what are the top 3 speaker brands?
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=114030
Printed Date: May 11, 2024 at 7:48 PM
Topic: what are the top 3 speaker brands?
Posted By: bombsquad91
Subject: what are the top 3 speaker brands?
Date Posted: May 25, 2009 at 11:50 PM
I'm planning on upgrading my speakers in my '94 BMW 3 series coupe. Right now I have stock speakers with the factory amp. I have a Pioneer DEH-P9800BT head unit. Two Image Dynamics IDMax Dual 2ohm Voice Coil 12's in a slot ported box powered by an Alpine MRD-M605. I'm running it at 2ohms so it SHOULD be pulling 600watts max. I want to replace and amp all my interiors. Currently I have a 10 speaker system. I completely removed my rear deck speakers and left the grills. The cutouts from the speakers act like ports from the trunk. I'm custom mounting 6x9's in the rear panels, putting a 5.25" component system in the doors and the kick panels. I've been out of the game for awhile so my brand knowledge is a little antiquated. What is everyone's opinion on the top 3 brands for interior speakers? Thanks in advance.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Replies:
Posted By: tommy...
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 8:27 AM
What type of Amp are you going to use to power speakers...? There are several brands, but are you hooking everything up to one amp.?
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M.E.C.P & First-Class
Go slow and drink lots of water...Procrastinators' Unite...Tomorrow!
Posted By: soundnsecurity
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 9:09 AM
diamond audio makes some nice components. are you going to custom make the kickpanels? are you wanting a 2-way or 3-way component set?
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Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 9:11 AM
The amp you'll be using has VERY little to nothing to do with the final answer to this question. Everybody will have different ideas, this I promise you. Many members here (myself being one of the FIRST to tell you so) will tell you to avoid Focal like the plague, but we get many rookies showing up saying "Focals are the best". Well, my short and sweet to THIS opinion is that "Focals suck". Not that anybody else is wrong, but in my opinion, they suck... Overly bright to the point of being harsh, they just have never been anything that appeals to me, in ANY way...
It's your car. It's even more importantly, your EAR. There is no "best" in any kind of "off the shelf" in my opinion, but I QUITE like the JL VR series. Not the ZR, Dave? No, the ZR's have metal dome tweeters, which Dave hates, in EVERY implementation! (...and, the VR's actually have a smoother mid-range and a better mid to high blend, in my opinion...)
The best suggestion for is go to your local dealers, listen to what they have, and YOU decide. Be certain you take music YOU know well, and buy what sounds best to you. An additional suggestion, if I may. If you hear it there, and you like it there, BUY IT THERE. Don't go shopping "for a better price" on the 'net. Show a little bit of appreciation for that brick-and-mortar being there for you to make your decision.
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 10:47 AM
While I agree completely that you should go shopping and listen for yourself, I will try to answer your question. TO ME, the top three prefab component sets currently-available on the market are Morel, either the Elate Limited or the Supremo set, the Seas Lotus Reference RF165f, and the entire lineup from Rainbow. I have been very favorable impressed by the Alinco series from Phass. A notch down in price, I second haemphyst's recommendation of the JL VR series and I also like the Eclipse component series. ------------- Support the12volt.com
Posted By: audiocableguy
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 12:52 PM
Couldn't agree more about the Focal stuff. Harsh is a good description.
Just don't understand all the hype.
Big fan of the Seas Lotus and the Diamond. This is where personal taste and sitting down and listening comes into play. I passed on the Morel Elates for the Lotus. Is one better than another, No. Preference.
Support your local dealer.
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 2:06 PM
I'm probably going to use a 6 channel amp. I'm planning on putting in 3 2-way component sets. Custom kick panels, in the doors, and in the rear panels. The 3 brands i'm looking at are Boston Acoustics, JL, and Kappa Perfects.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 3:19 PM
bombsquad91 wrote:
I'm planning on putting in 3 2-way component sets. Custom kick panels, in the doors, and in the rear panels. .
In general that is not a good plan. Kick panels OR doors, but not full sets in both. ------------- Support the12volt.com
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 3:47 PM
Not to mention that the Bostons fit in my "not just no, but NO WAY!" category, and the Kappas are not NEARLY the gear that used to be - back when they were using the ribbon drivers. Today? They're mediocre at best, when asking me what we recommend.
Morel, Seas, JL, Diamond. There's four, and they've come up several times each...
If all you are looking for is SPL, then go with kicks and doors, but if you are going to do that, just go buy whatever two-way system Rockwood has on sale this week. We assumed you were interested in SQ. For a true sound quality install, ONE set, and one set ONLY. This means no rear deck, either. (IMO) Why spend all that money if you are gonna blow any imaging you might get from a high quality separates set?
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: tommy...
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 4:06 PM
Ditto most of above...So you are leaving speakers in rear/ports open? You said you currently have a 10 speaker system, you are replacing all factory speakers w/ aftermarket minus the rears.? You are putting 6x9 and a set of components in rear? Since your amp has little to do w/ this if nothing(was trying to get idea of what his gameplan was,make mental note to never ask what amp they are using before i recommend speakers). The JL sound awesome. Not a horrible price either. Support your local dealer, WE need it...! The end of Haemphyst post is spot on.
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M.E.C.P & First-Class
Go slow and drink lots of water...Procrastinators' Unite...Tomorrow!
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 4:49 PM
I think ima go with JL. Price and quality. I took out the rear deck speakers leaving 2 nice holes for my bass to come through. I'm putting a 2-way set in the doors, that's a definite. I want something for the kicks and rear panels. 6x9's or a component set in the rear panels. Maybe a tweeter-in-speaker 2-way for the kicks. And a JL G6600 to power them. So are you guys recommending a set of components in the doors and that's it? No other speakers?
By the way, what does everyone think of IDMax's?
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: ckeeler
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 5:02 PM
if you want SQ only use ONE set of front speakers. i dont recommend you put any speakers in the back at all.
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 6:10 PM
It's all about the audio path lengths. At the frequencies that components (as well as coaxials) produce, a difference in path length of even an inch and a haf to two inches can cause SIGNIFICANT smearing of the acoustic image.
Put a point in space where your ear is. Let's use the right ear. This is our reference. Now, measure the acoustic path to the mid. Let's just say it is 40 inches - fairly common and reasonable length for a mid-size sedan like your 3 Series. Now measure the length to where you want to install your tweeter - if you are installing high on the door, possibly 34 inches. Let's just say your crossover point is 3500Hz - again, typical. The wavelength of 3500Hz is .31 feet, about 3.8 inches. for every 4 inches the tweeter moves closer to or further from your ear, (referenced to the 40 inches of the mid-range driver) you need to reverse the input leads on the tweeter to keep the wavefronts at the crossover point in phase. This is a relatively easy fix for components.
Adding a full-range driver, an additional component set, or a coaxial speaker, you still have to do the polarity reversing thing for every 4 inches closer to or further from your ear, but because every frequency has a different wavelength, you might be constructive AT 3500Hz, but what about all the other frequencies the speakers are producing...? Now you get "suck-outs" where the frequencies are 180 degrees out of phase, and peaks where they are in phase... And I mean "in-phase" by the time they reach your ear. Moving your head will exacerbate the problem. Too many drivers will cause odd timing issues, ruin your front-stage, and generally sound like arse.
A true SQ system will ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS use as few drivers as possible. As few drivers as can be used to accurately produce the entire audio spectrum. Have you ever heard a really good set of horn speakers? (I'm not talking about the POS IDHorns under people's dashes - I'm asking about TRUE high-end home gear.) They are ONE driver - reproducing the ENTIRE bandwidth. All path lengths for all frequencies are PRECISELY the same length. One driver MOST accurately reproduces real life. Does your dog bark from three points in space? No, he barks from ONE point in space. This is the very reason you use one set of speakers in your car.
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 6:16 PM
Plus... it's cheaper!
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 6:18 PM
Sweet. I just got edumacated. If i'm putting in only one component set my budget changes. All I need now is a 2ch amp, so i'm looking to spend about $600 on a set of components. I want SQ and I also want volume. I have CRAAAAAAZY bass and I want my interiors to match it.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 6:32 PM
JL VR series with an Alpine PDX4.100. Bi-wire, and bi-amp... The JLs have the capabilities of being bi-wired... Four channels... Dude. SQ out the @$$. Individual gain controls for individual drivers to make it sound JUST like you want, you'll be in love with it! Take it from me, I'm using the 4.150 on my mid/tweets, and it's nothing short of AWESOME!
I might mention that I am using the VR tweeters in my system. I love them.
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 7:08 PM
Just to be sure: 4ch amp. Ch1 tweeter, Ch2 tweeter, Ch3 mid, Ch4 mid. But the crossover only has one input. Explain.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 7:19 PM
AHA!!! The VR series isn't bi-wire. The ZR series is. I understand now.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 7:30 PM
I'm going with the JL Audio ZR650-CSi components. Now, Alpine 4ch or JL Audio 4ch? Also, how loud will it be with one component set?
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 26, 2009 at 11:43 PM
OK... I stand corrected. The VR used to be bi-wirable, IIRC. If you are going with the ZR's I REALLY recommend a bi-wire -amp setup, as the tweeters WILL want some taming.
Both amps are very nice, I'm partial to the Alpine. The ICEPower amps are reaaaalllly nice sounding. :)
...yes, you are correct - mid1 to channel 1, mid2 to channel 2, tweeter1 to channel 3, and tweeter2 to channel 4.
Run all four channels full range (the mid-bass you can run hi-pass), and use the passive crossovers for all of the crossover functions. How loud will it be? Well, it's PLENTY loud in my car for my tastes, and my drivers are PAINFULLY inefficient.
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: bradinar
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 10:50 AM
haemphyst: I wonder if you could give me some advice on my setup. I am going to do a single set of components in my front door. I was thinking about mounting my tweeters in the A-pillar to try to bring the sound stage up some but I can't mount them there unless they face the windshield. Would this be a better way to go even though they are way off axis in that location or should I just try to get them up in the door panel as far as possible? Can you clarify the reversing phase for the tweeter thing alittle? Are you saying that you need to reverse the phase every four inches apart from the mid? So if it were 8 inches away it would be normal phase?
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 3:49 PM
Good question bro. I was a little unsure of that too.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: stevdart
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 8:35 PM
oops, bradinar, your post is all bold. Your tweets should be as close to the mids as you can get them, and as close to the same plane as possible...in general. The trick of "bringing up the soundstage" with A-pillar mounted tweets comes in the form of using a second set of 'super' tweets that are crossed over with the tweeters at about 10,000 Hz. Those top tweets can face the windshield when crossed over in that configuration, as that upper freq range might be described as the "airiness" of the sound. But that's probably more marketing to the lazy consumer than it is sound engineering principles. Work with the position of door components using all resources, first. And, don't rely on measuring...rely on what you hear. A tweeter that is eight inches away from it's sister midwoofer is too far away to be rightly called a sibling. Reverse and unreverse polarity to your heart's content, they are still too far apart. bombsquad91, you might think about upgrading that pioneer deck to Alpine or Eclipse...since you're saving money using this forum anyway! ------------- Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.
Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 8:55 PM
I second stevdart's opinion... When I said 4 inches, that was because of the wavelength (chosen arbitrarily) at 3500Hz. If your crossover point is different, you will have to figure the wavelength (and thus the reversal period) for your situation.
Don't put the tweeters in the A-pillars, please... I know it sounds wierd, but keep them as close together as possible, even if it means mounting the tweeters low in the door. It will sound FAR more homogenous, and really... BETTER!
As far as the reversal every 4 inches, yes, that would mean that if your tweeter's acoustic path length is 8 inches shorter than your mid's acoustic path length, it would mean that your tweeters would be wired as indicated on the crossover. AT 3500HZ! As I said, if your crossover point is different, your "mileage may vary". Note that I am NOT referring to the distance the drivers are located referenced to each other. I am referring specifically to the distance they are from your ear - the acoustic path length.
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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
Posted By: tommy...
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 9:11 PM
I remember from Mobile Dynamics they recommend doing a staircase effect...putting tweets in the farthest spot back and mids at next step closer to you...Is this a good idea for the doors or kickpanels...?
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M.E.C.P & First-Class
Go slow and drink lots of water...Procrastinators' Unite...Tomorrow!
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 27, 2009 at 9:41 PM
Upgrade my head unit??????? There is no upgrading from my head unit. 16 band digital EQ. Auto EQ which measures distance to speaker for staging. HPF, LPF, IPOD Control, Blue Tooth. I've had every brand out there at one point or another. This is by far the best. When I got thus HU I stopped using by beloved DEQ-7600. Upgrade? HA!
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: bradinar
Date Posted: May 28, 2009 at 4:05 PM
I really want to improve my imaging somehow. Of course my stock locations suck. My speakers are low in the door and if I mount the tweets to the door panel directly above the mids they will actually be pointing down due to the way the door panel is shaped. I was thinking about trying to build some kick panels but the parking brake lever is right in the way on drivers side. Has anyone ever built kick panels for the 97-03 chevy malibu? Does anyone have any other suggestions to get better imaging?
Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: May 28, 2009 at 4:10 PM
bombsquad91 wrote:
Upgrade my head unit??????? There is no upgrading from my head unit. 16 band digital EQ. Auto EQ which measures distance to speaker for staging. HPF, LPF, IPOD Control, Blue Tooth. I've had every brand out there at one point or another. This is by far the best. When I got thus HU I stopped using by beloved DEQ-7600. Upgrade? HA!
What are you using? All the processing you describe has nothing to do with the sound quality and indeed may be harming it. ------------- Support the12volt.com
Posted By: panerailover
Date Posted: May 29, 2009 at 9:08 AM
Agree with most. Focal are too bright. For SQ warm sound is the key. I hate speakers that are so bright you put trebble all the way down and it still hurts your ears. Dynoaudio and CDT Audio would be my choice. I hear a lot about Diamond and JL lately about SQ and warm sound
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01 Lexus GS430 SOLD.. 04 BMW 545i Sport, NAV Logic7
Posted By: Velocity Motors
Date Posted: May 30, 2009 at 8:31 AM
Man, where have I been while this post was going on ??  My 2 c's goes to Morel Dotechs or the Elate 3 ways for price. If you have money to spare go with the Supremo's. You won't be unhappy. Just make sure that you have enough power going to them and use a Class A/B amp to power them as well. As far as the Pionner HU's go....... IMO they suck !! Ground plane problems since day one, poor quality face plates & poor customer/dealer support. ------------- Jeff
Velocity Custom Home Theater
Mobile Audio/Video Specialist
Morden, Manitoba CANADA
Posted By: fiberglasslvr
Date Posted: May 30, 2009 at 5:57 PM
i personally like CDT's, Morel's, and Rainbow's
but like alot of things you should try and listen to them before you buy
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in process of changing everything
Posted By: tommy...
Date Posted: May 31, 2009 at 8:58 AM
I was hoping for more on the headunit...Oh well...Made a purchase yet...?
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M.E.C.P & First-Class
Go slow and drink lots of water...Procrastinators' Unite...Tomorrow!
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 31, 2009 at 8:51 PM
tommy... wrote:
I was hoping for more on the headunit...Oh well...Made a purchase yet...?
Sorry bro. Crazy weekend. What else do you want to know about the head unit?
------------- ".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 31, 2009 at 9:02 PM
Velocity Motors wrote:
Man, where have I been while this post was going on ??
My 2 c's goes to Morel Dotechs or the Elate 3 ways for price. If you have money to spare go with the Supremo's. You won't be unhappy. Just make sure that you have enough power going to them and use a Class A/B amp to power them as well.
As far as the Pionner HU's go....... IMO they suck !! Ground plane problems since day one, poor quality face plates & poor customer/dealer support.
IMHO Pioneer head units are the best. Never had alternator whine. Never had a faceplate problem. The features are amazing. The displays are sweet. I don't know about customer service cause i've never had a problem. In all honesty I have my Pioneer head unit because of the 16 band EQ and the display. But here's the bottom line: It's all about preference. Mobile audio is one of those subjects that is based solely on opinion and preference. There's no way to factually state one speaker is better than the other. Improperly tuned "top of the line" speakers can sound like doodie.....and properly tuned "bottom of the line" speakers can sound amazing. Stereos are based on preference first and setup second. You can go Best Buy or PC Richards all the way and if you set it up right it will sound great. I LIKE Pioneer head units. ------------- ".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: May 31, 2009 at 9:04 PM
As far as a purchase that's a couple months away. I've pretty much decided on JL bi-wire components and a JL 4ch.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: Velocity Motors
Date Posted: June 01, 2009 at 10:54 AM
Pioneer has been good in the past, don't get me wrong, but after being a dealer for them for 5 years and having a 5 % defective rate for a shop my size, it is not acceptable. My opinion is based solely on sales, installations & after sales service. It's great that you have had a goo experience with Pioneer and that you wil continue with a Pioneer HU in your vehicle, but from experience with the 100's of Pioneer decks that I've sold and installed, that would not be my first choice. The JL's are a good choice. ------------- Jeff
Velocity Custom Home Theater
Mobile Audio/Video Specialist
Morden, Manitoba CANADA
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: June 01, 2009 at 12:34 PM
Velocity Motors wrote:
Pioneer has been good in the past, don't get me wrong, but after being a dealer for them for 5 years and having a 5 % defective rate for a shop my size, it is not acceptable. My opinion is based solely on sales, installations & after sales service. It's great that you have had a goo experience with Pioneer and that you wil continue with a Pioneer HU in your vehicle, but from experience with the 100's of Pioneer decks that I've sold and installed, that would not be my first choice.
The JL's are a good choice.
Thanks bro. You prove my point totally. Different people have different experiences with different products. Just out of curiosity, what is your favorite head unit. Not necessarily what you would reccomend to your customers, but YOUR favorite. ------------- ".....um, is that wire hot?"
Posted By: Velocity Motors
Date Posted: June 01, 2009 at 1:28 PM
From past installations my favorite has been the F1 Status HU from Alpine paired with the preocessor. I still have this in our show car, but for everyday driving, I like the Clarion stuff. If I did another show vehicle, I'd say I would go with a McIntosh ------------- Jeff
Velocity Custom Home Theater
Mobile Audio/Video Specialist
Morden, Manitoba CANADA
Posted By: bombsquad91
Date Posted: June 01, 2009 at 3:55 PM
I just checked out the Alpine F1 Status stuff. It's really SICK bro!!! I don't like the display but the EQ on the PXI-H990 is amazing.
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".....um, is that wire hot?"
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