6 Free-air Subs with Pics
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=72514
Printed Date: April 28, 2024 at 11:03 PM
Topic: 6 Free-air Subs with Pics
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Subject: 6 Free-air Subs with Pics
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 2:39 PM
We did a job for a quy last week and he wanted 6 kicker free-air 12s installed in his car with an old punch 200 DSM. Now, the speakers were well used as was the subs. We built the box and 3 12s on each side facing each other and tunneled up into his back seat. Now, my question is since they are free-air and we did put them in sort of a box does the box have to be air tight? Once you see the pics you will understand what I am asking a little better. Anyways it sounded like crap and the subs would crap out with the smallest amount of bass. is that because the box is not air tight or because like what I think the subs are shoot out and needs to look for something else. the guy called and told me that the box is leaking and thats why it sounds like crap. Look at the pics and any questions I will try to answer and input would be great. Now there is a top on it. We glued, screwed and nailed it together but no chaulk we did not think since being a free-air system and the box was not for air space air tight was not an issue.
Thanks
Wade
Replies:
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 3:05 PM
Wade, free air is another word for infinate baffle. This type of sub needs NO box. however it is extremely important that you in no way hear what's coming off the BACK of the sub. A better way to do this install would be to build an MDF baffle board the exact size of the rear seat back. Mount the subs facing the rear seat and allow the entire trunk to act as the box. When you can hear what's coming off the rear of the sub you are basically out phasing the speaker and all the bass disappears.
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There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 3:26 PM
Well the reason behind this box is because we cound not get the 6 subs to fit. Now we did put a baffel along the back seat. here is a pic
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 3:34 PM
It looks from here that you are resticting the air behind the subs which is the opposite of what you want to do. I would ditch the box, cut 12" holes in the baffle board for as many twelves as will fit and take a listen. If 3 or 4 sound good versis 6 that sound awful I think that will convince your customer which way is best and it should be easy for you to try. ------------- There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 3:54 PM
Well I do not have a pic from the inside but, that fron baffel has a whole about I don't remember but like 10x12 or so. that was not a good pic becuse the system was not complete but there is a whole cut in the front baffel that leads into his back seat. Now, we did metion to him that we need to mount the subs they way you suggested but, we could not get all six to fit and this is how he wanted them. You know how those dudes are the don't understand why what they want wont work and what you suggested is stupid and not going to work. So, we just built what he wanted. sorry about the pic but, I thought I had one that showed the cut out in the front baffel.
Thanks
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 4:50 PM
I know exactly what you mean. When a customer overides my opinion on settup and it sounds like azz well to bad.
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There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 7:22 PM
So, do you thing that whole being in that front baffel is good enough? i don't claim to know all about car audio but, enough to know if something is going to sound good after I am done. If the customer has decent stuff you know. Thanks
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 7:49 PM
No, you might be missunderstanding what I'm trying to say. You cut a whole for EACH speaker. mount the speaker physically to the baffle board and fire it into the rear seatback. You might be only able to get 2 or 3 of them on the baffle board space wise but that's the way it goes. The idea being twofold, first the woofers are opened up to the entire trunk's capacity and second none of the sound off of the back of the sub gets into the car. It's an easy fix and should work without wasting too much more of your time. Good luck.
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There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 8:19 PM
Naw man, I understand exactly what you mean and I thought by putting a top on that thing we built and mounting it to the front baffel we would be good. If he calls back I will let him know again that we can get 3 in there and do it the right way. But, these guys here just want to fit 10 pounds of crap in a 5 pound bag you know. What sux the most is that when people look at it and say thats not going to work why did you take it to them the customer will not say well its what I wanted and they told me the right way to do it but I did not want to. He will say well I just dropped the car off and this is what they did and he will fail to mention that he drew out what he wanted it to look like. Thanks Wade
Posted By: t-roy81
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 8:41 PM
off topic but how do you tell if a sub is free air will it say it or can any sub go free air? ------------- Oh Man Theres Troy
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 09, 2006 at 8:50 PM
No a sub would definately say free air on the box and literature. They're arent many around anymore because of space restrictions. JL just introduced a new one for boats. That's about the only application where there is still enough room to make them useful. Wade, when a customer makes me build something I know won't work I make them sign a form that says they have to pay me regardless of sound quality and have to pay me again to fix it. You would be surprised how many people reconsider. I feel for ya man. Bob ------------- There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: monorail
Date Posted: February 10, 2006 at 3:40 AM
tcss]w wrote:
en a customer makes me build something I know won't work I make them sign a form that says they have to pay me regardless of sound quality and have to pay me again to fix it. You would be surprised how many people reconsider.
That's a very good idea. Personally I'd probably tell the dude to take a hike... but I don't do this for a living either.
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 10, 2006 at 7:28 AM
Well my brother and I are trying to get enough customers where we can go full time so, we try to do anything with in reason. The six kicker system has made us decide not to work with 8 year stuff anymore. I never thought of the signing the form which now we will do. People see what we can do with with new stuff or aleast equipment that works and we know works. this dude bought these subs and amp for a $100. So, TCSS my man this is what we are going to do if they guy calls back and wants it done right like we tried to tell him when he asked us what we thought we are going to run 3 12s across the rear seat seal that baffel up to the rear seat back to keep the trnk from getting into the cab.
Thanks
Wade
Thanks
Wade
Posted By: tcss
Date Posted: February 10, 2006 at 11:16 AM
Keep plugging away Wade, from your pictures it looks like you and your brother do quality work. I've been doing this for 31 years and when I hit the button and something I've done sounds great it still gives me a rush. Don't know what I'd do if I had to get a real job!
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There is no such thing as free installation!
Posted By: Walkercustoms
Date Posted: February 10, 2006 at 1:58 PM
No kidding I have one and it sux. i am just waiting on my house to go through and I have already talked to a guy that is going to hook me up with a spot right on the highway.
Thanks
Posted By: Paradigm
Date Posted: February 10, 2006 at 7:38 PM
Sort of off topic, but I used a 15" Pyle free-air sub in a box that was well over 10 cubic feet in volume and I thought it sounded rather rightous. It was for a home theater setup that I had out in my parent's garage (that I had sort of converted into a movie room). Since the box was so freaking huge I think the sub acted as if it was in an infinite baffle setup. It was also ported, by the way. The reason why it was so huge is because, since it was one of my first adventures into box building (over 15 years ago), I didn't get the calculations right for 1.5 cubic feet. Guess I should have known when the front on the box was almost as tall as I was (6'-2". Me, not the box  ). I would have to agree with what tcss is saying. Just make sure that you get the baffle as air tight to the back of the seat as possible. Any leak to the front air space could cause some sound issues. ------------- VEHICLE: 2002 GMC Sonoma ZR2
Alpine CDA-7940
AudioControl EQT x2
JL Audio 1000/1
JL Audio 10W6 (originals) x3
Kicker ZR120
Kicker ZR460
Polk GXR-6 x4
Polk GXR-4 x2
Posted By: fillupmyfocus
Date Posted: February 11, 2006 at 1:00 AM
Kappa Perfects are free-air. They kinda thump. You could go with a midbass driver like the Kicker SSMB8 8" midbass driver which isn't a true sub but will put the guitars in your face and fill in the gaps. Also you could try old free air kicker 8" subs. Ebay maybe. Good luck.
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floridaengineer@gmail.com
Posted By: DYohn
Date Posted: February 11, 2006 at 2:14 PM
t-roy81 wrote:
off topic but how do you tell if a sub is free air will it say it or can any sub go free air?
Any speaker can be mounted IB, but only high-Q low-fs drivers really work well in this alignment. Also, the power handling must be de-rated to strict thermal limits and sometimes manufacturers are reluctant to publish those. For descriptions of IB mounting, start HERE. ------------- Support the12volt.com
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