how can these amps even be advertised

When it comes down to it - 900w for $137 is a good buy.  I never trust website ratings on budget amps w/o checking the manuals first, or at least the fuse size.

However --

If Lanzar wants to over-rate their budget stuff, that's their prerogative, but I think the usual 2x actual power is plenty to draw in the uninformed.  4000w on a 900w amp is ridiculous.  Regardless of the fact that just about anyone with a clue who sees 4000w and ~$150 will know better.

(always check the manuals on budget stuff - or at least the fuse size.  If neither of those are easily accessible it's a good sign to avoid it)

Most of the ratings on Lanzar's non optidrive stuff are a bad joke, and they're methodically burying what little respect they have left with Lanzar, specifically Optidrive, by the image they've given everything else.

I guess the goal with the Lanzar buyout was to cash in up front knowing they wouldn't be able to maintain (or even make an effot to maintain) the prestige Lanzar had years ago.

elmore4030 wrote:

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I was looking at a LanZar MXA282 supposed to be a 4000watt amp ,on the spec's at Ebay it has 2 x 1650watts RMS at 4ohms bridged,so it supposed to put out 3300watts RMS .I thought when it said RMS it was supposed to be clean watts.I got to looking at the rest of the spec's and it said it had a 2 x 35amp fuse.Even if it got 14.4volts at the amp,the most it could put out is 1008watts,but that is why it is only $137.I got to looking at the spec's on thier web sit and it has only 900watts as the max RMS,that sounds about right.But you useally get what you pay for.I thought all amps had to be CEA 2006 compliant.

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If that amp will put out 500w total rms @ 4ohms, you'd be lucky...

sedate wrote:

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You'd be amazed what you'd get out of amplifier packed in dry ice getting 18 volts.

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greenbroncoguy wrote:

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If that amp will put out 500w total rms @ 4ohms, you'd be lucky...

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It will do around 900

techman93 wrote:

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Lanzar is owned by Pyramid

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No, not really.

Lanzar, Pyramid, Pyle, Legacy and Blitz are all owned by Sound Around.

The amp will do, at most, 650watts RMS into a 4ohm bridged load.

70 x 14.4 = 1008watts (@ 100% effeciency)

@ 65% effeciency (still being VERY generous); 1008 x .65 = 655.2watts RMS x 1 @ 4ohms.

Lanzar sucks! I once, before I knew better, owned a LanzarVibe241 ("1000watts"). It only put out 250watts.

techman93 wrote:

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Same idea... the fact they are owned by the same company is just a formality

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by that logic - I guess we can say Saturn owns Hummer, or Volvo owns Lincoln.

jmelton86 wrote:

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The amp will do, at most, 650watts RMS into a 4ohm bridged load.

70 x 14.4 = 1008watts (@ 100% effeciency)

@ 65% effeciency (still being VERY generous); 1008 x .65 = 655.2watts RMS x 1 @ 4ohms.

Lanzar sucks! I once, before I knew better, owned a LanzarVibe241 ("1000watts"). It only put out 250watts.

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1) you should take a few minutes to look at how fuses work.

2) I've owned several vibes.  230, 430, 1200D.  All were respectable amps.  The 430 was independently tested at 296x2.

3) The vibe 268 (w/2x30A) was independently tested at 923w bridged.

n2audio wrote:

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 The 430 was independently tested at 296x2.

3) The vibe 268 (w/2x30A) was independently tested at 923w bridged.

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What tests under what conditions and done by whom?  Link?

DYohn] wrote:

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QUOTE=n2audio] The 430 was independently tested at 296x2.

3) The vibe 268 (w/2x30A) was independently tested at 923w bridged.

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What tests under what conditions and done by whom?  Link?

[/QUOTE]

:rolleyes:

Unless you could talk to the technician who did the tests to verify the process and results were accurate would anything really qualify as proof?

Believe it or don't.  I do recall the supporting info on the 268 test was not exactly thorough, but the 430 test was.

My point was only that a fuse takes time to heat up and open, especially when music is the source.  Reducing the power capabilities of an amp to the size of the fuses and some basic math can get you, at best, in the ballpark.

Besides, on a test bench it's not uncommon to remove the fuses and replace them with bus bars to conduct the full power test.

and again - what really constitutes proof when it comes to a power test?

Paper with a border, a voltage, % THD and someone's signature?

Take my "claims" for what they're worth.  If that's nothing to you, that's fine.  The 430 claim I firmly believe to be accurate, the 268, I admit, seems far fetched, but the info I had at the time seemed legit.

Besides, you don't have to take these power tests as fact for my arguement to stand.

You probably know better than I do that fuses often don't survive max power tests.  That's all that needs to be understood for my point to stand that fuse size on an amp is not enough info to calcuate it's power capability.

DYohn] wrote:

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ave you ever conducted power tests? 

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no, I don't care to.  I typically buy quality amps with accurate specs. 

When I buy cheap ones I'm well aware that what's printed on the box is meaningless.

DYohn] wrote:

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have, hundreds of them, and I find your argument spurious.

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That fuse size can't be used to accurately determine the power of an amp??

Seriously? 

Then I think you have the problem, not me.

I only got involved in this thread because of the "Lanzar is junk" comment.

And I'm surprised you're trying to pick me apart vs the person making an ignorant blanket statement such as that.

DYohn] wrote:

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esides, a "peak" power test is and has always been completely meaningless.

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Who said it wasn't?

DYohn] wrote:

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nd your statement that the high current some fuses might allow to flow for a few fractions of a second before they blow somehow justifies an inflated power rating is completely bogus and is one of the things wrong with the car audio industry. 

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didn't say that, didn't imply that, and I don't agree with the practice. 

Again, my point - it is reasonable to expect an amp with a pair of 35A fuses to perform as a 900w rms amp should perform when playing music.

Regarding inflated ratings -- What I said is it's there, and anyone of a better level of comprehension than the average newbie is aware of it.  I believe I said something along the lines of - budget amps like to market a "MAX POWER" number that is roughly double the rms power.  That is one thing, and nobody likes it.  But Lanzar going with 4000w on one of their 900w amps is completely ridiculous, and they deserve the reputation they're earning (Pyramid's equal) for that sort of practice.

DYohn] wrote:

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hat kind of "rating" is meaningless to real world applications and advertising those kinds of "performance capabilities" is part of what keeps the "more is better" myth alive.

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No arguement there

Good, apparently we agree.  But I am still interested in this:

DYohn] wrote:

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QUOTE=n2audio] The 430 was independently tested at 296x2.

3) The vibe 268 (w/2x30A) was independently tested at 923w bridged.

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What tests under what conditions and done by whom?  Link?

[/QUOTE]

If these numbers are simply something you read elsewhere, then point me to it as I'd like to know how they were obtained.

the vibe 430 was from sounddomains forum 3-4 (??)  years ago.  I only recall that I was familiar with the poster and knew they were well informed.  I don't remember if they measured it themselves or had it done professionally, but I know I took it as fact at the time and still do.

The 268 was from caraudio.com.  IIRC the owner/poster had taken it to a local electronics shop that had the means to test it.  As I've said - I'm not sure of the specifics on that one.  I recall thinking the poster wasn't very technically savvy, but that they were surprised by the results as well and the technician was certain about the measurement. 

OK, so like I was trying to point out earlier, those numbers are meaningless.  I could post on this well-respected forum that I once tested a 12 watt head unit and got 80 watts out of it.  But that means nothing as it was a one-time anomaly and the amplifier chips fried during the test.    All I'm saying is don't toss around things you might have read someplace, especially on forums, as "facts" unless they can be backed up.

And, back to the original controversy, in my experience Lanzar went from being flea-market crap when it first came out to being surprisingly good performers and a great value for the money during the 90's then back to being flea-market crap recently as part of Pyle.

I believe the 430 doing ~600 is factual, and even logical.

The 268 doing 900+ may seem awfully optimistic, but it is at least conceivable.  80w out of a 12w head unit is not.

That's all beside the point.  So you think I'm full of it...ok.

I've never heard/read Lanzar was weak early on.  I know from the late 80's to the early 90's they won multiple autosound awards and those amps still bring nice coin on Ebay, as do the later mid 90's-early 00's.  My brother built a VERY nice SQ comp worthy set up using 4 Lanzar Opti's and all Lanzar speakers in the early 90's.  They were impressive amps to say the least.  I've seen them mentioned repeatedly as some of the better amps that were ever built.  In the same class as SS, HF, Zapco, PPI of the day.

They remained high quality for a few years after the Sound Around buyout until they parted ways with Zed.  The Opti's are still widely regarded as quality amps, but not what they were 10-15 yrs ago.  It's all the other over-rated entry/budget stuff they're selling under the Lanzar brand (not sure where Pyle comes in) that will eventually turn Lanzar into another Sound Around bottom-feeder in spite of the Optidrive line.

I own a couple Lanzar's from the end of the Zed Audio era (02-03).  I can't see myself ever changing amps.

or here:

https://zedamps.com/aboutus.html#History