jl 500/1 doesn’t sound right

I am already pretty sure of the answer, but I will ask anyways. I have the oldschool JL 500/1 mono block and I just wired a 10w6v2 up to it. I have played with all of the settings on the amp, starting at the recommended settings in the JL videos and I know the wiring is right because I verified it myself. The problem is, as I am told, the amp is "clipping." I have no idea what that means, but it isn't working like it used to. It still produces bass, but it isn't pushing the driver like I know it can.

It's in an 06 f150, factory headunit, 8g wire running to d-block w/ 8g wires running to JL amp and component amp. I have a 1.2 farad cap that I will be installing and I just ordered a 4g wiring kit. I am doing this because I assume it is "clipping" because it isn't getting the voltage it needs to push the driver.

I just want to make sure that the amp isn't trash (because I can never get a hold of a JL specialist) and if it is, can I fix it myself?

Clipping is squaring off of audio sine waves and can be caused by multiple things. How do you have your gain set? If it is too high then you will push your amp into clipping because it is trying to pull more than it can handle.

Also, with clipping there is often audible distortion. If it just is not as loud as it use to be you could have your sub in a different wiring configuration than you had before. In series you you get higher resistance and less power and in parallel it would be the opposite.

Eight gauge wiring should suffice for about 500 watts, but the bigger the conductor the better.

It could be the way you integrated into the factory system. Did you use an LOC? Most of them are adjustable and it could be possible that it is on the lowest setting.

Just check those few things and write back if you need additional ideas.

-------------
MECP Advanced
Make your life easier and buy a DMM.

the fact that you have a singe 8Ga wire trying to run 2 separate amps could be the problem, and ive got a hunch that their grounds are probably not that good either. depending on what the other amp you have is, you could be trying to pull way too much current through that small wire and thats if it is actually a true 8ga. this can cause your amp to clip too because it is trying to keep up with what you want it to do but it just cant get enough when it really needs it. over time this can also cause your amp to fail.


-------------

Oh yea! I forgot he was using two amps!!! Eight gauge won't work well at all! That JL would be about all you should run on 8. And like security said it may not be actuall 8 gauge. If you skimped on the wire and went cheap you probably have about 10-12 gauge.

-------------
MECP Advanced
Make your life easier and buy a DMM.

It is true 8g wire, I bought it from a stand up car audio store (plus it was like $60). I had read some stuff about the wiring and thought that may be one of the problems.

I forgot to quote you, but yes I would say that the amp is at least 1/2 as loud. Before it was pushing 2 10w3v2s, but I figure that the 10w6v2 is a much better driver and would be louder than both of those.

Yeah I used LOCs. I checked and they don't have gain adjustment.

As for gain adjustment on the 500/1, it is set at about 1/4. All of the other settings are now set well below the recommended JL starting point for audio tuning.

A single w6 will probably not outperform 2 w3s with the same power. The w6 is a better speaker, but it requires more power.

hmm, so you switched from two 10's to a single 10 and you are wondering why its not as loud. have you ever though to point your finger at the enclosure you have that W6 sitting in? as far as sound is concerned, you just completely changed your system.

the output that you get out of a sub is much less dependent on how much power you give it than on how well it works with its enclosure. you can have the best sub in the world, but if you pair it with a mismatched box then you will still get garbage output.

for starters, was the old setup sealed or ported? is the new setup sealed or ported?

also, is the low output the only reason that you believe your amp is "clipping"? does your amp cut in and out while playing music? do any of the protection status lights on the amp light up at any time? if so then you should try to describe in detail what that is or isnt doing. just saying that the amp is clipping or the volume is low is not much to go on from a troubleshooting stand point.



-------------

soundnsecurity wrote:

---

hmm, so you switched from two 10's to a single 10 and you are wondering why its not as loud. have you ever though to point your finger at the enclosure you have that W6 sitting in? as far as sound is concerned, you just completely changed your system.

the output that you get out of a sub is much less dependent on how much power you give it than on how well it works with its enclosure. you can have the best sub in the world, but if you pair it with a mismatched box then you will still get garbage output.

for starters, was the old setup sealed or ported? is the new setup sealed or ported?

also, is the low output the only reason that you believe your amp is "clipping"? does your amp cut in and out while playing music? do any of the protection status lights on the amp light up at any time? if so then you should try to describe in detail what that is or isnt doing. just saying that the amp is clipping or the volume is low is not much to go on from a troubleshooting stand point.

---

The old enclosure was a JL High Output box specifically made for the 10w3v2s. It was sealed and the whole setup was installed in my Civic HB. The new setup is a sealed box that replaced my center console in my extended cab F150. It is also sealed and it is a down firing box.

So the differences in the setups are quite extreme, but I know something is wrong with the amp because when I had it in my Civic, I literally had to turn down the gain and bass boost because it was TOO loud. I know a portion of that had to do with it being a HB. Now, with the amp in my truck, it doesn't sound right. Plus, it is shutting off when it is hitting if you have the volume at 2/3 and above. It will cut out and come right back on. I tried the 4g wiring kit yesterday and it didn't seem to change anything.

Oh, and I forgot to say that the loudness isn't that important. I want it to cover the bass range that it is capable of doing.

well, at least we're getting somewhere now. first, if im not mistaken, all JL HO boxes are ported. so you went from two subs ported in a hatchback with 500W to a single sub SEALED in a center console of an F150.

as far as you amp cutting out all you can do is make sure all the wiring is correct and the sub is good. a couple things to check are: is there any voltage drop at the amp when the system is playing and shutting off, is your ground good and is it in a good spot, make sure the ground is not just on a seatbelt bolt or screwed to a metal sheet that only glued to the frame and not actually part of the frame. make sure the sub is good and that the amp is seeing a good ohm load, that amp is rated to give you 500W between 1.5 and 4 ohms so if your sub is sitting above or below that range then that could be part of your problem.

also, check your RCAs to make sure they are not smashed or damaged somewhere along the way. if you have a spare set then you can run a temporary line from the radio to the amp and check if it still cuts out


-------------

The HO box I had was sealed. But, as for the spot in my truck being good, the jump seat/center console was replaced with the current sealed box. It has 1.1 cu ft of space, which is double what is suggested for that driver. In my experience, a little more room is good so that you can get some of the lower tones that you might not usually get. But, the sub is down-firing directly onto the driveshaft tunnel, which may be part of the problem.

As for the ohm load, I removed the sub from the box and visually verified that it is wired at 2 ohms. I don't think the RCA's are smashed or crimped at all, I ran them through the factory spots for wiring. And they are shielded from all the other wiring, I used that plastic wiring covering that you can buy from Lowes/Home Depot. The grounds are behind the seat belt mounting bolts on the back wall of the cab, below the window. I made sure to remove any paint from the metal to ensure a good ground. The ground wires are the same size as my power wire coming in, and when I fully wire up the 4g kit I will be replacing the ground wires with some of the 4g.

I seriously thought that my power wires were the problem, and I will have to post pics of my setup so that you can take a look at everything once I get some time to install the 4g kit. If there is anything else I can cover to help you help me, let me know. But I think we have gone through just about everything! Haha. I will make sure to do some voltage and ohm checks tomorrow while it's running and post my findings for review.

Thanks again for helping me figure this out, it is driving me nuts and the wife is getting mad that I am spending all of this money and it still isn't doing what I want.

you cant assume that giving any given sub more or less (especially double or half) airspace will work better than the box in the specs. in some cases it works out good but others not so good. its funny that you mention poor output from a sealed box and a JL sub. when i first got my 8W7 i was in a hurry to hear it so i built just a plain ol box that was originally spec'd to be ported but i got lazy and ended up with a sealed box that was close to 1 cubic foot more or less and it sounded horrible. way too much airspace, the output was low and distorted on heavy notes and this is their top of the line W7 we're talking about!

about a week goes by and i get the time to make the right box which was still about the same rough size externally but i added the port that i originally planned to have and the difference in output was amazing. it went from sounding like a typical 8 inch sub to sounding like i had a pair of 12's and it didnt distort on heavy notes anymore.

also, having your amps grounded to the back wall is not a good ground. the back wall is one of those places i mentioned that are really just glued on and might have a few tack welds. try moving the ground to the floor and try to keep them as short as possible, more the amps lower if possible.

oh, and did your HO box look like this? if it did then it IS ported, just not how you would think

-------------

No, my box looked like the one pictured in this ad:

https://www.lancerregister.com/showthread.php?t=314026

I'll change the placement of the grounds since I bought some wood today to change the position of the amps. They will be closer to the floor of the cab. I guess I will disassemble the box and remake it to change the position of the woofer and get the space right as well.

oh ok, that style box is pretty old i used to have one with 2 original W6's but that was at least 6 years ago. and i still wouldn't go off building another box until you get your amps straightened up because they still could be the problem. if you can get it to not cut off anymore and it still sounds like that then you might have a real problem.

-------------

Ok, well I finally got everything wired up in the truck. 4g kit to distro box, distro to cap and 2 amps. Amps are grounded through the cap and I have a good ground on the floorboard of the cab where the lower portion of the back seat mounts to the floorboard.

After wiring everything up, the JL amp wasn't turning on. I thought it may have been the 12v ACC wire since I had spliced it off of one source. So, I ran a new wire from another 12v source that I know is good and it still doesn't turn on. So, I ordered the Sound Ordnance M-1350 from Crutchfield, I will be wiring it in this weekend.

I appreciate the help from everyone and I apologize that it took so long to get back on and update. If anyone wants the old JL for parts or whatever, hit me up.

The ground wire on the amps needs to be as short as possible.  Each amp and the cap should have their own separate ground for optimum performance. 

Do you have the Signal Sense switch set to on or off?

Signal sensing is off, I don't have that connector. I bought the amp used.