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my kickers keep blowin fuses

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=100780
Printed Date: April 28, 2024 at 10:19 AM


Topic: my kickers keep blowin fuses

Posted By: motocrossrider
Subject: my kickers keep blowin fuses
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 12:11 PM

1994 chevy silverado k1500, new car battery, 4 gauge wiring positive&negative 2 cvr 12" kickers Mtx thunder series amplifier TC4002, 1.2 farad capacitor

the problem is my power cable running from my battery to my cap/amp keeps blowing fuses, the owners manual for my amp states that I need a 50 amp fuse in the power cable because I have 2 25 amp fuses in my amplifier (it's a 2-channel), yet 60 amp fuses keep blowing and i recently installed a 150 amp fuse is this ok?



Replies:

Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Did it blow the 150A fuse?

With a 4 guage wire, technically, the 150A fuse is OK.  However, it is a bit excessive for the load you are putting on it.

I would think a 60A fuse would be fine, that is strange.  How often does it blow the fuse?  What are the conditions when the fuse blows?

I would recomend removing the cap and going from there - it's not helping you in any way anyway.



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Kevin Pierson




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 12:19 PM
with 60a fuses they blow in about 5-10 min




Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 12:46 PM
Have you checked for shorts in your system using an ohm meter?  Have you measured system voltage?  How are your speakers wired?  How was your gain set?  What else is in the circuit?  Get rid of the cap and see if that helps.

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Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 6:48 PM

Does the fuse actually blow, or does it just melt the solder off the ends of it and not make a connection anymore?





Posted By: speakermakers
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:23 PM
If your 50 amp fuse (two 25 amp) dose not blow but more than one 60 amp fuse at the battery blows you have a short between your battery and your amp. Inspect the entire run and repair what you find.




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:30 PM
KPierson wrote:

I would recomend removing the cap and going from there - it's not helping you in any way anyway.




How is the cap not beneficial to my system? Before I installed it, the lights dim and the battery voltage meter on my dash bounced around. Both items still occur, just much less, now that I installed the cap.




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:32 PM
speakermakers wrote:

If your 50 amp fuse (two 25 amp) dose not blow but more than one 60 amp fuse at the battery blows you have a short between your battery and your amp. Inspect the entire run and repair what you find.


Agreed. I doublechecked and the amp indeed has only 2x25amp fuses so, that's the only solution. Any other problems I may or may not have at this point are going to be hard to find and diagnose until the short is fixed, i'd imagine.




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:37 PM
Also, I just had a thought:

We've determined there must be a short, but as the battery doesn't wind up dead after I turn off the engine, that would seem to limit the places the short could be located. Is this a correct assumption? If so, where should I limit my search? I'm not especially familiar with car wiring (otherwise I'd have wired it myself, not had the idiot at Trader's Village do it, and probably wouldn't be here right now).




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:41 PM
DYohn] wrote:

Have you checked for shorts in your system using an ohm meter? Have you measured system voltage? How are your speakers wired? How was your gain set? What else is in the circuit? Get rid of the cap and see if that helps.


-not yet. gotta get one.
-engine off, about 12.5 on the cap readout; engine on, 13.5
-DVC 4ohm, wired for 2ohm load
-like 3/4 the way up
-nothing but the cap, speakers, and amp, unless i misunderstood you
-happened before i installed the cap as well




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:45 PM
i am an idiot wrote:

Does the fuse actually blow, or does it just melt the solder off the ends of it and not make a connection anymore?





Now that you mention it, the first one went that way. Blew the fuse as well tho. That was a 30A fuse the guy put in it, and I assume he didn't connect it too well, for that to have happened. It's connected more ruggedly now that I redid it.




Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 7:49 PM

I disagree about the short.

Fuses arn't created equal.  A 25 amp fuse doesn't necesarrily blow at 25A.  Fuses actually have datasheets that tell you when they will blow.

I would imagine you have to blade type 25A fuses in the amp.

Here is a data sheet for it:

https://production.littelfuse.com/data/en/Data_Sheets/257.pdf

It says that the 25A  fuse will operate at 27.5A for 100 hours before blowing.  That means, together, you have roughly 55A capacity for 100 hours.  If you are pulling 60A you will be at 120% of the load - from the datasheet all you can really tell is that the fuse will blow somewhere between 100 hours and 500mS (they only give values for 10% and 35%, not 20% like we need).

Your glass fuse (I assume that is what you have up front) may be designed to blow right at 60A, with no delay.

So, it is possible to blow a 60A glass fuse before you blow a 50A blade type fuse.

If you had a classic 'short' the fuse would blow right when you installed the new fuse, before you ever installed the fuse.  What happens if you install the fuse and then don't turn the amp on?  Does the fuse still blow?  I'm guessing it doesn't.

The cap also becomes an extra load on the battery, meaning that the front fuse is now feeding the capacitor AND the amp, which would cause the front fuse to have a higher load then the back two fuses.  Again, remove the cap and see if the fuses quit blowing.  It may not help, but it might 'fix' the problem.

The reason I say the cap isn't doing anything for you is because, if anything, it is a band-aid on a bigger problem.  It sounds like your electrical system simply doesn't produce enough power for your added gear, so fix the electrical system.  Beyond that, there are tons of threads on here talking about why caps don't help fix anything. 



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Kevin Pierson




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 9:02 PM
But if he has a short, wouldnt it blow the fuse right away? I mean it would be sending 12V through it right away. I am thinking that maybe he doesnt have the subs wired up correctly. Having them at too low of a load causing the amp to draw too much current thus blowing the fuse.




Posted By: speakermakers
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 9:10 PM
As usual this can be debated to death. The fact of the matter is that until a visual inspection in done on the entire power cable including pulling it out of the fire wall or any other grommet that it goes through, this is all a lot of wasted time for everyone.

Theorize after you have observed the obvious.




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 9:12 PM
totally agree speakermakers




Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: January 05, 2008 at 9:31 PM

But if it doesn't blow the 150A fuse I would say its safe to assume there are no wiring issues.

I can think of only one situation that would cause a 60A to blow but not a 150A fuse - there is more then 60A, but less then 150A on the power line.  If anyone else has a scenario that would cause this let me know, I would like to hear about it.

It, of course, wouldn't hurt to pull the power wire out and inspect it, but I think it would be a waste of time.



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Kevin Pierson




Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: January 06, 2008 at 10:48 AM
Using a meter properly takes seconds.  Hardly a waste of time.

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Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: January 06, 2008 at 1:59 PM

Using a meter to measure resistance to ground is one thing, but pulling the entire wire out of the car to visually inspect it is pointless.

If you had some sort of current limited short to ground (which would be impossible) that was causing the front fuse to blow but not the back, that condition would be present at all times.  That means, whatever extra current draw that is cusing his fuse to blow would be present when the car is off.  If that was the case he would be on here asking us why his battery is dead 2 hours after he shuts the car off.



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Kevin Pierson




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 06, 2008 at 8:48 PM
Yeah I'm very confused about this setup... I know there's no shorts... I'm fixing to just pull all the wires out and re-wire them.... I'm having doubts about cheverolet... sounds stupid but friend drives a 1997 chevy silverado and almost same senario... 12" solobaric L7 with a rockford fosgate amp 1000 watts peak... idk wat kind but he just blew a 60A fuse today




Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: January 06, 2008 at 9:20 PM

What kind of fuse holder do you have in your car (glass, wafer, etc)?  Try to find a fuse the next size above 60A.  As long as you stay with a 150A fuse or smaller you shouldn't have any major issues, as the 4ga cable you have is rated to carry 150A.

You only have major issues if your fuse is larger then the wire it is protecting is rated at.

I'm sure many, many people on here can tell you it has nothing to do with Chevrolet.  I had a big system in my Chevy and never once blew a fuse.



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Kevin Pierson




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 06, 2008 at 11:07 PM
its a glass fuse




Posted By: nightowl2
Date Posted: January 07, 2008 at 7:35 PM

Kpierson/motocrossrider- I had a 60 amp fuse (glass type) installed when I found my short the hard way. The stereo system was actually installed for several months before I found this short and I was having a problem with the system for the last 3-4 weeks. The funny thing is I never blew a fuse. It melted the carpet and (believe it or not) welded the copper wire to the floor! I know, it seems impossible to weld copper to steel but it did it. There is now a hole where the short happened. It wasn’t a real strong weld, I could pull the wire off the floor with a couple hard tugs. My point is this happened and never blew a 60 amp fuse.





Posted By: nightowl2
Date Posted: January 07, 2008 at 7:38 PM
WOW!!! Never saw that before. I'll not past from Word again!




Posted By: nightowl2
Date Posted: January 07, 2008 at 7:41 PM
Kpierson- I had a 60 amp fuse (glass type) installed when I found my short the hard way. The stereo system was actually installed for several months before I found this short and I was having a problem with the system for the last 3-4 weeks. The funny thing is I never blew a fuse. It melted the carpet and (believe it or not) welded the copper wire to the floor! I know, it seems impossible to weld copper to steel but it did it. It wasn’t a real strong weld, I could pull the wire off the floor with a couple hard tugs. My point is this happened and never blew a 60 amp fuse.




Posted By: nightowl2
Date Posted: January 07, 2008 at 7:45 PM
I copied the wrong name, sorry. motocrossrider that was meant to be for you. I was in a hurry and thought I had it corrected in my first post but that one was a mess because I copied from Word. Learned a lesson there.




Posted By: motocrossrider
Date Posted: January 08, 2008 at 5:46 PM
Thank you guys for all your help.... i finally took apart the wires and did a diagnostic on it.....

problem 1

installers stripped half the loving copper outta the wire that connects to my voice coil thus blowing a coil

2

improper wiring on amplifier

combination of these 2 blow fuses because of improper wiring





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