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1 subwoofer vs 2 subwoofers


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frizkysquirrel 
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Joined: January 13, 2008
Location: Michigan, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 5:57 PM / IP Logged  
if i have two of the same 12" subs, is there a way to roughly calculate the output in decibels of two subs if i know the output in decibels of one of the sub by itself.
ill give an example if its unclear what im asking.
say i have one 12" 300 rms sub in a 1.5 cuft sealed box and i know it is 130 db at 40 hz.
i then put another of the exact same 12" sub powered the same rms as the other in the same box playing at the same tone of 40 hz.
is there a rough formula for getting the db of the two 12" side by side if i know the db of the one, or is there too many other factors of the sub design that would affect this?
thank :)
DYohn 
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Joined: April 22, 2003
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 6:20 PM / IP Logged  
If one sub @ 300 watts = 130db, then 2 of the same subs @ 600 watts (300 apiece) = 136db.  Roughly.
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haemphyst 
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Joined: January 19, 2003
Location: Michigan, Bouvet Island
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 6:23 PM / IP Logged  
What I'm curious about is what woofer, only rated 300 watts, will do 130dB at 40Hz? That's freakin' LOUD! You'd have to be starting with somewhere around 100dB efficiency! (Minus cabin gain, of course.)
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
frizkysquirrel 
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Member spacespace
Joined: January 13, 2008
Location: Michigan, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 6:27 PM / IP Logged  
its not real data, haha.
i just made up some random easy numbers because...
...i just wanted to know a relationship between one and two woofers and the decibel readings.
DYohn 
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Joined: April 22, 2003
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 6:44 PM / IP Logged  
frizkysquirrel 
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Member spacespace
Joined: January 13, 2008
Location: Michigan, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 6:53 PM / IP Logged  
thanks :)
i am an idiot 
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Location: Louisiana, United States
Posted: February 27, 2008 at 8:58 PM / IP Logged  

In case you want to know the formula that was used to get the 136 Db estimate.  Generally speaking, anytime you double the cone area of your subs you will see a 3 Db increase.  Any time you double your power on the subs, this too will give you a 3 Db increase.  You have done both.  From 1 12 to 2 12s would give you 133 Db.  Then you doubled the power, theoretically you should be at 136.  Just in case you were asking yourself  "is there a rough formula for getting the db of the two 12" side by side if i know the db of the one"

stevdart 
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Posted: February 27, 2008 at 10:07 PM / IP Logged  

Nice link, DYohn.  I'm adding that to my favorites folder pronto

Notice on that linked calculator, friskysquirrel, that there are boxes to choose:  "in phase" or "random phase".  You'll see that 2 identical woofers that apply to the categegory "in phase" (sometimes said to be correlated) will theoretically give the extra 3 db due to the additional cone area.  This cannot be said, though,if you are speaking of the front stereo soundstage or of subwoofers that are connected to the amp on separate channels.  The theory here would be that the two channels are separate signals and, although some of the content may be correlated, the assumption has to be that the signals vary in stereo and thus considered "random phase" (to apply the calculator's intent).

For your make believe scenario the subs would have to each receive exactly the same signal to calculate the additional 3 db for doubling cone area.  Bridging channels, using a mono amp, or combining signals prior to input to a two-channel amp are common ways to correlate the output. 

Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.
frizkysquirrel 
Member - Posts: 47
Member spacespace
Joined: January 13, 2008
Location: Michigan, United States
Posted: March 07, 2008 at 9:53 AM / IP Logged  
yea. sorry im just replying now. i was busy with classes and work.
but yes i know of the phase. this was covered in my physics 2 class.
if the subs are not in phase you will get dips in the amplitude where the out of phase sounds waves caused destructive interference. Likewise when you have the sound wave exactly in phase it will cause constructive interference causing an increase in amplitude.
As well as the sub woofers being out of phase cause destructive interference, since they play relatively few notes at a time, it will create resonant peaks and dips within the cabin.
oh how complicated sound gets.
haemphyst 
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Joined: January 19, 2003
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Posted: March 07, 2008 at 10:00 AM / IP Logged  
frizkysquirrel wrote:
oh how complicated sound gets.
You have no idea yet, young padawan. 1 subwoofer vs 2 subwoofers -- posted image.
Wait till you get into crossover slopes and alignments, including L-pads, Zobels, inductor interaction, proper capacitor selection... absolute phase, equalization, driver placement, time alignment... high frequency cabin interactions... Oh, man. THOSE are the fun times! 1 subwoofer vs 2 subwoofers -- posted image.
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
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