viper 5901
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=121090
Printed Date: May 14, 2024 at 5:47 PM
Topic: viper 5901
Posted By: akirarex
Subject: viper 5901
Date Posted: March 30, 2010 at 11:46 PM
The 5901 is newly installed in a '99 Civic DX hatchback 5 speed. Everything works on it, parking lights flash, horn, siren, doors unlock/lock, I can program it, I can set off the alarm etc... But I cannot start the car with the key. If I jumper the H3 Green and Violet wires together it will start (bypasses brain/returns starter wire back to stock). So I need to know how to check that relay, I measured the starter's 12volts at the brain when the key was turned to start (keyside wire), it just doesn't make it to the car side wire. I used the wiring information from this website. What would be really nice is a schematic of the brain in general. What else could be wrong that the brain won't allow it to start with the key?
Replies:
Posted By: x1le
Date Posted: March 30, 2010 at 11:58 PM
not 100% if it would make a difference, but possible you may have mixed the colors up? purple should be connected to car side and green to key side.
Posted By: akirarex
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 1:37 AM
Just went out and rechecked the wiring. H3/1 Pink - BLACK / YELLOW H3/2 RED / White -12Volt constant H3/3 Orange - WHITE/ Black ........... also tried Yellow* H3/4 Violet - BLACK/ White car side of starter wire H3/5 Green - BLACK/ White key side of starter wire H3/6 Red - 12Volt constant H3/7 Pink/White - Yellow ........ also tried WHITE/ Black* (switching H3/7 with H3/3) H3/8 Pink/Black ---- Not connected H3/9 RED / Black - 12Volt constant. -----Programmed Flex Relay H3/7 to Accessory 2 -------
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 3:47 AM
OK turn round the green and purple (violet). Green goes to KEY SIDE of BLACK/ white and purple to STARTER SIDE. As for the ORANGE / white and pink/white, if the car's yellow and WHITE/ black BOTH test as ACC, it really doesn't matter. If on the other hand one stays LIVE while cranking the engine, i.e. turning the ignition key to start and either stays live, treat that as a second ignition. Sorry it's a couple of years since and I can't remember.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 3:51 AM
Sorry just read your second post, one thought; this has come up before, I've a feeling the internal starter cut /anti grind relay has failed. Temporarily join the green and purple, then see if the car starts. If so it's definitely that relay.
Posted By: akirarex
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 7:22 AM
I posted that (the car will start with the violet and green jumpered) in the first post..... but what you said about the Ignition 2 had me puzzled, I tested the wires in all key positions and I knew that only one wire had ignition and start voltage, and that was the BLACK / YELLOW wire in the H3/1 position. So I did a quick test and got the car to start .... this is how it was wired to key start. H3/1 Pink - WHITE/ Black 12 volts reads at key positions: 1, 2 H3/2 RED / White - Constant 12volts H3/3 Orange - BLACK / YELLOW 12 volts reads at key positions: 2, Start H3/4 Violet - BLACK/ White starter car side H3/5 Green - BLACK/ White starter key side Start H3/6 Red - Constant 12volts H3/7 Pink/White - Yellow 12 volts reads at key positions: 2 H3/8 Pink/Black - No Connection H3/9 RED / Black - Constant 12volts So I'm not sure if it's wired correctly, but it did start.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 7:31 AM
WHITE/ black is therefore your ACC, and yellow should be treated as your 2nd. ignition. H3/7 Which I believe is programmable as 2nd ign, maybe it's the default model but you're correct any way* It's down to the anti grind/starter cut relay being faulty and yes this topic has come up before! We've seen that component fail before.
*We'll never see this unit in Europe so I'm just going on the circuit diagrammes I've accessed.
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 8:01 AM
disconnect both the purple and green wires. connect green to a constant 12v source and disarm the system. If the relay is defective, there will no 12v reading on the purple wire. if there is continuity the wire is fine. and when you arm it, the voltage should drop to zero.
------------- Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
Posted By: akirarex
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 9:31 AM
Howie II: H3/7 is the programmable line, Flex Relay function set to 1: (ignition 2 **factory default) functions the same as the Pink Ignition 1 wire. Flex Relay function set to 2: functions the same as the Orange Accessory 1 wire. Flex Relay function set to 3: functions the same as the Purple Starter 1 wire. I have it programmed to 2. Tedmond: I left the wiring as it was in my second post (how I was able to key start the car). I removed the Green wire and put a Radio Shack 12 volt (13.8 volt reading) power supply to it. The Purple wire read the 13.8 volts with the key out and Disarmed. Then turning the key, key position 1 was zero, 2 was zero, and Start was 13.8 volts. When the system was Armed I measured 13.8 volts at the purple wire with no key in.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 10:12 AM
Think what Ted is saying is that when the alarm is turned OFF there should be continuity between the green and purple wires. All you need is a DMM, set it continuity or low ohms reading, place one lead on the junction with car's BLACK/ white to the green the other at the junction with the BLACK/ white to purple (or violet). If you don't follow our instructions which are given for reasons of experience and the best will, you'll be running around like a headless chicken!  That's the reason, you've done everything else correctly, you've got the purple and green the right way round, the only recourse is to check the Viper's continuity. Young Ted is THE Honda expert on this site, we've just given you alternate methods of testing this. Try a voltage test at the green and violet wires with the alarm OFF. If the car still doesn't we're looking at something else. OK now I've confused myself.
Posted By: akirarex
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 2:38 PM
I believe I did what Ted said.... I applied voltage to the Green side and read the Purple side, it was reading the voltage with the system disarmed. When I armed the system there was no change in the state of that, it still read the voltage, which I believe he said should go to 0volts when armed. Then I was a little bit confused by the wording of "OFF" so I thought that would mean to disconnect the brains power completely (unplugging the H1 main connector) so I did that and applied voltage to the Green side and measured voltage on Purple. I then reconnected the H1 main harness and it still read voltage on the Purple. So as far as I can tell.....the off state reads 0 ohms/ I can measure voltage through that relay....... but what I'm not seeing is a change in that relay's state by this test......the Purple always reads voltage. Well to be more precise, the only time I measure a change in state on the Purple is with it disarmed, and turning the key to position 1 and 2, that will read 0 volts, and then 12 volts at start and key off.
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: March 31, 2010 at 3:07 PM
looks like the internal relay is stuck or defected. just bypass it by using an external relay and a ground when armed from the unit. you will get the same thing, just externally. 85 - ground when armed(starter kill) and ground when running aka status if you want antigrind. if using both diode isolate.
86 - ignition 1
87a - start wire on car key side
30 - start wire on car motor side. ------------- Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
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