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locked inside

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=101962
Printed Date: November 26, 2022 at 3:01 AM


Topic: locked inside

Posted By: italian_virus
Subject: locked inside
Date Posted: February 06, 2008 at 10:18 PM

Hello all,
Yes as funny as the subject sounds, i now have the ability to lock myself in my car.. with out being able to open it ;s... Here goes.. I have a viper alarm, model # 690XV, 1995 Honda civic.

I have had the alarm for 4 years now.. everything was working perfectly. So during last summer i decided to make a switch so that i can unlock/lock the doors from the inside. Everything was working perfectly, wiring was done correctly ( as stated on a previous forum on here) the actual switch was also working fine. Now my remote is on my keys, and just like everyone in this world, we all tend to drop our keys. It has come to a point now that my display has become destroyed, and i not able to view anything on it & my UNLOCK button no longer works(Sometimes it does, but thats like pressing it VERY hard, and at least 10+, and thats not even a guarantee that it will unlock), but the LOCK, and HAZARD do work. Here is the issue, the switch no longer work's, so when i start my car the doors lock.. leaving me locked inside the car LOL. In order to get out i have to turn the car off and turn just the battery on, and hopefully it unlocks (hit N miss, or roll the window down and unlock using the keys). Now in order to keep the door unlocked, i have to start the car with the door open so it does not lock, heres the funny part, i am able to lock the car using the switch.. but the unlock does not work.Sometimes out of random if i am locked inside i am able to unlock/lock using the switch.BUT sometimes if i unlock it, then lock it, and i try to unlock it again i am UNABLE to do so.. its like it only work's once.. I have noticed that this all started happening when the UNLOCK on the remote stopped working..

Just so i have every detail stated, my SRS light is on in my car(this is caused by the cable reel), i am not sure if that has any baring on this topic, but i am just trying to provide all details.

Now the question i have to ask you is, could this be the remote? causing this issue? Or could this be the wiring issue of the switch to the alarm brain that is making the remote not working, or could this be another factor which i have seemed to have ruled out??

IF anyone could take the time to read this lengthy description, and give me their diagnosis, or any helpful hints/tricks, It would be GREATLY appreciated..

Thanks




Replies:

Posted By: swamprat323
Date Posted: February 06, 2008 at 10:27 PM
get a new remote :)

re program the alarm not to lock doors when ignition is turn on.

get a new switch for lock/unlock

also if other buttons on remote work u can program the buttons to do differt things. can do that until u get a new remote


down load install manural for programing info




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 07, 2008 at 5:53 AM
turn ignition controlled locking off. also the viper when it auto locks from ignition, you can keep doors closed and let the doors lock, then open it by hand and leave the car. honda has thatfeature so you dont forget the keys in the car by disabling lock when keys are in the ignition. for now get your hands on the manual in the download section or PM twelvolts, cuz he deals with DEI products. and get a new remote for sure !  btw dont you have a 1-way remote?




Posted By: corrysmtx
Date Posted: February 07, 2008 at 9:10 AM
if the switch in the car is also not unlocking the doors it is most likely a problem with the switch unless you have a car that uses a five wire locking system if that is the case than one of the connections on the relays could be loose or going bad

-------------
1 12" mtx 9500 4ohm dvc 1 8100d and 1 1501d almost loud enough to cover the sounds of my car dying.




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: February 07, 2008 at 7:08 PM
Well this is the thing, i got a quote for a new remote.. its $150.00 ;s.. so i am just debating if i should just get a new alarm with a remote starter, because the money i am putting into just the remote itself, i would rather get a new alarm if thats the case. Thats why i am asking to see what is causing this issue.


tedmond wrote:

turn ignition controlled locking off. also the viper when it auto locks from ignition, you can keep doors closed and let the doors lock, then open it by hand and leave the car. honda has thatfeature so you dont forget the keys in the car by disabling lock when keys are in the ignition. for now get your hands on the manual in the download section or PM twelvolts, cuz he deals with DEI products. and get a new remote for sure ! btw dont you have a 1-way remote?


Here is the thing, my car is a 1995, it never came with power locks, i installed the actuators, got the alarm installed, and made a switch to the alarm brain to be able to unlock/lock. Another issue is, that once i am locked inside i cannot unlock the door, because the latch is broken, so even if i wanted to do it manually i could not. The only way out like i said was if i were to either A) turn the car off roll down the window and unlock it manually, or B) turn the car off, and just click on the battery and hopefully it unlocks, or else keep trying, it usually works on the 2nd attempt.






corrysmtx wrote:

if the switch in the car is also not unlocking the doors it is most likely a problem with the switch unless you have a car that uses a five wire locking system if that is the case than one of the connections on the relays could be loose or going bad



The switch is 3 wire, like i said sometimes the switch works and most of the time it does not.. It's a hit N miss, Very fustrating... LOL




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 07, 2008 at 7:29 PM
actuators are REV polarity. check your relays for a good constant 12v.




Posted By: swamprat323
Date Posted: February 08, 2008 at 10:19 AM
on your switch that you made check your ground or better yet re do the ground to a better place. were did you ground it at.

for a remote u can get them for about $90 all over the internet.

i get the car fixed b4 i buy a remote or a new system. shold not coast that much to get a latch fixed.




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 09, 2008 at 3:12 PM
I have my alarm set for ignition locking. But I wanted to ask if there is a way I can make a relay that wont allow me to lock my doors (white car is turned off) if the keys are still in the ignition. I know that when I turn the car off, my doors unlock anyways. But lets say I decide to leave the keys in the ignition and while I am getting out of the car, I accidently hit the power lock switch and it locks my doors. Now on my mothers car, she has a feature that the driver's side door will not lock (passengers will) if they keys are in the ignition and power lock switch is pressed. She has a 01 cavalier with factory keyless entry. I have a 02 cavalier with factory keyless entry (which I have permently disarmed) and an aftermarket asianwolf 8000RS which is the same as scytek 5100RS.




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 7:08 AM

AUDIOMAN, you asked

*****I have my alarm set for ignition locking. But I wanted to ask if there is a way I can make a relay that wont allow me to lock my doors (white car is turned off) if the keys are still in the ignition. I know that when I turn the car off, my doors unlock anyways. But lets say I decide to leave the keys in the ignition and while I am getting out of the car, I accidently hit the power lock switch and it locks my doors. Now on my mothers car, she has a feature that the driver's side door will not lock (passengers will) if they keys are in the ignition and power lock switch is pressed. She has a 01 cavalier with factory keyless entry. I have a 02 cavalier with factory keyless entry (which I have permently disarmed) and an aftermarket asianwolf 8000RS which is the same as scytek 5100RS.****

this is very simple to do. the only crappy thing is, the wires sit in the drivers kick panel, and you have little room to work. im showing you how to disable DRIVER door lock motor ONLY when your key is in the ignition. using a relay, break the continuity on DRIVER DOOR MOTOR, other doors will lock or unlock normally.

85 - constant 12v
86 - key sense (-) Light Green @ ignition harness

**Cut TAN wire in drivers kick panel, test to make sure you got the right one**

87a - Driver Motor Lock Wire (+) Tan @ drivers kick panel car side
30 -  Driver Motor Lock Wire (+) Tan @ drivers kick panel door side

this way, once you place a key into the ignition, the relay will trip and break continuity on the driver door so that is the only door that will NOT LOCK, and no need to worry if some1 was going to open your door since you have an alarm; its all good. hope this helps !





Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 7:15 AM

Italian virus, you can do the same with what i posted above, except use these wires. this will just allow you to not lock your doors.

85 - Ground
86 - Ignition Wire (+) BLACK / YELLOW @ ignition harness

look for the actuator LOCK wire, and cut that in half.

87a - lock motor wire switch side
30 -  lock motor swtich actuator side





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 8:56 AM
Oh so what your saying tedmond is that the relay is tripped as soon as the key is inserted into the ignition tripping the relay causing the driver's door to stay unlocked. Well will the relay be able to tell the difference between the key just in the ignition,  and the key in the ignition with the car turned on? Another thing you said to not worry about the key being in the ignition with the alarm. So what your saying is I could leave the key in the ignition which would cause my driver's door to stay unlocked BUT If I used my other keypad and armed the alarm, the alarm would still arm but drivers door would stay unlocked. So If someone went and opened the drivers door, the domelight would turn on triggering my alarm. Is that what you meant?




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 9:29 AM

This site I went on says I dont have a keysense wire.Heres the site: https://64.85.6.118/diagrams/diagrams.asp             I have a 02 cavalier. But at the bottom of that page has a picture of the ignition harness. There is a green wire there. Could that be the wire?

posted_image





Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 4:52 PM

audioman2007 wrote:

Oh so what your saying tedmond is that the relay is tripped as soon as the key is inserted into the ignition tripping the relay causing the driver's door to stay unlocked. Well will the relay be able to tell the difference between the key just in the ignition,  and the key in the ignition with the car turned on? Another thing you said to not worry about the key being in the ignition with the alarm. So what your saying is I could leave the key in the ignition which would cause my driver's door to stay unlocked BUT If I used my other keypad and armed the alarm, the alarm would still arm but drivers door would stay unlocked. So If someone went and opened the drivers door, the domelight would turn on triggering my alarm. Is that what you meant?

the key sense wire always works as long as theres a key in the ignition. if you want you could tie in 2 relays so once you leave a key in the ignition doors wont lock, but once you turn it to the "ON" the continuity on the keysense wire is broken so you can lock. plus you only need to lock the doors when your key is in "ON" because your going to start the car. but yea, that is what i was trying to say about the alarm. sorry if i didnt make it clear. Leaving your key in the ignition disables the lock on driver door, however, if you decide to exit the car, using your asianwolf remote, arming the car will protect it anyways since it watches door pins/domelight. if some1 was to open the door your alarm would go off and page you - then you go outside and beat the guy =D.





Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 4:54 PM
audioman2007 wrote:

This site I went on says I dont have a keysense wire.Heres the site: https://64.85.6.118/diagrams/diagrams.asp             I have a 02 cavalier. But at the bottom of that page has a picture of the ignition harness. There is a green wire there. Could that be the wire?

posted_image


bulldog diagrams are crappy, i dont have anything against it, its just its not that great, btw you should test the green wire before connecting it to a relay. take your DMM red to constant 12 and black to the green wire, set it to 20v DC. place key into ignition and it should read 12 - 13v on your meter.





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 5:09 PM
Ok, so if that green wire in the diagram is the wire I need to tap into, I would use 2 relays like you said. How would i wire those up?




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 10, 2008 at 6:44 PM
All the webpagers I have read said the key sense wire is green and located at the ingition switch. So I am assuming that green wire in the picture above is the correct wire, correct?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 11, 2008 at 3:06 PM

Enable Lock when key in ignition in "ON" Postition RELAY 1

85 - ground
86 - ignition 1 on car
87a - key sense wire on car (green)
30 - to relay 2 Pin 86

Disable Lock when key in ignition RELAY 2

85 - constant 12v
86 - key sense input from relay 1 pin 30

**Cut TAN wire in drivers kick panel, test to make sure you got the right one**

87a - Driver Motor Lock Wire (+) Tan @ drivers kick panel car side
30 -  Driver Motor Lock Wire (+) Tan @ drivers kick panel door side

this way, even if the keys are in the ignition and are in the ACC so you can listen to the radio, the doors are still able to lock. The only time you cant lock is when the Key is in the "ON" position and your ready to start the car.





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 11, 2008 at 5:49 PM
But my doors will still lock though after the car is actually started (like they do now)  correct?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 12, 2008 at 2:55 PM
yes, if you just leave the keys in the ignition, doors are not able to lock since you want to prevent leaving your keys inside. But, as soon as you start the car with the key, door is able to lock normally; that is why i suggested you to use 2 relays. i dont want a member of 12v to die because of not being able to lock a door posted_image




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 12, 2008 at 3:15 PM
Ok so the ignition wire on the first relay is what causes the doors to lock. And when the ingition isnt turned on, the key sense wire comes into play. But 1 question. How does the relays "know" when the igntion is on across from just the key being inserted?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 12, 2008 at 4:29 PM
because the first relay is wired to the ignition. once the key is turned to ON, the relay is energized and breaks the continuity on the key sense wire for relay 2, which would allow power on the lock motor. when the ignition is OFF and the key is still in the key cylinder you cant lock the doors.




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: February 12, 2008 at 10:50 PM
Well then... this has gone off topic, but its all good..LOL

I grounded the switch to my alarm harness, all connections are soldered.
& i already checked for the switch $150 ;s, and i am not too worried about the latch, i am more concerned with the lock.

I do not care about the door's locking automatically, i am just trying to figure out why all of a sudden the switch works sporadically, and not consistently.   




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 13, 2008 at 3:00 PM

ahah im sorry that i answered on audiomans questions, on my behalf im sure he didnt mean to hijack your thread. now let me get this straight, your car, you ADDED linear actuators for locks right? and now when you use the switch it doesnt lock? or it doesnt lock from using the alarm remote? sorry if im lost, but if you can explain waht the issue is again i would be glad to help





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 13, 2008 at 9:30 PM
I apoligize. I just did not want to start a new topic knowing that this already started topic was basically the same thing. I just need to ask a few more questions if you dont mind. I have a Remote start system with my alarm. Does it matter where I splice this ignition wire coming off the relay, into the igntion wire on the car? Like do I need it key side of the RS wire or igntion side? Also, will this affect my RS at all? Like for instance, I remote start my car, then disarm alarm, sit inside and lock the doors. Then I insert the key into the ignition but dont turn it. Will my doors unlock then Until I turn the key to ignition? I think thats all I need to know. Once again I apoligize. Just trying to keep my topic's down as few as possible. Thank you




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 14, 2008 at 2:35 PM

I remote start my car, then disarm alarm, sit inside and lock the doors. Then I insert the key into the ignition but dont turn it. Will my doors unlock then Until I turn the key to ignition?

your doors will not unlock. if you remote started it, disramred, got inside and hit the lock, placeing the key into the ignition will NOT allow your to open your door until it is turned to "ON" or you remove the key. simple as that. is there something you plan to do, if so please ask, i will make sure you can get it done correctly.





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 14, 2008 at 8:33 PM
I understand it. I just want to know everything when I put to install these relays. So the only thing I need to know is that as long as the key is in the ignition but not turned to ignition or actually have the engine running, my driver's side door wont lock, correct?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 14, 2008 at 9:47 PM
Correct.




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 15, 2008 at 3:04 AM
Ok thanks for the help. I will work on getting the relays wired up and as soon as it gets warmer outside, I will install it. Just 1 more ting. What amp fuse should I use?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 15, 2008 at 8:09 PM
well you dont really need a fuse since you are only "breaking" the continuity on the lock motor. you can go the extra mile and add a fuse just to protect the relay with a 5 amp fuse on the positive side of the coil 85 or 86.  




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 15, 2008 at 9:03 PM
Ok. So I wont mess anything up other than the relay if I dont use a fuse and something shorts out?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 16, 2008 at 12:42 PM
technically you cant "short" anything out. remember your breaking the continuity on the lock motor. the only problem that you could run into is the wire breaks over time and it touches ground for some reason. but yea, play it safe if you wish and add the fuse. also you can add a 1amp diode across coil terminals 85 and 86. the cathode (white band) on the diode will go on the positive side of the relay.  this will prevent voltage spikes on your "load" or lockmotor.




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 16, 2008 at 1:46 PM
Which relay would the diode go on? Relay 1's pin 86 is ignition pin 85 is ground. On relay 2's pin 86 goes to pin 30 from relay 1.  Pin 85 goes to constand 12V.




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 16, 2008 at 8:16 PM

diode goes on both relays, first relay, cathode band on 86, second relay, cathode band on 85





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 16, 2008 at 8:45 PM
ok  thank you




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 17, 2008 at 11:59 AM
I just went out and looked for the tan wire for the driver side door lock. I have a tan wire coming out of the door molex. It runs into a butt connector. The other end of the butt connector is a wire that I think goes to a relay ( I think) that I made for the negative door wire to run to from the alarm. I will have to trace that wire to make sure, but if that is the case, do I just want to remove that connector and put those relays in its place?




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 18, 2008 at 2:14 PM
Another thing. Does it matter where on the ignition wire I splice the ignition wire from the relay to? Can I splice it into the ignition wire that comes off my RS before it runs to the cars ignition wire?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 18, 2008 at 6:14 PM
keep that relay you used for the unlock/lock from your unit to the lock motor. Then just add the relays required, and the ignition wire, you can TAP anywhere you wish as long as its connected to ignition. so tapping into the wire that comes off your remote start before the cars ignition is perfectly fine




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 20, 2008 at 2:04 PM
Is there a way to break continuity on the trunk wire during times when the alarm is armed?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 20, 2008 at 6:52 PM

of course there is. thank got for the relay

85 - ground when armed from unit
86 - constant 12v
87a - trunk release button switch side
30 - trunk release button Motor side.

i do remember you asking how to break continuity but at the same time triggering the alarm if its pressed, this is hard to do and not worth the wiring and time.  





Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: February 20, 2008 at 7:51 PM
Yea I think I will stick to just breaking the continuity. So I simply just need to cut the positive trunk release wire and wire this relay in place.  I will place this relay infront of the trunk release relay I have installed for the alarm. That was I can still pop the trunk using the  remote. I do have my alarm programmed to disarm when popping the trunk. But just incase there is a split second difference when that happens. I will wire this relay on the switch side of the trunk that way there wont be any problems. Is there really any point to install this relay? I mean, if someone smashed the window and the alarm doesnt sound, when they try and pop the trunk, it simply wont pop. Is it worth it?




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 21, 2008 at 2:04 PM
well yes i say if you want to be protective about your car, its worth it. If you could care less then dont bother. You could always use the trunk light to trigger the alarm if they were to pry it open.




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: February 26, 2008 at 11:51 PM
LOL alright then...

what i was originally saying was, my switch in the car works sporadically just like my power locks.. Sometimes i start the car and it auto locks (it always used to do that), sometimes it does not.. for example if my car door is unlocked, i would be able to LOCK the door using the switch...BUT i CANNOT unlock it ... leaving me locked in the car, i would have to turn the ignition on and wait for it to unlock.. and if that does not work then i do it again.. usually 2/3rd time works ..

I would like to know why my unlock portion of my switch does not work consistently ... anyone have ANy ideas???




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: March 07, 2008 at 2:06 PM
*UPDATE*

If anyone has been following this thread...Ive found out something that might be useful to finding a solution to this problem.. If the door's are locked and i am inside the car, and cannot get out. Ive noticed that when i turn the ignition on, and wait about 2-3 seconds i am able to unlock the doors using the UNLOCK on the switch, but if i was to lock the doors right after i did that using the LOCK of the switch, i would not be able to unlock it again using the unlock....weird???... anyone???




Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: March 07, 2008 at 7:59 PM

did you use relays for the lock/unlock from the alarm? sounds as if there is no continuity on the wire. could either be a broken wire or if you did a 5wire REV Polarity, the relay might not be functioning properly.





Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: March 10, 2008 at 4:48 PM
well




Posted By: audioman2007
Date Posted: March 13, 2008 at 6:26 PM
Well tedmond, I went and installed those 2 relays and I have good news and I have bad news. The good news is that the relays do their job. The driver side door wont lock when the key is inserted. The bad news is that the drivers door also wont unlock unless I remove the key as soon as I turn the ignition off. I have ignition door locking and unlocking  so when I turn the ignition off, since the key is still inserted, continuity is broken to the door motor thus not allowing the door to unlock. What I dont understand is that I have the relay wired to the lock wire (tan). The light blue wire is for unlocking. I also dont understand why the door wont unlock when the ignition is turned off. I didnt tap into the unlock wire at all. The only way i can get the door to unlock when the ignition is turned off is if I remove the key as soon as the ignition is turned off. I guess there is not a way to fix this. BUT, here is how everything is hooked up. My factory door locking is priority door unlocking meaning I would need to hit the unlock button twice to unlock the passenger door. I did not want this so what I did was I kept the blue wire connected to the factory keyless entry. I cut the lock wire running to the keyless entry though. I wired up a relay (or 2) so that I can use my new new alarm to unlock the doors. Could it be that those relays power both the lock and unlock? Also, I cut the lock wire between those relay(s) and the lock motor. Should I have done it between the alarm and relay(s) instead?




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: March 26, 2008 at 11:30 AM
tedmond wrote:

did you use relays for the lock/unlock from the alarm? sounds as if there is no continuity on the wire. could either be a broken wire or if you did a 5wire REV Polarity, the relay might not be functioning properly.


It might  be the relay, but i noticed this problem started to happen as soon as my remote UNLOCK button stopped working...  I wired the unlock & lock from the switch to the alarm harness .. This is my alarm

https://img520.imageshack.us/img520/2906/p1050682oo3.jpg

I used the, White 3 pin - Door Lock Port - Blue and Green wires  and Black for ground.

It is weird because when i start the car, the door's usually lock if the door is closed. Sometimes when i start it it does nothing. It seems to work whenever it wants.

Like ive stated before, if the doors lock automatically when the car is started, i first try the switch if that does not work to unlock then i turn the car off, and turn just the ignition on, and sometimes it unlocks, and other times i have to do the process 2/3 times in order for the door to unlock....

Could it be a bad connection??.. A toasted relay???....All wires are soldered & i did NOT do a hack job....

My SRS light is on because of my cable reel, could that be a reason??

Any ideas anyone??

It is driving me CRAZY !

LOL..





Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: March 26, 2008 at 1:57 PM
i would check the ground that you used for your unit. also the antenna plug might not be seated correctly. I would use a DMM and meter the lock ouputs and see if they work or not. Also check to see if the ground wire has a resistance less than 0.4 ohms.




Posted By: italian_virus
Date Posted: March 29, 2008 at 8:22 PM
well gentlemen i finally did it.. it took a couple of hours but its been done..
I exposed all my wiring and attacked with with a multimeter, and the problem that was causing all this was.. The SWITCH itself.. when i put a multimeter to it, it would show connectivity when i locked the door, but when i unlocked it, nothing.. i jiggled it around and sure enough the multimeter went crazy lol... That was the first problem.. the second problem was in regards to the remote.. i took it apart, it has to do with the actual board of the remote it self, the button of the remote was not making contact with the button on the board.. and i noticed that on the opposite side where the button is, there is a copper color that is exposed.. so i put electrical tape on it put it back together and presto.. we are good to go
for how long.. thats another story , haha..

Thanks for all your help everyone i appreciate it.





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