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inexpensive subs

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=130531
Printed Date: October 06, 2022 at 4:11 PM


Topic: inexpensive subs

Posted By: 04nata
Subject: inexpensive subs
Date Posted: February 06, 2012 at 3:11 PM

What make an inexpensive subwoofer cheap?

I mean there are some PYLE and Hifonics subs out there that are dirt cheap and have very similar specs to the JL's of the world, so why are they so inexpensive?

I have heard they are crap, like Pyle, Lanzar, Power Accoustic and Hifonics, but never bought one to test and see for myself, so what make this a not good sub?



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2004 Hyundai Sonata
Kenwood KDC-X599 HU
2-Sundown X-18D4
2-SQ Q4500.1
2-SQ Q90.4
1-Massive DBX4
8-Niche 5.25 mids
8-Niche Tweeters
4-Skar 8" mid-bass
OhioGen 220a alt
OhioGen 350a alt
156.0



Replies:

Posted By: lspker
Date Posted: February 06, 2012 at 8:28 PM

Quality of componets and assembly, engineering or lack there of,  It's easy to pick parts out of a catalog and have some assemble them create spec around them.  quality and consistancy of product.  Length of product life cycle, some companies change  every six month to year other have same sub for 5 years or more (not counting cosmetuc changes)

Of course you can't forget about market placement and image, more $ means better (?)

Gone are the days where cost of a product determines its sale price, now the marketing department figure the sale price and engineering figures out how to reduce the cost.

Greed





Posted By: 04nata
Date Posted: February 06, 2012 at 9:23 PM

So as I try to understand this "miss-leading" advertising, what would be the issue with say, these 3 subs over a noted "good" brand? would it be longevity, sound, distortion?

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posted_image

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I am just trying to understand this,

I mean Rockford Fosgate is good right? comparable to JL?

I want to make sure I completely understand before I buy anything else



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2004 Hyundai Sonata
Kenwood KDC-X599 HU
2-Sundown X-18D4
2-SQ Q4500.1
2-SQ Q90.4
1-Massive DBX4
8-Niche 5.25 mids
8-Niche Tweeters
4-Skar 8" mid-bass
OhioGen 220a alt
OhioGen 350a alt
156.0




Posted By: oldspark
Date Posted: February 07, 2012 at 2:21 AM
LOL! I'm thinking of my old rule - if they don't quote Watts RMS, stay away. (What's 1500W Max? 750W RMS? 375W RMS? Or some "arbitrary" factor?)




Posted By: xchrisx
Date Posted: February 07, 2012 at 6:13 PM
Honestly, I don't really judge until I've heard it for myself. I currently have 2 12" Lanzar Max12D 1000Watt subs. I only bought them because they were $32 each and I just wanted something that I could have some sound with, nothing major. Well let me tell you, these subs pound, sure they aren't the clearest sounding bass, but I also have them in a ported box and they sound decent. I have put them in my brothers car in a sealed box and it wasn't too bad either. I have had the subs for over a year and daily beat them each with a Crossfire XP600D amp and have them each wired to 1ohm on their own amp and am hitting legitimately on a meter 140.1dB. So honestly I cant say that just because they are cheap means they are junk. I have also used ...(just a random cheaper brand)Power Acoustik subs, speakers, amps and headunits and I would still recommend them to people because they were pretty good, among other brands of cheaper equipment. I have also used high end equipment and based on the price of what was paid for some of the high end stuff, I would never recommend it again because it wasn't worth it or I have heard something that is cheaper and sounds just as good. Honestly what it boils down to is there will be 1 person who had a bad experience with an unknown product or cheaply priced product and 40 people who have never used that equipment will jump on the bandwagon and say its crap too, but that's just human nature ya know.

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BP




Posted By: 04nata
Date Posted: February 08, 2012 at 8:03 AM
what about PYLE.  is the generak rule for thier stuff still    PYLE=   Pile of Crap fro all thier stuff, cuz they make some really nice "looking" subs

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2004 Hyundai Sonata
Kenwood KDC-X599 HU
2-Sundown X-18D4
2-SQ Q4500.1
2-SQ Q90.4
1-Massive DBX4
8-Niche 5.25 mids
8-Niche Tweeters
4-Skar 8" mid-bass
OhioGen 220a alt
OhioGen 350a alt
156.0




Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: February 08, 2012 at 11:23 AM

04nata wrote:

PYLE=   Pile of Crap fro all thier stuff

That would be my opinion.



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Support the12volt.com




Posted By: jmelton86
Date Posted: February 09, 2012 at 7:50 AM

I hear good things about those cheap Hifonics subs.

The only negative I hear is the basket is so thin that if you aren't careful when you mount them, they can bend.



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2013 Kia Rio -90a alternator
DDX470HD GTO14001 GTO1014D (x3)
Big3 in 1/0G
1/0G to GTO14001




Posted By: soundnsecurity
Date Posted: February 11, 2012 at 2:14 PM
basically what it boils down to is materials and craftsmanship, honestly rated specs, durability under stress, and personally i think looks is another category. and looks works the opposite of how you think it would because usually the more basic design with the least frills ends up being the better product. if you have to chrome plate the whole sub just to sell it then it probably is a POS. better materials = better rubber, better glue, properly engineered voice coil, stronger cone material ( not just a stronger shape thats made from cheap material) and these are all things that you usually cant see with your eyes but you see it in the price. and honestly rated specs is a big one too. that 1500 watt MAX POWER!!!!! subwoofer is probably 300 rms and these are the only specs they usually will give you because the company doesnt care enough to inform the customer so they can use their product propperly. this is because they know that in most cases their product will break anyway so why give them any real specs because they are just looking to make a quick buck and move on. and the other spec they will usually give you is efficency because it is a commonly missunderstood spec and they label this spec "SPL" to make it even more missleading. they use to make you believe that one sub will be louder than the other because it has more DB and more Watts so it must be better, right?

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Posted By: oldspark
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 12:36 AM
A mate gave me a Kicker for parts. I was quite impressed with the quality. (Typical SMPS-chip power supply + amp; good connector quality, soldering, layout etc.)

Not that I am into amps etc, but I too have heard that "cheap is cheap (crap)".
I wonder if Kicker quote RMS output (that's one of my "quality" references)?
And with SMPS, they shouldn't vary output with input voltage (eg, from (say) 12V to 14.4V etc) - I still don't understand how amps that must be using SMPS etc increase output power with input voltage (in direct ratio - ie, as if the amp behaves like a resistor).




Posted By: soundnsecurity
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 8:53 AM
kicker amps arent cheap but i dont care if it looks good on the inside or if the use good components because in my experience they break way too easily.
and ive had my fill of cvr subs. yea they sound ok but they cant handle any abuse. and thanks to the geniuses at the kicker marketing dept durability is why a lot of people flock to kicker only to be let down by the cvr and L5. common problems ive seen on a regular basis are the cones coming unglued from the voice coil, the voice coil coming unwound when it gets a little hot, the stitched surround coming unstitched, and the cone likes to crack under stress (mainly the square woofers but ive seen the round cones crack too).

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Posted By: haemphyst
Date Posted: February 25, 2012 at 5:59 PM
thedirt520 wrote:

I blew alot of cvr 12s in my days, but when I switched to 15s (had 6 sets so far) I've never blown one, had my pair now for 3 years, didn't break them in just thru them in and turned them up

There's no such thing as "breaking in" to prevent damage. Period. Here's the best thread I've seen discussed here...

From that thread:
DYohn] wrote:

ou folks may be misinterpreting what speaker break-in is all about. It is not some magical thing that is necessary for the drivers to operate properly, it is simply a natural phenomenon that occurs in ALL loudspeakers whether you like it or not as they are used. The soft parts become more compliant and the speaker operates better, moves more freely, sounds better, etc. It is not a myth and it is not BS it is physics. Period.


All your experience proves is that you got it close enough to right the first time, it does not prove anything at all about the reliability or durability of your chosen woofer.

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It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."




Posted By: 04nata
Date Posted: February 25, 2012 at 8:02 PM

Well I bought the Niche Audio 15"s, and so far I am as happy as a "nymph in a brothel" with them.

I broke them in for all of about 10 minutes and just couldn't stand it any longer, turned on the sound meter and cranked em' up. They still sound good, and if they go bad, I get new ones free of charge within 2 years. and it's local, no waiting !!!!!!!!!



-------------
2004 Hyundai Sonata
Kenwood KDC-X599 HU
2-Sundown X-18D4
2-SQ Q4500.1
2-SQ Q90.4
1-Massive DBX4
8-Niche 5.25 mids
8-Niche Tweeters
4-Skar 8" mid-bass
OhioGen 220a alt
OhioGen 350a alt
156.0




Posted By: Ravendarat
Date Posted: March 04, 2012 at 1:38 AM
thedirt520 wrote:

I'm aware what the break in period is for and why it's important, all I was stating was what I've encounter from using my subs
At the risk of sounding like a dick, clearly you don't know what break in is or else you wouldn't have made the previous statement about how you didn't "break in your subs, you just threw em in and ran em". You did "break them in" because you used them and the materials becoming softer and looser over time just from using them. There is no special way to do it, there is no special rule about playing them at moderate volumes for the first 30 hours or any of that garbage. Lastly its not important, its gonna happen no matter what, regardless of what you do within reason. As was the quote posted above you explained this and that thread that was linked to in that same post is a great discussion of all this and something anyone new, or anyone into this as a big time hobby or job, should read.

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double-secret reverse-osmosis speaker-cone-induced high-level interference distortion, Its a killer





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