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Polarity test with DMM

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=52992
Printed Date: May 10, 2024 at 6:13 AM


Topic: Polarity test with DMM

Posted By: evanc
Subject: Polarity test with DMM
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 11:16 AM

Is there any way to check the polarity of speakers using a DMM?




Replies:

Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 11:45 AM
Nope.  What is it exactly you need to check, system wiring polarity or speaker terminal polarity?

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Posted By: evanc
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 11:57 AM

System wiring.  I hooked up 4 12" perfects off a JBL 1200.1 (2 2ft^3 boxes, 2 per box) and every once in a while it seems as if the bass skips a beat or the subs start popping.  Its more on punchy notes, long drawn out notes don't tend to do that.  I am hoping it has something to do with the polarity on 1 sub causing that. 

My radio is the Eclipse 8454, and the gain on the amp is turned up 1/3 of the way, which I know is wrong since it is then assuming somewhere around a 2 volt signal when it is getting 8. 

Could the amp be going into protect mode on those notes, and if so, why can it get louder on longer notes on the same frequency?   I plan to play with the gains a bit more this weekend if the polarity doesn't fix my problem (which I don't think that it will)  I am going to be purchasing a DMM today or this weekend to do some tests on this to learn more though.

Any other suggestions on how to alleviate this problem are welcome. 





Posted By: evanc
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 12:01 PM

I also want to clarify one thing... the reason I have the amp turned up (No bass boost) is because right now the front speakers are being amplified by the radio and the factory amp.  At the end of the day today, I will have the front speakers running off a seperate amplifier, which should give me some more flexibility in amp setting...





Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 12:02 PM

Polarity is not your problem.  More likely the amp is going into protection due to 1) impedence load is too low, or 2) input gain is too high, or 3) system voltage is dropping too low.  4 speakers, eh?  What's the net impedence on the amp?  Also the maximum input voltage this amp is rated to handle is 4 volts, so your gain should be all the way 'down" and if your HU can generate 8 volts you will still clip the amp if the HU volume is turned up too far.

A series of quick peaks places more strain on an amplifier than a sustained tone.  The peak at the attack edge (the beginning) of the note is what places the strain on the amp.



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Posted By: evanc
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 12:18 PM

Well, the drivers themselves are 4ohm SVC.  Wired together in parallel should give me a load of 1 ohm, which the amp "should" be able to handle.  Right?

The system voltage should be fine.  I have a 200 amp alt in, and although without an DMM I can't test it, I have yet to see the lights dim.

With what you said about the amp clipping even though it may be all the way turned down, is there something I should add on to lower the voltage?  I am careful with my stuff and can hear the subs clipping, and will immediately turn it down if this situation does arise.  However, if it would be benefical for me to do that, I most certainly will.  With the said, is there another amp that may be better suited to my application?

And I was unaware of the fact of the "attack edge" places the most strain on the amp, which is good to know. 

Thanks for all your help...





Posted By: TruckSystem
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 2:25 PM
Since your on the subject of gains and preamp voltage I want to add a question here too. I am running an Alpine CDA-9827 deck with 4 volt signal out into a Diamond Audio D3600.1 which is in turn running a pair of CM310D4s that are wired for a 1 ohm load. Should the gain be all the way down on this setup?

Thanks in advance.




Posted By: evanc
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 2:32 PM
From what I hear, Alpine decks do not put out a constant 4 volt signal.  It is more like 2.5-3.  Again, this is what I hear, no actual facts behind this.  It just may help in your calculations.




Posted By: TruckSystem
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 2:39 PM
That wouldn't suprise me really, it was a pretty budget unit costing me about $200 last month from my local shop. It was the the least I could spend and still have MP3 playback capability, which was one of the big reasons for me upgrading from the factory deck. The amp gain is set at about 1/4 of the way up for the time being unless someone else has a suggestion.

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2003 Chevrolet Silverado Standard Cab ~ Alpine CDA-9851
Diamond Audio D3600.1 ~ 2x Diamond Audio TM310D4
Diamond Audio D3400.4 ~ Diamond Audio Hex S600s
AstroStart RS5204 Remote Start/Alarm




Posted By: evanc
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 3:19 PM
Well, do you hear distortion/clipping?  If so, then turn it down.  If it sounds good and you don't hear anythign wrong with it, then you should be alright.  I doubt that with it turned up only that much it'd be clipping, but I am not expert like a lot of these other guys are.




Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 3:28 PM

The BP1200.1 can normally handle a 1-ohm load, although the distortion numbers go through the roof at that low loading.  Some BP-series amps will not remain stable at 1-ohm, so it could be that.

To both posters above: you cannot, repeat CANNOT set yuor amplifier gain by guessing what the HU output might be and then simply adjusting the pot to, oh, about that point.  You must set it up so that the amplifier input sensitivity matches the HU output.  This requires meters and experience to do it properly, but it can be done by ear using a method described in this forum multiple times.  A quick search found this thread, as an example.  There are others as well.

In the case of a high-voltage HU like the Eclipse, you can use it with an old design low-voltage amp as long as you never turn the HU volume up too high.  You can discover the point of max output by setting the amp gain to minimum and slowly turning up the HU while playing a test tone until you hear the tone change (amplifier begins to clip.)  This would indicate your new MAX HU VOLUME.  Or get a new amp designed for high voltage input.



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Posted By: TruckSystem
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 3:29 PM
It doesn't destort or clip as far as I can tell, just trying to wring as much power out of the setup as I can without that happening is all.

I am not sure how to set up the rest of the amp really either, it has a -18db to +18db control as well which I keep in the middle at +/-0db, a subsonic filter which I keep off, and a crossover from 40 to 150 which I have at about 80 but am wondering if it can be adjusted to pick up lower bass notes somehow, the deck can be adjusted from 60 to 100.

The input range on this amp is 250mV to 3V by the way, so maybe having the amp gain off is a good idea.

Thanks for the suggestions so far, I should have time this weekend to do some tweaking and see what happens.

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2003 Chevrolet Silverado Standard Cab ~ Alpine CDA-9851
Diamond Audio D3600.1 ~ 2x Diamond Audio TM310D4
Diamond Audio D3400.4 ~ Diamond Audio Hex S600s
AstroStart RS5204 Remote Start/Alarm




Posted By: TruckSystem
Date Posted: April 01, 2005 at 3:37 PM
I don't own a DMM but I can probably borrow one this weekend, givin your numbers on the other thread I have a 1 ohm load and should be getting 600 watts, which means 24.5 volts to achieve that right? As far as a test tone can these be aquired online somewhere? Will run a search when I am at home tonight.

Thanks for the response.

-------------
2003 Chevrolet Silverado Standard Cab ~ Alpine CDA-9851
Diamond Audio D3600.1 ~ 2x Diamond Audio TM310D4
Diamond Audio D3400.4 ~ Diamond Audio Hex S600s
AstroStart RS5204 Remote Start/Alarm





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