jbl vs css vs mb quart
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Audio
Forum Discription: Car Stereos, Amplifiers, Crossovers, Processors, Speakers, Subwoofers, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=94696
Printed Date: May 17, 2024 at 5:17 AM
Topic: jbl vs css vs mb quart
Posted By: 3000dclass
Subject: jbl vs css vs mb quart
Date Posted: June 11, 2007 at 4:32 PM
Ok, price is deffinatly a factor for me. So I think I have narrowed down my choices to these three brands.
For the JBL i am considering they are, JBL GTO1504D, check the link out if you want.
https://www.cardomain.com/item/JBLGTO1504D
I used to have two of these 3-4yrs ago, before they were stolen, running on one Rockford Fosgate 1500.1bd amp. They absolutly knocked! And the price is very hard to beat. And they are capable of of hitting as low as 20hz, which I like. Now I have two 1500.1bd amps and am thinking about the same setup. But I dont think will be able to handle 750rms, so...
The CSS 15" sub that I have been told about, https://www.acoustic-visions.com/~acoustic/products/subwoofer_drivers/CSS_SDX15/
looks like an awesome sub! But the only downside to it is the price, which for the moment is out of my price range for two of them...
MB Quart RWE-354. https://www.woofersetc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&Product_ID=3417&Cfid=4806499&CFTOKEN=c6cb0a52e6b02e64-1CA83916-1422-7C6E-509EFDC6ED84826C
This sub here reads to me like it has the total package. The price is right!(c-ya Bob Barker!) The power handling is virtually perfect for me to run my amps at 4 ohm, which will put out 750 rms, and these take 700 rms. And I could tune it to an ungodly frequency of 16hz even!! The local shop I am dealing with sells MB Quart so I can listen to some of their products, but not that one in particular. They also tell me that I will be dissapointed with the bass/boom i will get from the MB Quart product, and recommended I go with a W7 for the boom. But I'll have to sell my kidney for one of those. They also knock 15" subs in general, and said they are "sloppy". From my limited experiance I would have to disagree. But they are the pros i guess, so any insight from your experiance or knowledge would be fantastic!
Thanks
Replies:
Posted By: 3000dclass
Date Posted: June 11, 2007 at 4:38 PM
I forgot to say I plan on putting two of these in my ride!
Posted By: Steven Kephart
Date Posted: June 11, 2007 at 8:28 PM
Keep in mind that those people at the shop are used to selling to kids that think the bass being loud as possible is all that matters. They don't realize that there are people that prefer SQ over SPL. They may not be happy with the output of the MB Quart subs, but running two of them in a ported enclosure with that much power should be more than enough output for anyone. And you are absolutely right about the 15" subs not necessarily being sloppy. Unfortunately they were probably fed a line about how the heavier cone causes that. But in actuality a properly designed 15 can sound just as good as any 10" sub. Here's a great tech paper that disproves it: https://www.adireaudio.com/Files/WooferSpeed.pdf I'd say since you aready know you like the JBL subs, that might be a good choice. Is there a local dealer you can go listen to them again to be sure your tastes haven't changed over the years?
Posted By: Alpine Guy
Date Posted: June 12, 2007 at 9:53 AM
So the only way to really say a 15" sub would be sloppier than a 10" is if you compared the same model subs, but different size sub and looked at the (Le)inductance between the two sizes. The lower the inductance the better.
For example Alpine type-X 10" has an Le of 3.28mH , and the 12" has a Le of 3.25mH, the 12" version has a more desireable inductance than the 10" version in this instance theoretically, although actually seeing that 3mH difference on a response graph would be non-existant.
Does it seem like I have the basic idea of it Steve?
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2003 Chevy Avalanche,Eclipse CD7000,Morel Elate 5,Adire Extremis,Alpine PDX-4.150, 15" TC-3000, 2 Alpine PDX-1.1000, 470Amp HO Alt.
Posted By: 3000dclass
Date Posted: June 12, 2007 at 4:39 PM
Hmmm, very detailed stiff there. But good reading, very compelling
Posted By: 3000dclass
Date Posted: June 12, 2007 at 4:40 PM
I'm curious though, if i ran two amps at 4ohms putting out 750rms each, would those JBL 15" subs be able to handle that, they are only rated at 300rms, 1200 peak!?
Posted By: Steven Kephart
Date Posted: June 12, 2007 at 8:22 PM
Alpine Guy wrote:
So the only way to really say a 15" sub would be sloppier than a 10" is if you compared the same model subs, but different size sub and looked at the (Le)inductance between the two sizes. The lower the inductance the better.
For example Alpine type-X 10" has an Le of 3.28mH , and the 12" has a Le of 3.25mH, the 12" version has a more desireable inductance than the 10" version in this instance theoretically, although actually seeing that 3mH difference on a response graph would be non-existant.
Does it seem like I have the basic idea of it Steve?
Unfortunately it gets more complicated than that. The Le rating is generally measured at 1 kHz. The actual inductance down in the subwoofers pass band will normally be much higher. Also the adition of copper in the pole piece will effect the Le, like the CSS sub uses as well as the TC sub mentioned earlier. However this addition alone doesn't necessarily mean it will have a positive effect. Dr. David Hyre of Adire Audio (who has his doctorate in Nuclear Magneto Resonance Spectroscopy) did quite a bit of research with adding copper in different locations within the motor structure and found there were certain point where it works best, and other points where it had no effect or even a negative effect on the inductance where it mattered. Also, generally the subwoofers within the same line will have identical inductance (or really close to it) as they usually share the same motor parts. Comparing inductance is helpful when comparing different subwoofers. Also of note is that the JBL GTI sub with it's dual coils wired in reverse will have almost no inductance.
Posted By: Steven Kephart
Date Posted: June 12, 2007 at 8:24 PM
3000dclass wrote:
I'm curious though, if i ran two amps at 4ohms putting out 750rms each, would those JBL 15" subs be able to handle that, they are only rated at 300rms, 1200 peak!?
I'd be very leary of putting that much power on them. I suppose you could just run one of your amps on a pair of them. Your electrical system will probably thank you for it. 
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