector.  If you were adding door lock actuators and a couple of big sirens,
you might want to use another +12V constant source.  In the write-up you you are following, the OP does just that.  For his Starter2
relay he draws +12V constant from the fuse box.

The basic DMM tests to locate & verify vehicle wires goes like this :
When testing for a wire that is +12V, set the DMM to 20V DC, connect the Black test lead to chassis ground and use the Red test
lead to probe for the wire.  The DMM will show +12V when it finds it.  ( Ignition wires are in this category. )

When testing for a (-) type wire ( door locks are one example ), our DMM set-up is slightly different.   ( How do you measure nothing?)
In this case we connect the Red test lead to +12V constant and the Black test lead to the suspect wire.  What happens is, whenever
the suspect goes goes to (-), the DMM circuit path is completed and the DMM shows +12V.

There are additional wires that we really can't test without special test equipment, wires like the transponders TX and Code ( RX ).
For those wires, we must apply all our talents in locating the wires as per the bypass modules install guide.  Fortunately, the
bypass companies are very good at this ( except XpressKit, IMHO ).  You might have to go into full detective / deductive reasoning
mode to find the correct plug and wires, looking at various bypass module guides for the same install.  ( This is another area were
the +12V Professional earns his keep, experience and resources are very important.)  The OP has a nice picture of the transponder
plug and as long as the number of pins and wire color and pin locations match-up with the install guide, you are good to go.

---

Connect both starter wires, use the Violet (purple) and green at H3 for BLACK/ white.
Use H2 /21 violet / YELLOW to second starter via a relay as follows:-
Violet / YELLOW to 85,
12V+ constant fused at 30 amps to 87 and 86,
30 to GREEN/ black.
Diode (1N4004) between 85 and 86, band to 86, stops relay shutdown spike damaging the 5706.
To the best of my knowledge Toyota have never used a NEG output on an Ignition wire except on PTS vehicles.
Pay careful attention to where the plug fits into the control centre (antenna).



-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Thank you for the reply. Yes, I understood how to run the relay to appropriate wires. What I have a problem with right now is discrepencies on wiring diagram. As I mentioned previous post, the wiring diagram from modifilif.e. has

[quote]
Vehicle Ignition Wire (+): Blue / YELLOW
Vehicle Second Ignition Wire (+): BLACK/ Red
Automobile Engine Starter Wire (+): BLACK/ White
Automobile Second Engine Starter Wire (-): GREEN/ Black
[/quote]

Where some other sites have the wiring as :

[quote]

Starter GREEN/ black      +
Second Starter      BLACK/ white      +        
Ignition      BLACK/ red      +     
Second Ignition      blue / YELLOW      +

[/quote]

Which one is correct? I followed the post from tacomaworld in my previous post and someone in that forum said that his truck all messed up when he followed the 2nd diagram. He didn't post anything else after that so I couldn't verify. One of the post here on the12volts for the installation of the 2010 Tacoma and they used the 2nd diagram.

Please help, I don't want to mess up my truck by switch up the starter/2nd starter or ignition/2nd ignition,

howie ll wrote:

---

Connect both starter wires, use the Violet (purple) and green at H3 for BLACK/ white.
Use H2 /21 violet / YELLOW to second starter via a relay as follows:-
Violet / YELLOW to 85,
12V+ constant fused at 30 amps to 87 and 86,
30 to GREEN/ black.
Diode (1N4004) between 85 and 86, band to 86, stops relay shutdown spike damaging the 5706.
To the best of my knowledge Toyota have never used a NEG output on an Ignition wire except on PTS vehicles.
Pay careful attention to where the plug fits into the control centre (antenna).

---

Obvious answer, TEST

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

howie ll wrote:

---

Obvious answer, TEST

---

How? Ignitions wires from both diagram listed + polarity .

Kreg might be more diplomatic but to be blunt if you have to question my last post should you even be attempting this install?
Now I,ve vented a bit, all the guides should be taken as guides NOT instructions.
You must test and verify everything.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

howie ll wrote:

---

Kreg might be more diplomatic but to be blunt if you have to question my last post should you even be attempting this install?
Now I,ve vented a bit, all the guides should be taken as guides NOT instructions.
You must test and verify everything.

---

Please pardon my ignorance, but how do figure out/ test for
First diagram:
Vehicle Ignition Wire (+): Blue / YELLOW

Second diagram:
Second Ignition      blue / YELLOW      +

They're both (+), same color of wires, one diagram call out "Ignition wire" and one diagram call out " Second Ignition" ?

About the comment that should I not even attempt to install this? My reply is sir: How do one learn to drive?
I have posted questions here with backup references from my research. I don't know much about this stuff that's why i have all these questions so I can learn by doing.........

Kreg has already explained how to test this using a meter, please read that post again.
Remember this isn't "painting by numbers", and never assume, you have to test. No one here is going to take you by the hand you have to show some initiative.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

multimeter: black to ground, red to "testing" wire. Wire should show 12v at the ignition position, and during start.

ignition and second ignition is still an ignition. for example Person 1 and Person 2. Still, they are infact still people. Toyota is known for 2x starters and 2x ignitions. Do test all your wires.

12 Volts     WHITE/ red (30A)     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 5
Second 12 Volts     WHITE/ blue (50A)     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 4
Starter     GREEN/ black     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 7
Second Starter     BLACK/ white     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 3
Ignition     BLACK/ red     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 6
Second Ignition     blue / YELLOW     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 1     
Accessory     WHITE/ green     +     ignition switch, white 8 pin plug, pin 2


-------------
Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

Ok. Let me try one more time. I know how to test for wires thanks to Kreg, and numerous youtube videos. Here is the problem I'm facing:

One website listed:
Ignition wire : Blue / YELLOW (+)

One website listed:
Ignition Wire : BLACK/ Red (+)

Similar with Starter and Second Starter. They have the names of those wires swapped.

Now, when I did the test for the Blue / YELLOW and BLACK/ Red wires.
I get for both :

Off : 0 volts
Acc: 12 volts
Crank: 12 volts
Running: 12 volts.

So which one is Ignition wire so I can hook it up correctly?

Thanks

OK, forget everything you've read up so far and lose the meter, both irrelevant.
We're going to do this old school.
Get yourself a decent bulb tester, Snap-On, Mac, Craftsman.
Place the clip to ground and probe the ignition switch loom.
You will get the following as you turn the key from off to start.
Two will be at 12 volts all the time note the colours. Power sources.
One will be live only on ACC, ignition and engine run NOT crank. Note the colour. ACC
Two will be live on ignition, crank and engine run. Note the colours. Ignition 1 and 2.
Two will be live only on crank. Note the colours. Starter 1 and 2.
That's it and to be honest that's how I STILL do it.
Much, much quicker but reserved for pros because we (should) know when to only use a meter.


-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

howie ll wrote:

---

OK, forget everything you've read up so far and lose the meter, both irrelevant.
We're going to do this old school.
Get yourself a decent bulb tester, Snap-On, Mac, Craftsman.
Place the clip to ground and probe the ignition switch loom.
You will get the following as you turn the key from off to start.
Two will be at 12 volts all the time note the colours. Power sources.
One will be live only on ACC, ignition and engine run NOT crank. Note the colour. ACC
Two will be live on ignition, crank and engine run. Note the colours. Ignition 1 and 2.
Two will be live only on crank. Note the colours. Starter 1 and 2.
That's it and to be honest that's how I STILL do it.
Much, much quicker but reserved for pros because we (should) know when to only use a meter.

---

I understood what you're trying to show me there. But i'll be facing the same problem again. Let's say that I'll find two wires that will be live on crank only. How do I tell which one is Starter 1 and which one is Second Starter?

Doesn't matter which is dictated as starter 1 vs starter 2. As long as the circuit is powered then thats all that matters. Every circuit, when powered with the RS, as if you started with the key will prevent any codes/errors.

-------------
Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

There is a way of defining:-
Whichever ignition or starter wire you cut then the car won't start is ignition or starter 1. Can you be bothered?

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

I see what you did there . but what's the purpose of ignition 2 and starterter 2 for ? Says if you cut the ignition 1 or starter 1 then the car won't start

It's nominal the one that when cut prevents engine run is simply number one by convention.
We've lost time from our lives from your irrelevant questions. Goodbye.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

My questions aren't irrelevant. I simply asked "why/how" that lead to your answers. Would you take an answer without reasons/explanations behind it? You don't have to be a brick. You don't have to reply to my posts/questions.

warsatan wrote:

---

Please help, I don't want to mess up my truck by switch up the starter/2nd starter or ignition/2nd ignition

---

You won't. The Viper doesn't know what it's connected to.

The guys want you to test and verify the functions, using your wiring guide information. There are three TYPES of circuits at the Ignition Switch:

IGNITION = OV in OFF, 12V in RUN, 12V in START.
STARTER = 0V in OFF, 0V in RUN, 12V in START.
ACCY = 0V in OFF, 12V in RUN, 0V in START.

The Viper has outputs configured for each of the above. Some outputs such as "FLEX" can be programmed to any of the three TYPES.

Many vehicles have more than one wire of a particular TYPE. When this occurs, the guides call the additional circuits of the same TYPE "2nd or 2", "3rd or 3" etc. It doesn't matter how many there are of a TYPE, but it is important to keep them electrically separated using relays.

Your confusion is in "what is the difference between 1 and 2"? There isn't any. The car won't know, and neither will the Viper. If a wire tests and behaves as a "STARTER", wire it to a START output. If you find a 2nd wire that also tests as "STARTER" wire it to a START output too.

warsatan wrote:

---

Let's say that I'll find two wires that will be live on crank only. How do I tell which one is Starter 1 and which one is Second Starter?

---

If it makes you feel better, call the second START wire you identify "Starter 2". And the second IGNITION wire you find "Ignition 2". But think about it. It doesn't matter what they are called as long as the wires' functions are correctly identified, and connected to corresponding output types on the Viper.

I would use the FLEX relay/output for STARTER 2 because it's 87a terminal is accessible. Then you can cut both STARTER wires, and use internal Viper relays for both of the Toyota's Starter circuits.

Easy-Peasey.

Ted tried an analogy. I'll write one too.

You're a server in a busy restaurant. A coworker asks you to help her out by delivering a tray of drinks to Table #4.

On the tray are:
1 Coke
1 7-Up
2 Waters (Water-1, 2nd Water).

You arrive at Table #4. There are 4 people at the table.
"Who's having Coke?" one person indicates the Coke is for them.
"And the 7-up?" another person takes the 7-Up.
You then distribute the 2 waters to the remaining 2 people.

Did it matter which glass of water went to which of the remaining 2 people? (No. Each of the 2 people got the "type" of drink they ordered).

davep. wrote:

---

Ted tried an analogy. I'll write one too.

You're a server in a busy restaurant. A coworker asks you to help her out by delivering a tray of drinks to Table #4.

On the tray are:
1 Coke
1 7-Up
2 Waters (Water-1, 2nd Water).

You arrive at Table #4. There are 4 people at the table.
"Who's having Coke?" one person indicates the Coke is for them.
"And the 7-up?" another person takes the 7-Up.
You then distribute the 2 waters to the remaining 2 people.

Did it matter which glass of water went to which of the remaining 2 people? (No. Each of the 2 people got the "type" of drink they ordered).

---

Well this thread escalated quickly haha.
Btw Dave, love the analogy! I had a good laugh while in the ER

-------------
Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

Gents,

Thank you for all the explanations . I got the RS up and running now . I still have to find the lock/unlock wires tomorrow and run the antena wires .

lock/unlock are easy to get to. driver kick, 10 pin plug

-------------
Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

Thanks, I finally got everything hooked up and tucked away neatly. Quick question, the LED of the antenna flashes constantly, it doesn't look normal to me. I'd think it flashes once every 2 seconds or so, but right now it flashes at 1 flash per second. I'm going through the manual but unable to find anything that indicate how to change the frequency of this LED flashing.

Thanks