Autopage C3-RS-730 Brake Switch Shutdown

Hello all.

I recently had an Autopage C3-RS-730 2-way remote start system installed in my 2003 Trailblazer!

There is a slight issue with the system though. It doesn't seem crazy, I was just curious about something.


^^In this picture, number 17 - WHITE/ Violet goes to (+) Brake Switch Shutdown Input. It goes on the White wire on the brake switch.



In THIS picture^^ is my brake switch harness (attached to the brake pedal). As it appears, there are 2 white wires coming out of the harness. My finger is on the wire that the WHITE/ Violet wire is connected to.

When I use the remote start, the system does not shut down when the key is turned and I apply the brake pedal. Could this be the reason? Is the (+) Brake Switch Shutdown Input wire landed on the wrong wire???

I don't understand why there are 2 white wires coming off the brake switch and I can't exactly find a diagram that shows this.

Someone please help me!

flip01002003 wrote:

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When I use the remote start, the system does not shut down when the key is turned and I apply the brake pedal.

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Remote start it.
Push the brake.
If it stops running = no problem found. OK, normal operation.

Remote start it.
Turn the key on.
Push the brake. (Engine should stay running, because key is ON).
Turn the key off.
If it stops running = no problem found. OK, normal operation.

Do both of those white wires go into the same cavity? If = yes, they are identical in function, either one will work.

EDIT: I found a wiring diagram for a 2007. Both white wires are in cavity A. So I was correct. They are the same function. Hot with brake applied. Either one will work for the RS.

Here's what happens...

Remote start it.
Turn key on.
Remote start still active and my car runs in 3rd gear only.

As far as I know, when the key is turned and brake applied, the auto start system should shut off and the car takes over as normal operation. When I turn the key then apply the brake, the remote start system doesn't recognize that it should shut off.

My remote for my C3-RS-730 still thinks it's on auto start. Today I was driving after about 10 minutes of driving after auto start. I pulled over because she was riding VERY slow and I couldn't turn on cruise control. I hit the button on the remote to try to turn the auto start off, because the timer on the remote was still counting down. After I hit the button, the remote said that the engine was doodie off, even though I was just in park with the engine still running.

This is why I think the brake switch shutdown input had been Landed on the wrong wire. I just want some clarification to see if this is the reason why my car is dog this.

My question hasn't been answered: With the key OFF, does the brake shut it down??


3rd gear only means there isn't power to the transmission. Either one of the IGN circuits isn't powered or a fuse has blown. Probably the latter.
Same with the brake shut-down. Do the brake lights on the car work? If = NO, check fuses.

Your diagram with the connection notations on it is difficult to read. But it looks like all the IGN's and ACCY's were connected. There's even a relay with notations for the ORN accy circuit that powers the HVAC. It looks like they got them all.

There's a lot of fuses in these cars, in at least two locations. Consult your Owners Manual for the locations, then check them.

You imply the system was installed by someone else. I recommend you take it back to them to sort this out if replacing a couple of fuses doesn't fix it, or they blow again. If you have to drive it in 3rd gear only to take it to them, baby it from dead starts. Once it gets rolling, things are fine, but from a stop don't overpower it as this builds tremendous heat, and can cause the 3-4 clutch to slip which damages it. Be nice to it, and no harm will be done. But get it fixed.

Okay, I just went outside to try it. With the key OFF, the system DOES shut down when the brake is applied. And the brake lights work either way.

I've done a bit of research and found this thread (click here). These people experienced the same problem. I just want to know if this is logical and maybe that my installer didn't properly install one wire, and that would be causing this issue.

Oh and I probably should have mentioned it before, but all the excess writing and notations were mine. I was going to attempt this install myself but soon realized that I don't know as much as I thought about these things lol.

flip01002003 wrote:

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Okay, I just went outside to try it. With the key OFF, the system DOES shut down when the brake is applied.

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Then the brake shutdown is working properly. That's not the problem. Move on.

flip01002003 wrote:

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I've done a bit of research and found this thread (click here). These people experienced the same problem. I just want to know if this is logical and maybe that my installer didn't properly install one wire, and that would be causing this issue.

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Absolutely. The white IGN wire needs to be powered during a RS. This "white wire" thing has come up many times on here. Is there a Service Engine Soon light on after a remote start? If so, this is the next thing to check. Take it back.

flip01002003 wrote:

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Oh and I probably should have mentioned it before, but all the excess writing and notations were mine. I was going to attempt this install myself but soon realized that I don't know as much as I thought about these things lol.

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You may have had trouble with the bypass, but the RS is fairly straight forward. The GM "white wire" has been around for a long time now. I'm surprised that a shop missed it, unless it was an inexperienced new-hire that did your install. I have no idea. Take it back, don't fry your transmission.

Okay I'll move on from it, but there has to be something that is supposed to shut the remote start system off once the key is turned... correct? I had this system installed on my 95 Blazer and I didn't have this problem.

The Service Engine Soon light was on at all times, whether I started it with the remote or with the key itself. The codes were for transmission and torque converter. I have the actual codes if you want to know them for reference. I just cleared them out about an hour ago and they haven't come back yet. I could try the remote start and see if it comes back on.

I do plan on taking it back to the guys who installed it, don't get me wrong. But I also want to learn some of this for myself so I can install one on my wife's car for her birthday. I'm just trying to get an understanding of these systems and how they are wired.

the only remote starter shutdown is opening of the hood, or foot brake. If you are getting CEL's make sure all ignition and accessories are powered.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

tedmond wrote:

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the only remote starter shutdown is opening of the hood, or foot brake. If you are getting CEL's make sure all ignition and accessories are powered.

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But the remote start system should shut down and the car should take over when the key is on and the brake is applied... Which doesn't happen.

if you turn the key to the ignition position, press the brakes to shut off the remote start, and the car also shuts down you should bring it back immediately. It means an ignition wire was possibly damaged.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

tedmond wrote:

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if you turn the key to the ignition position, press the brakes to shut off the remote start, and the car also shuts down you should bring it back immediately. It means an ignition wire was possibly damaged.

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When I turn the key and press the brake the car stays on but the remote start system does not shut down as it should.

Hello, I've been following this thread but I've no knowledge of US GM cars per se, apart from some Cruze models their wiring is completely different from Euro GM product but here goes.
Only one thought.
If you can look, make sure ALL of the ignition wires are connected.
If not and because of the CEL you might have a legal liability case.
If you can't tell is there a good independent auto electrical specialist in your area who can give you a report?
I might be inclined to let the original installer make good at their expense of course if you trust them.
Did you say the CEL is on all of the time? I'd be worried, future engine and transmission problems for sure unless it was a one off and diagnostic equipment (or disconnect the battery for 20 minutes) erases it.
Some years ago there was a 30 page thread here reference a similar problem.

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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

I forgot. Can you test the white wire under R/Start conditions to see if it goes hot on remote start?
Also what Davep said about fuses. Test continuity individually with a DMM.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

flip01002003 wrote:

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The Service Engine Soon light was on at all times, whether I started it with the remote or with the key itself. The codes were for transmission and torque converter. I have the actual codes if you want to know them for reference. I just cleared them out about an hour ago and they haven't come back yet. I could try the remote start and see if it comes back on.

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So, do they come back with a Remote Start? But not with a key start? They missed the white IGN-2 wire. Which has to be wired as an IGN so hot-in-START.

Some DTC's keep the CEL on for a number of IGN cycles wether the fault that set it is present or not. After a number of cycles without the DTC resetting, the CEL will go out, and the DTC becomes a History DTC.

It sounds like you're capable of clearing the DTC's yourself. (OBD II DTC's don't clear by disconnecting the battery, Howie. Only with a scanner.)So clear them. If the CEL stays off with key starts, but comes on with RS, it's the RS causing the DTCs and the CEL.

flip01002003 wrote:

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But the remote start system should shut down and the car should take over when the key is on and the brake is applied... Which doesn't happen.

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but you say it DOES shut down with the key off, so the brake cancel is functioning....

If you're thinking that the CEL should go off, and the transmission be "normal" because the "car took over" you're mistaken about how the Powertrain Control Module operates.

It seems like the white wire is not powered, and the transmission control solenoids are not powered when Remote Started. This sets Diagnostic Trouble Codes. These DTC's have actions associated with them that the PCM performs for that entire ignition cycle. Ie, because the IGN is not turned off upon key takeover, the CEL and parameters for the DTC's remain active. In your case, one of the "actions" for the DTC's is 3rd gear starts.

I'm quite familiar with the 4L60e transmission that your trailblazer has. If the DTC's are for Shift Solenoid faults, and they set with a Remote Start, but not a key start, my bet is on they missed powering the white wire as an IGN.

davep. wrote:

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So, do they come back with a Remote Start? But not with a key start?

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Yes! The codes come back when I remote start the system!!!

davep. wrote:

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It sounds like you're capable of clearing the DTC's yourself. (OBD II DTC's don't clear by disconnecting the battery, Howie. Only with a scanner.)So clear them. If the CEL stays off with key starts, but comes on with RS, it's the RS causing the DTCs and the CEL.

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Yes, I had the codes cleared out and they do NOT come back on with key start, only with the remote start system.

davep. wrote:

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but you say it DOES shut down with the key off, so the brake cancel is functioning....

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Yes, it does. I assumed this break shut off was like a "dual function" sort of thing; where it would shut down the car if the key was not in and shut down the remote start system with the key in. My badddd

davep. wrote:

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If you're thinking that the CEL should go off, and the transmission be "normal" because the "car took over" you're mistaken about how the Powertrain Control Module operates.

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NOOOOOOnononono. I know the CEL will stay on, I wanted to know if the Remote Start system should be shutting off.

davep. wrote:

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They missed the white IGN-2 wire. Which has to be wired as an IGN so hot-in-START.

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SO this should stop the problem of the CEL coming on when remote starting AND should shut down the remote start system when the key is in???

flip01002003 wrote:

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SO this should stop the problem of the CEL coming on when remote starting AND should shut down the remote start system when the key is in???

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It will cure the CEL IF this is the problem. Check the white wire. You could also check IGN-0 fuse 47 in the rear panel while remote started. Is there B+ on both sides? If = No, white wire is not powered.

As far as "shut down the remote start" I don't know. Fix the obvious (CEL and 3rd gear starts)before you burn up the 3-4 clutch in your transmission.
Please try this sequence again:

Start with Remote Start.
Turn on key.
Step on brake.
Turn off key.
     Did engine shut off?
 If = YES, the RS shut down with the brake pedal or the key wouldn't turn the engine off.
 If = NO, the RS did NOT shut down, I have no idea what to check next, but we'll figure it out IF this is the case.

Please report back with the findings of this test sequence. This has been going on for a week. I think it's shutting down, you don't. Only one of us is correct, and this sequence will reveal which one of us is. And we can go from there....

flip01002003 wrote:

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SO this should stop the problem of the CEL coming on when remote starting AND should shut down the remote start system when the key is in???

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When the key is IN or the key is ON ??
There is a BIG difference. I've been responding to with key is ON. I don't think there is any RS that reacts to key is IN. The bypasses do, but the RS itself doesn't. Which is it, IN or ON?

davep. wrote:

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When the key is IN or the key is ON ??
There is a BIG difference. I've been responding to with key is ON. I don't think there is any RS that reacts to key is IN. The bypasses do, but the RS itself doesn't. Which is it, IN or ON?

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I do mean when the key is ON, sorry!

So a little update...

I just tried the remote start and after I cleared my CEL, and the system actually does shut down. But the CEL comes back on when using the remote start system.

Where is the white wire that I need to look at??? Is it the one on the brake harness?

I'm thinking ignition loom.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Which wire on the remote start system should go to it?? I have a picture of the installation instructions at the top of the thread.

Check the fuses in the red power wires to the Remote Start. If one is bad, it could cause this problem. (I can't believe a professional installer missed this. This issue with GM's is 12-14 years old, everyone knows about it now).

Why don't you follow all the large wires from the RS, and tell us what they connect to at the ignition switch harness.

Remote Start wire =(these are MY suggested connections on the car-side. Other combos will work).
Red (fused) 1 = XXX (red)
Red (fused) 2 = XXX (red)
Purple = XXX (yellow).
Pink = XXX    (white)
Yellow = XXX (pink)
Brown = XXX (orange)
relay or no connection = (brown)(this is wipers and radio. Not needed in unoccupied vehicle, so doesn't have to be powered by RS).