viper 550 esp causing start issue

I have a 1999 Subaru Forester that I bought several years ago with a Viper 550 ESP alarm w/remote start installed. It seems to be causing a starting issue and I'm wondering whether anyone knows:
1) What the problem is?
2) If it's fried, where to get a new unit or compatible unit that will plug into the old plugs?

Situation:
Everything worked fine until several months ago when it would occasionally 'click' at the turn of the key as if it had a dead battery, but it would fire right up on the second turn of the key. It didn't happen often and I figured the battery was getting old. After a few months, it happened nearly every start and it would take several key turns for the starter to engage. I got a new battery and it seemed OK for about a week. Then it started requiring multiple key turns to start, although remote start always worked. I took it to a mechanic and he decided to replace the starter with a 'rewound' starter. That didn't fix it, so he installed a new starter. That didn't help either. I decided it was an electrical issue and I would live with it because the starter would always click in if I turned the key a few times or used remote start. It got worse to the point that I just started using remote start all the time. Recently it's gotten even worse and I have to turn the key really fast about ten times in order to start it and remote start doesn't reliably work either. Today I decided to out the electrical components. I unhooked the alarm harness to see what would happen. It started up just fine on the first turn like it always used to. I repeated it several times to make sure with the same results.

Does anyone know what the problem is? Can it be fixed? If the alarm/keyless is fried, does anyone know a compatible drop-in unit that will connect in with the same plugs?

You most likely have one of two problems:

1. Your ignition switch is worn out and will need to be replaced

2. There is a bad connection between the starter wire leaving the key switch and the starter kill relay

When you say you unhooked the alarm harness do you mean you just unplugged the main harness from the unit?  If that is the case, you didn't "fix" anything.  Perhaps you moved some wires around and they are now making a better connection.  The starter kill wiring is indepedent of the main wire harness.  You should be able to trace the orange wire on the main harness to a relay.  The relay will have a thick black and a thick green wire on it.  Make sure both wires are securely connected to the cut starter wire.

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Kevin Pierson

Also, if your car ALWAYS starts with the remote start I hope your mechanic didn't charge you for either of the starters or the labor to put them in.  That is an obvious misdiagnosis!

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Kevin Pierson

I definitely got charged for the first replacement starter. He refunded labor and did the second one on his own terms. If I had more spare time and energy, I would have argued a bit more about the wrong diagnosis, but I just ate the cost for now.

Unfortunately, I know that nothing really got fixed by unplugging the alarm. Although it ALWAYS starts fine without the alarm unit plugged in, I don't have keyless entry or remote start, which is annoying. I've replugged and unplugged all the harnesses several times over the course of two days to verify. The car starts fine if it's unplugged and it always requires aggressive key turning or remote start if it's plugged back in. The remote start used to work great as backup if I wanted to avoid the strange key start, but now it gets the same 'click' about 75% of the time with a clean start ~25%. The most annoying part is that everything used to work fine. I have no idea what changed or why it happened slowly and progressively. Usually electronics either work or don't work without much in the middle.

If it's the starter-kill activating, would that still give a starter solenoid 'click'? I've accidentally activated the starter kill a few times over the years and in those cases it just totally killed power to the starter. I didn't hear any click or attempt to activate the solenoid. In this case, I hear a definite 'click' and 'humm' the same as if I have a dead battery. As soon as it actually catches, it turns over readily. Once again, it works just fine with the harnesses unplugged.

Any ideas of what do check?

The electronics are not failing - it would have to be either the connection or the key switch itself. 

The way the 550ESP works is it has a dedicated starter output coming off one of the relays in the satelite harness.  It also has an external starter kill relay.  These are the only connections to the starter circuit.  The starter kill relay requires you to cut the heavy gauge starter wire and splice the relays green and black wires in to the starter circuit.  I would look here first.  Do you know how the connection was made?  Are there crimp connectors or scotch locks on the starter wire?  If not, is the starter wire just wrapped and not soldered?  If the wire is soldered, is the joint shiney and pretty? 

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Kevin Pierson

There are not a lot of components between the ignition switch and the starter motor. I am assuming that you have an automatic transmission.
I go with KP's recommendation to check the connections and starter kill relay first. Than the ignition switch. The only other component is the park/neutral inhibitor switch but if that was failing you should not be able to start by remote either. So take the systematic approach and check the easiest things first.

Most of the connections into the existing stock wires are made with Scotchlok T-Tap Self-Stripping Female Disconnectors (I had to look up the name). That includes the connections to the starter wire. The alarm also has an dedicated constant power wire running directly to the battery.

I understand that if the connections were bad to the Viper unit, that could make some of the functions not work efficiently. I don't understand how the viper unit is causing the car not to start or why disconnecting it solves the problem.

What do I need to fix and how would you suggest doing that?

The first thing I would do is remove the scotchlocks from the starter wire and solder the connections.

I still have a hard time believing that simply unplugging the brain is getting rid of the problem.  Most likely you have a poor connection that is occasionally failing (and getting worse with time). 

If there was something going on with the alarm, it could be energizing the starter kill relay, but the starter kill relay HAS to be before the remote start starter output.  Since you have already said the problem occasionally happens with the remote start, that pretty much rules that out.

Like I said, the first thing I would do is replace those connectors - they are not very reliable especially on high current wires.

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Kevin Pierson

Thanks for the advice. As you said, I may very well have just jiggled something back into or out of place.

I started off by batting things around underneath and then starting it to see what would happen. It started fine. Then I plugged the Viper back in and, sure enough, it wouldn't start. I got under the dash with a shop light and pulled all the wires out of the crevices so that I could see them and check for any obvious deteriorating connections. The whole install job looks like it was put in by a team of monkeys. Amongst the mess, a black and a gray paired set of wires stuck out as obviously badly spliced. For one reason or another, both had been cut at one point, followed by someone pulling out a few strands of wire and half twisting the two sides together with a piece of electrical tape hanging off. I stripped off some insulation and gave the two sides a good twist. After that, it started just fine several times in a row.

I couldn't figure out exactly what the gray and black wires were supposed to be or where they were connected in the car. They ended up in the blue plug beside the main harness. I believe that's the valet switch slot, so I'm confused about what happened.

I'm curious as to what happened. Was the unit drawing too much current through tiny wires upon key-turn or what was going on?

The Gray and Black wires you found are the valet switch wires. The splice was probably to short the wires.
You may have fixed the valet wires but I don't think you fixed your starting issue, at least not permanently. Moving the wires just reestablished the connections but will work loose again. The only way to correct the problem is to redo all of the poor joints.

*** double post ***

You're right, the wire twist definitely did not fix it. Although it worked two or three times sitting in my garage, the no-start click returned after a trip to the store. Once again, I unhooked the alarm and it has worked fine all weekend. It looks like I'll have to find some time to go through all of the connections. What a pain.