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viper 5902 completed 1

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=118795
Printed Date: May 19, 2024 at 3:15 AM


Topic: viper 5902 completed 1

Posted By: a068906
Subject: viper 5902 completed 1
Date Posted: December 24, 2009 at 9:23 PM

I just completed my first car alarm install and let me tell you, it was not easy, but it was very rewarding. Everything appears to work: trunk sensor, hood sensor, door sensor, parking lights, trunk popper and all the general things, but what I am having issues with is my remote start. My remote start cranks fine and starts the vehicle, but then it dies after 5 or 6 seconds. It doesn't appear to be the immobilizer because the green key is not flashing, and I've also tried to remote start with my key in the ignition; again, same results, starts for 5 secs than dies. The 5902 defaults to 3 attempts, and reports back to my 2-way with a 'low battery' message along with a car battery icon. I'm currently set up on virtual tach for the moment. Could this be the cause? Also, my car starts fine without the remote start, so I'm assuming my wires to the ignition should be correct, right?

Here are the specs:

-2005 Acura TSX (auto)
-Viper 5902
-Canmax400dei (Honda4 firmware ver. 1.00)
-507M Tilt (tested...works fine)
-520T backup battery (tested...works fine)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.



Replies:

Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: December 24, 2009 at 9:40 PM
posted_imageTachometerUSE INJECTOR(AC)ANY INJECTOR WIRE THAT IS NOT YELLOW/BLACK




Posted By: KPierson
Date Posted: December 24, 2009 at 10:44 PM

It's my understanding that the virtual tach doesn't use any feedback from the vehicle, so chances are that isn't why the system is shutting down.

What happens if you start the car with the key, then remote start the car, then remove the key?  Does the car stay running or does it shut down?



-------------
Kevin Pierson




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 24, 2009 at 11:42 PM
Wow. Thanks for the quick reply guys. The idea about starting the car w/ the key and removing it was clever. Good thinking. Anyway, I tried it and it actually stayed on after I removed the key. I also tapped the brake to see if it would shut off, and it did. Afterwards, I attempted to remote start w/out the key but it shut off again after a few seconds. I then put the key back in, set it to the 'ON' position (which I didn't do before...I just left it in the 1st position earlier) and it stayed on. But to my suprise, I also noticed that it made the starter turn excessively while intializing the remote start. After realizing this starter issue, I again attempted the remote start w/out key to see if it would repeat the starter overturn, and it did, all the way until the engine shut-off (4-5 secs). This may be why I'm receiving the 'Low Battery' msg.

Recap in case I may have confused you:
-Started w/ key, remote started, removed key = worked
-Key to ON position, remote started, starter grinded, removed key = worked
-Remote started w/out key, started grinded = did not work

It's something to do with the starter, any idea?




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 24, 2009 at 11:54 PM
Just wanted to clarify that after remote starting w/out key, the engine does run, but the starter keeps turning until the engine shuts-off.




Posted By: tegguy
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 12:17 AM

I am new to all this and can't find an install manyal for the 5902 but It almost sounds like the remote start is not getting the information about the vehicles battery. Have you tried to reprogram the virtual tach? I would look into the voltage sence becuase it sounds like that is where your issue is. Here is what my 5901 install manual says about your problems

The vehicle starts, but immediately dies.
1. Does the vehicle have an immobilizer? The vehicle’s immobilizer cuts the
fuel and/or spark during unauthorized starting attempts.
2. Is the remote start programmed for virtual tach or voltage sense? If so, the
crank time may not be set high enough. Voltage sense does not work on
some vehicles.
3. Check diagnostics. Sometimes a shutdown becomes active during cranking
or just after cranking.

• The vehicle starts, but the starter keeps running.
1. Is the system programmed for engine checking off or virtual tach voltage
sense? When programmed for either of these features, the engine cranks
for the preprogrammed crank time regardless of how long it takes for the
vehicle to actually start. Adjust to a lower cranking time.
2. Was the Tach Learn successful? The LED must light solid and bright to
indicate a successful learn.
3. Make sure that there is a tach signal at the PURPLE / white tach input wire
of the remote start. If there is not a tach signal, recheck the connection to
the vehicle’s tach wire and make sure the wire is not broken or shorted to
ground leading to the remote start.

• The vehicle starts, but only runs for 10 seconds.
1. Is the remote start programmed for voltage sense? If this does not work, a
tach wire should be used.
2. Check shutdown diagnostics.
• The climate control system does not work while the unit is operating the
vehicle.
Either the wrong accessory wire is being energized or more than one ignition
or accessory wire must be energized in order to operate the climate control
system.





Posted By: tegguy
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 12:19 AM

Also here is the shutdown diagnostics for the 5901 you will need to cross reference to the 5902

Shutdown diagnostics
To perform shutdown diagnostics:
1. With the ignition OFF, press and hold the Valet/Program switch.
2. Turn the ignition ON and then back OFF while holding the Valet/Program
switch.
3. Release the Valet/Program switch.
4. Press and release the Valet/Program switch. The LED flashes to report
the last shutdown for one minute or until the ignition is turned on, as
shown in the following table:
LED Flashes Shutdown Mode
1 flash Runtime expired
2 flashes Over-rev shutdown
3 flashes Low or no RPM
4 flashes Transmitter shutdown (or optional push button)
5 flashes (+) Brake shutdown
6 flashes (-) Hood shutdown
7 flashes Timer mode/Turbo mode/Manual mode error *
8 flashes Neutral safety shutdown
9 flashes Low battery (voltage mode)
10 flashes Alarm triggered **
11 flashes Wait-to-start input timed out
* Timer mode error: Ignition is on or shutdown input is active when activating
timer mode.
Turbo mode error: Turbo mode is programmed off, engine is not on or
shutdown input is active.
Manual mode error: MTS mode not enabled.
** Alarm was triggered during remote start sequence.





Posted By: Steven Kephart
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 1:39 AM
Did you power up all the power input wires for the ignition/accessory relays on the alarm brain (I can't remember what DEI called them)? Even if the vehicle doesn't have a second accessory/ignition, you still have to power up the input on the brain. I remember my boss having remote start issues the first time we did a 5902 and that was the problem. I'd also recommend hard-wiring the tach to the vehicle.




Posted By: zerepdivad
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 2:47 AM
DId you even test the wires? If your starter keeps cranking after the car is started even when you put in the key it's possible you got starter and ignition switched around. And learning tach is the right way to do it. Virtual Tach works maybe 50% of the time from my experiences.

-------------
A DMM is a beautiful thing.

MECP Advanced Installer Certified.




Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 3:04 AM
That symptom is the one where tach hasn't been learned. With respect to Mr. Pierson, I would suggest relearning tach but hard wired using proper tach sense not voltage reference. The over run on the starter motor is the clue. Zerep's comment is absolutely correct.




Posted By: t&t tech
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 7:18 AM
Yes! Elementary symptoms of tach issues! Zerep is correct that virtual tach works 50% of the times! If so much!

-------------
COMMIT YOUR WAY TO JEHOVAH AND HE WILL ACT IN YOUR BEHALF. PSALMS 37:5




Posted By: joebubba
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 9:18 AM
Yeah, definitely hook up the tach wire and program it to tach learn. The wiring diagram for the TSX says you can use the blue wire from the ECM/PCM. Not familiar with the TSX and the location of the ECM/PCM, but that probably means you don't have to transit the firewall:

TSX wiring info

I have the same basic set up (Clifford 50.7X, Canmax400dei, 2004 Acura TL manual trans) with the tach wire hooked up and it works perfectly. I highly recommend not using virtual tach (not available on a manual transmission install anyhow). One more thing: Are you sure you have the updated firmware? There was a timing issue causing start problems with the previous version (0.6).

I do have one question for you: How did you hook up the parking lights? Did you use the + or - wire? Does the 5902 have a fuse to set the lightflash polarity?

Thanks and good luck. I feel pretty certain switching to tack learn will fix your problem.




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 9:36 AM
First of all, Merry Christmas. I will troubleshoot using all your suggestions once I get done plowing the driveway, and for you southerners, that means shoveling snow. One thing I can quickly mention is that I do have power to all my inputs(H3/2, H3/6, and H3/9) and my ignition harness connections are correct--first thing I had checked when the issue arose. And one other thing, I was trying to program the virtual tach last night and in the instructions it mentions to wait for the parking lights to come on after the car starts, then shut off the remote start using the remote. Well, my parking lights never came on, but the vehicle did start, but again, it dies shortly after. I know my parking lights work, at least when I arm and disarm, so i'm not sure what's up with that. Also, I measured the voltage on the ignition harness while starting normally and it only reaches a little over 10V before the engine starts. Does the 5902 need it to reach a certain voltage threshold (12V?) to acknowledge that the vehicle has started? Just wanted to mention that since I saw something like that in the reading somewhere.




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 9:42 AM
Yeah, I have a feeling switching the to tach sense will correct this issue as well, I'm just trying to see how far I can get with this virtual tach before I go there. As for the firmware, I have the 1.00 version which took care of that timing issue. As for parking lights, I'm not using either the wire or the fuse jumper because I thought the canmax would take care of that. My parking lights do work when I arm and disarm.




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 9:58 AM
I should mention that I used the 5901 manual for the install of my 5902. From what I research, they are practically identical.

Joe, how did you wire your parking lights?




Posted By: joebubba
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 1:08 PM
I haven't yet. My original thinking was that I didn't want to advertise that my car was running unattended by having the parking lights come on when remote starting. The canmax will not turn on the parking lights, at least not for the TL.

Yes, the canmax will make the parking lights flash when arm/disarm, but not for the remote start. I believe you need to wire them for that.

And I purposely didn't do that because I wanted "stealth" when my car was running unattended. I'm now starting to change my mind and have been looking at the wiring diagram. It list + and - wires for parking lights. I assume you can hook the DEI up to either wire, depending on how you set the polarity fuse? That's why I was asking.




Posted By: a068906
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 1:56 PM
Alright everyone. BIG THANKS! I went ahead and set it up to tach sense and it works flawlessly. Guess I can't complain about reliability while running tach, right. Joe, I like the idea of 'stealth' mode--I'll be running mine like that as well.

Much respect for those in the auto alarm install biz and you DIY'ers out there. Again, thank you all!




Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 2:39 PM
And thank you and a merry holiday and here in England thank the lord I have a remote start this time of the year. A nice, toasty demisted car to step into! By the way it was us pros who pointed out the tach issue.
If you by-pass the canmax for the white light output, which I believe you can set for either pos or neg, you will have your remote start running lights, BUT I believe you can programme them off.




Posted By: joebubba
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 2:43 PM
Oh brother. Howie, I bow to you and all the pro's. You are more worthy than I.

He said, "All right everyone. BIG THANKS!".

His comment to me was about the parking lights. Get over yourself.




Posted By: joebubba
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 2:47 PM
And had I been the first one to see his post, my amateur reply would have been to use tach sense. But I wouldn't have felt the need to tell everyone that I was the one who made the suggestion....




Posted By: i am an idiot
Date Posted: December 25, 2009 at 4:31 PM
Hmmm.  Am I invisible AGAIN?





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