complete novice, alarm/remote start, 88 mr2

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=118450
Printed Date: April 27, 2024 at 6:24 AM

Topic: complete novice, alarm/remote start, 88 mr2

Posted By: scoobyblue
Subject: complete novice, alarm/remote start, 88 mr2
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 9:37 AM

hi there , i am very new to this game so bear with me . i drive a mk1 mr2 supercharger which had a transponder immobilizer on it . i decided to take it out and instal a boomerang alarm/immobiliser/remote starteretc kit . i have only ever done diy domestic wiring and am struggling with auto electrics , i.e. on the alarm wiring diagram it positive output and input , and some for neg input and out put , also when it says 200ma negative output idoes it mean from the car or from the module?on the door lockpower input it saysto use either +12v or ground input , does that mean that on the door lock outputs i use the opposite , i.e +input then -output for the lock/unlock or does it make no difference. i am starting to think i have bitten off more than i can chew . if i could source a video online for the installation of this or a similar system , it would be a great help. normally i would have given up by now but this is intriguing me and the stubborn side of me has kicked in and is telling me not to give up.any help or pointers would be gratefully received bearing in mind not to blind me with too much science!

Replies:

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 12:36 PM

Your locks are low current neg which means you need to supply neg to lock and unlock the vehicle, also on a cold morning if you have to pump the accelerator before she catches, don't bother also the brand you're fitting, throw it away, last but not least considering it's a very easy car but with lots of work should you be doing this?

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 12:43 PM

i have no choice but to do this myself , i havent worked since june so cant afford a professional installation

Posted By: icearrow6
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 3:59 PM

its going to be difficult because you don't have all the available tool from a professional installer,

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Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 4:16 PM

i realise it wont be easy but surely not impossible , everyone here seems to be quick to point this out but very few offering any encouragement or advice as to where i might find information as to fittiong this , i know these are basic questions that may seem stupid to those that know but just remember you all had to start somewhere , stupid questions like do i connect the starter relay to the car side of the harness and the control module to the key /ignition side , if i am on too technical a forum for these stupid questions then just say so and i will desist , or point me in the right direction , BE CONSTRUCTIVE PEOPLE

Posted By: icearrow6
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 6:29 PM

The thing is. . .
If you ask you to use a DMM to test the polarity of the door unlock pulse, if you don't have a DMM the information we give you is useless.

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Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 6:38 PM

forget it i am sure i will find somewhere with helpful people who arent so far up their own ar*e that they cant see where they came from , bye

Posted By: kreg357
Date Posted: December 12, 2009 at 9:51 PM

Here is a video of a very basic and generic R/S install process:

https://www.bulldogsecurity.com/real/bull1.html

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Soldering is fun!

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 1:58 AM

WE aren't up our own backsides from your answers to some questions and lack of answers to the question I asked you on your other post you are helplessly out of your depth and I'm seriously worried about what damage you will do to your vehicle and what it's going to cost YOU to put it right. On your other posts I dismissed the R/S you named because I hadn't heard of it. If it uses oil pressure switch or voltage to determine tach sense, i.e. if engine is running then definitely don't try to install it. On your other post you couldn't tell the difference between a standard wired relay (used for starter cut and anti-grind) and a lock module. You still haven't told me whether you can start up the vehicle on a cold morning without pumping the accelerator because if you have to pump it the whole thing is moot anyway. Answer our questions without the attitude that we are ganging up on you and you might get some answers.

Posted By: Powermyster
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 4:45 AM

Howie is right you seem way out of your depth on this mate. Post schematic for this make of alarm and I'm sure we'll tell you what wires go where and what to look for.

howie also is trying to save you alot of wasted time and effort askig do you have to pump accelerator. If you do have pump the car will not remote start even if you get everything else spot on..

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Why oh Why didn't i take the blue pill
Darren Power

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 5:39 AM

Just out of interest a Mk1 MR2 with a transponder immobiliser? Don't think so unless it was after market in which case it can be easily discarded for the purpose of this exercise. I did an alarm + R/s on a 95 Mk2 last week which didn't have one.
Basic requirements:
DMM a cheap one but adequate is about £30 ($45) from Maplin.
Drill/Screwdriver with 3mm and 7 or 8mm bits (a stepped cone cut 3-14mm is better but they start at about £14 = $21 here). + Phillips no.2 bit.
Assorted cable for pin switches.
Good quality insulated tape, 2 reels. I use Scotch 33+ but that's £3/$5 per reel here.
Solder 60/40 flux cored leaded works better.
Soldering iron, I use Weller gun and pyropens but these are for pro use, buy a cheap butane pen type at Halfords or Maplin.
8 and 10mm spanners.
Door or trim popper basic about £25 /$38 from Snap-On.
Various ring and receptacle terminals insulated crimp type, again Maplin or Halfords.
At least 3 x1N4004 diodes, Maplins.
3 pin switches for rear trunk (boot), engine bay and bonnet (hood) lids.
That's your bare minimum. For our friends across the pond (not Powermyster, that's just a small and very windy pond!) Halfords is a cross between a cycle store, motoring accessories and auto parts and a Sears and thinks it can do installs as well.Maplin is a UK version of Radio Shack that's far cheaper for parts and the staff are more efficient.

Stanley Knife
Crimping tool you can spend up to £200 ($300) but a reasonable price for constant use is about £54 for a ratchet type.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 5:46 AM

howie ll wrote:

WE aren't up our own backsides from your answers to some questions and lack of answers to the question I asked you on your other post you are helplessly out of your depth and I'm seriously worried about what damage you will do to your vehicle and what it's going to cost YOU to put it right. On your other posts I dismissed the R/S you named because I hadn't heard of it. If it uses oil pressure switch or voltage to determine tach sense, i.e. if engine is running then definitely don't try to install it. On your other post you couldn't tell the difference between a standard wired relay (used for starter cut and anti-grind) and a lock module. You still haven't told me whether you can start up the vehicle on a cold morning without pumping the accelerator because if you have to pump it the whole thing is moot anyway. Answer our questions without the attitude that we are ganging up on you and you might get some answers.

he didnt ask if i had to pump the accelerator , he automatically assumed i did because it is an old car , yes it is old but at the time it was far ahead of its time and still has features that modern cars are only using now like v v t i , t vis , as for doing harm that was why i came on here to try to make sense of it all , and i am aware of the risks so let me worry about that , i am not a complete idiot that i couldnt figure out that if i needed to pump the accelerator remote starting would be useless. i will put the schematic on here and if there are any positive suggestions i will be grateful , if not then please dont try to use my inexperience as a catalyst for your sarcasm .i am simply a reasonably intelligent person asking people who are knowledgeable in their field for their help , my situation precludes me from getting this fitted for me and i am trying to put this period of unemployment to some constructive use and maybe learn a little on the way

[IMG]https://i772.photobucket.com/albums/yy5/scoobykid028/scan0001.jpg[/IMG]

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 5:52 AM

"Just out of interest a Mk1 MR2 with a transponder immobiliser" it was after market , a sigma , and the spare transponder didnt work so i decided to put this alarm system in instead of chasing up a spare transponder fob , as for the list of recommended materials i appreciate it and will use it , thanks

Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 6:32 AM

what years the car? that way we can pull up diagrams and wire colours and guide you in the right direction,

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 6:52 AM

it is a 1988 mk1 mr2 (supercharger)

Posted By: dasbogie
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 8:07 AM

What's the benefit of connecting to oil sensor?

Posted By: tommy...
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 8:08 AM

scoobyblue wrote:

howie ll wrote:

he didnt ask if i had to pump the accelerator , he automatically assumed i did because it is an old car , yes it is old but at the time it was far ahead of its time and still has features that modern cars are only using now like v v t i , t vis , as for doing harm that was why i came on here to try to make sense of it all , and i am aware of the risks so let me worry about that , i am not a complete idiot that i couldnt figure out that if i needed to pump the accelerator remote starting would be useless. i will put the schematic on here and if there are any positive suggestions i will be grateful , if not then please dont try to use my inexperience as a catalyst for your sarcasm .i am simply a reasonably intelligent person asking people who are knowledgeable in their field for their help , my situation precludes me from getting this fitted for me and i am trying to put this period of unemployment to some constructive use and maybe learn a little on the way

[IMG]https://i772.photobucket.com/albums/yy5/scoobykid028/scan0001.jpg[/IMG]

THIS SERIES

howie ll wrote:

Your locks are low current neg which means you need to supply neg to lock and unlock the vehicle, also on a cold morning if you have to pump the accelerator before she catches, don't bother also the brand you're fitting, throw it away, last but not least considering it's a very easy car but with lots of work should you be doing this?

2nd post in this series... Dude...Relax...We realize you are OVER-YOUR-HEAD here...Doubt you'll find a better site...This is how most posts go...I dont really feel like giving you a lesson...So read through some posts first...Then make a comment on this site...Im sure you will be very shocked at the plethra of knowledge and help associated with this site...Howie has installed for like 50 years...or so...That guy will be your best friend...If the responses werent so harsh...Take your time...Everything will work out...I couldnt imagine what your post would look like if something got damaged because of mis-communication..geez...GO the12volt.com...! Some posts take 50-60 responses to figure or complete...So having 14 is not so bad...They have to know what/who there dealing with...If they dont know...the "jargon" they type might be hard to pick up on...Say...I;m sorry howie...I would be honored for you to help me...! He will be your brother in arms...UK'ish

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M.E.C.P & First-Class
Go slow and drink lots of water...Procrastinators' Unite...Tomorrow!

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 9:11 AM

I actually asked you about the accelerator twice, I assumed nothing but if you're too lazy to read it? This is my point of view:-
Oil pressure switch. If a unit uses the voltage signal at this point to sense tach rather than a dedicated tach signal it's not going to work well if at all. There are many experienced installers out there who've torn their hair out over this junk.
Your skill base appears woefully inadequate for this job. Knowing AC wiring has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with auto electrics. Yes I dabble in Cat 5 work so I'm aware.
Your attitude.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 9:47 AM

i have obviously got off on the wrong foot so for that i apologise but i took exceoption to you dismissing the system as rubbish when you then said you were unfamiliar with it , the accelerator does not have to be touched for either hot or cold starts and i did reply to that , according to my info there is a dedicated tach wire at the "check"connector , it is (-). , i said i was grateful for the list of items you suggested , the only thing in it that i havent got are the diodes, and i dont know where to use them , and finally , in reply to another members comment , i do know what a dmm is . i dont wish to rub anyone up the wrong way its just that on any of the car club forums that i am in i found people much more willing to impart knowledge in a way that is easily understood , whereas on here seems more cliquish . anyway i am willing to wipe the slate clean and begin again , if that is acceptable

Posted By: icearrow6
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 12:25 PM

DMM= Digital Multi Meter
you can get one at your local radioshack for like 10 bucks.
Its used to test circuits without the risk of damaging sensitive components.
A test light CAN damage some components if you are not careful.

This alarm seems to have built in relays for the doorlocks. RED / BLACK.

So tell us which part of the install is really the problem. What wire specifically are you asking about? or do u need help with EVERY wire?

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Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 12:57 PM

hi , i have the dmm from previous encounters , howie mentioned diodes but didnt say where for , no i am not having a go at him he probably assumed i should know . on the door connections it says positive or negative on them does this mean it doesnt matter which? , is the door lock in put a constant 12v? on the two outputs is that one for each door?when it says the starter , interior lamp and brake pedal connections are negative 500 and 200ma output what exactly does this mean ? is the brake pedal connection necessary on a manual car , i presume it is there for cars that need the brake pedal depressed when starting. on the door pin connections one is positive input and one is negative input , do i connect to +on one door and - on the other or do i connect to the = and- on the drivers door? .on the turn signal connections i presume one is for the left and one for the right turn. the start kill/ anti grind relay , is it wired to the car body side of the loom with the alarm wired to the ignition switch side?i also dont think i need the key in signal connection. the trunk/boot connection i will run to the boot until i get an actuator motor for it , someone here informed me that the spare door actuator i have would be too weak to work on this release.

so essentially it is every wire that i was trying to confirm , excuse my stupidity but we are all stupid before we learn

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 1:38 PM

Here we go, from memory becvause I haven't been near this model in about 10 years! Starting from rear:-
Pin switch for rear luggage compartment (unless there's a light there to find which wire of 2, remove plug from bulb and test leads. The one you want is the one NOT showing 12volts or with a DMM it shows continuity to ground (earth). Connect via a diode as stated before with the diode band towards the switch. Next again a pin switch for the engine bay, again with a diode. Join together. Siren position, on Mk2 and 3 I install in engine bay near the fan inlet (right hand side) you might have a similar place. The alternative is right at the front which is where your third pin switch goes, also with diode mounted the same way. Bring those leads to the wire on your alarm that says trunk/hood either or both.
Door contacts or triggers. Join to either pin switch or check at floor loom driver's kick panel probably RED / white with either white or silver dots.TEST
The alarm will tell you lights, you need indicators, probably a single output wire from the alarm, no expense spared then,2 x 2N5404 diodes join to that wire with bands away from alarm and join to GREEN/ black and GREEN/ YELLOW on loom coming away from steering wheel or loom in driver kick panel.TEST
Lock and unlock will be in one of the plugs probably white in the driver kick panel. with your DMM set to continuity, place the black probe to ground. There are a number of bolts grounding factory cables use one of there. With the other end probe all the connectors in that plug. Remove ign. key and throw over lock striker on that door, shut the other door. This will give you lock and unlock. TEST Set the alarm for negative lock output. Yes polarity is EXTREMELY important with DC work that's what I was trying to put over to you.
Ignition and start: tach; at the back in the engine bay is the coil. You are looking for a cable set that goes from this to the distributor.
Test each of these the following way. DMM set to 20v AC the correct wire will give 2.5 - 3volts AC on idle. Increasing the revs should give you about 5 volts AC.
Ignition not sure, I think BLACK/ orange, ignition 2 BLACK / YELLOW starter, BLACK/ white ACC blue plus 1 or 2 constant 12volt wires either white or BLACK/ red. These will be your power supply for your unit.TEST
Ignition 1 is the wire that goes to 12v+ on ignition (not Acc) and stays at 12v+ whilst cranking the engine i.e. the start sequence.
That's it, good luck.

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 1:47 PM

Again neg on the door triggers or pins Starter 500milliamps? Can't be that circuit draws 10-20amps, must be why they gave you a relay. This is normal wiring for a starter kill relay....alarms neg armed output (GWA) to relay 85 ignition INPUT to 86, starter switch to 30 and starter side + remote start input (starter output) to 87a.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 1:59 PM

that is exactly what i neede howie , i really appreciate it and apologise for any earlier misunderstanding , i would hold neither you or anyone on this forum responsible for misinformation as previously intimated by someone , i am big enough and ugly enough to be responsible for my own mistakes , so once again many thanks for taking the time to help and the patience

Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 2:36 PM

damn howie, your good !

i was going to show you a complete wire matchup from unit to car, but i guess you wont be needing that. good luck with the install.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 2:40 PM

if you have that worked out i would be interested to see it , i had a look howie at the schematic and i thought the wire marked trunk was for a remote boot release , the valet mode for safety is built in to the led push button , i am not doubting your expertise just looking for confirmation , thanks

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 5:25 PM

Your alarm should show a pictorial icon of a pin switch for the trunk trigger. I never discussed trunk release, there's no point you've got a perfectly good mechanical release there. Tommy it's 36 years! What's the valet switch got to do with anything I've mentioned? You're going all over the place here. Be methodical. Hell I even told you what and where on that vehicle.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 13, 2009 at 5:33 PM

thanks for the confirmation

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 15, 2009 at 7:31 AM

i nhave started working my way through identifying the wire in my 1988 toyota mk1 mr2 supercharger , the first problem i have come to is that there are 2 different wires showing 12v only at starter turn , one is brown /red the other BLACK/ white . the brown /red one was previously used for the immobiliser i removed while the BLACK/ white one has only a little nick in the insulation(presumably someone else was testing before but didnt reinsulate), the site identifies the starter as being the black and white one but what is the BROWN / red one for . any ideas?

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 15, 2009 at 7:36 AM

i should have added that i cant locate the ign2 wire either by testing or by the sites suggested colour coding (BLACK/ orange), in fact there is no wires of that description in the harness

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 15, 2009 at 12:12 PM

OK shove gear to neutral, feed from your 12volt constant source to the ignition, then fed from ignition to starter by flashing across. One of those two will start the car if it takes both, wire as follows. Your remote start starter output, feed from that to relay 86, ground to relay 85, constant 12V+ fused at 30amps to 30 and second starter wire from 87.
You might have only 1 ignition wire, there's no reason why not.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 15, 2009 at 12:18 PM

ok howie , i will try that in the morning and post the result , many thanks for thr prompt reply

Posted By: boxhead78
Date Posted: December 16, 2009 at 10:11 PM

1987-90 Toyota MR2 Alarm, Remote Starter, Keyless Entry Wiring Information
Constant 12V+	WHITE/ Red	Ignition Switch Harness
Starter	BLACK/ White	Ignition Switch Harness
Ignition	BLACK / YELLOW	Ignition Switch Harness
Ignition 2	BLACK/ Orange	Ignition Switch Harness
Accessory	Blue/Black	Ignition Switch Harness
Tach	Black	Test Connector
Brake Switch	GREEN / WHITE	Brake Switch
Trunk Pin	n/a
Parking Lights	Green	Connector in Passenger's Kick Panel
Head Lamp	RED / White	And Red at Connector in Passenger's Kick Panel
Hood Pin	n/a
Factory Disarm	n/a
Door Trigger	RED / White (-)	Or RED / Yellow (-) at Connector in Passenger's Kick
Door Lock	Blue/White (-)	Driver's Kick Panel
Door Unlock	Blue/Red (-)
Horn Wire	GREEN/ Red (-)	Connector in Passenger's Kick Panel

• Cruise Control Information • Stereo Information • View all Toyota Vehicles

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boxead78

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 17, 2009 at 3:55 AM

hi , thanks for that post but i had already looked that up on the forum the problem is that my wiring coe doesnt match all those colours , howie suggested flashing the ignitiion, but when i went to do it i bottled out(sorry howie) my wires and the readings i get are below if any geniuses out there can identify them it would be a great help . the general consensus is that theBLACK/ white wire is the starter but the BROWN / red behaves almost the same

posted_image

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 17, 2009 at 11:08 AM

i traced the ignition wires further down the harness to another plug and found that the wires on the other side of that are "by the book" so i can only presume the ignition barrel was changed at some time . there is a brown and red wire going to a black and white wire and a black and white wire going to a second identical black and white wire , so in essence there are two starter wires coming from the ignition switch!go figure !

anyway i should be able to sort it all out tomorrow evening but in the back of my mind i will always wonder why the two different coloured wires connect to two smaller diameter wires of the same colour, in other words why does start require two wires , any suggestions would be useful , not for the install but for my own curiosity

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 10:20 AM

i am currently installing my new alarm (yes howie , still doing it ), this is a picture of the supposed starter kill relay supplied with the alarm with their colour coding labelled . i have looked at your database and cant match this method of wiring with any of the examples given . i presume that i still have to cut the starter wire and wire as usual or is this a different way of doing it . any suggestions or explanations gratefully received .

posted_image

Posted By: the12volt
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 10:35 AM

scoobyblue, please do not create a new topic for each part of your installation. Please continue posting in this thread.

https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp~TID~1725

Thanks in advance.

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posted_image the12volt • Support the12volt.com

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 12:30 PM

Ref that relay in your last photo, it's completely wrong, could you tell me the terminal numbers those colours go to please?

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 1:09 PM

white -30

red-87a

yellow-86

orange(alarm start kill negative 500ma output)-85

blue-87

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 4:53 PM

The white yellow and orange are correct, red goes to starter (starter side ) and joined to the remote start's starter output. yellow is joined to the ignition and remote start's ignition output. Orange is the r/s alarm's GWA wire, i.e ground when armed. Ignore the blue, you don't have a 2nd ignition also at the ignition lead, don't wire up the brown or BROWN / red.

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 18, 2009 at 5:09 PM

top man , once again thanks for your time and explanation posted_image

Posted By: scoobyblue
Date Posted: December 31, 2009 at 12:19 PM

i hope everyone had a peaceful christmas and a happy new year to you all . i have finally got around to completing the wiring of my new alarm and have redone it several times , why i hear you cry , quite simple , i have followed the instructions both here and in the supplied instructions and the alarm and remote simply wont pair up or recognise each other or whatever the technical term is . i realise this description is a bit vague but all i know is that the car still starts with the key and all seems to be as normal but the remote does not communicate with the alarm module.Any ideas , anyone?

Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 31, 2009 at 3:46 PM

Go back to my first post.
This is where I (yawn) say " TOLD YOU SO"