rain sensor to control windows

Hello everyone! This might be my first post although i've been lurking around forever.   Anyways I have a project that I am just starting to look into as I start my 5902 install on my 06 Acura TL.   I live in NC and my car sits outside at work in the blazzing heat all day! I like to leave my windows vented but in the plant I work its hard to tell its raining until its too late!    

Basically I want to build a circuit that will trigger when it senses rain, activating most likely a pair of 530T's to rain my windows or just have it arm my car alarm again which would effectively close my windows.

I actually purchased a small water sensing circuit just to mess around with (link below). Basically just a set of contacts that once bridged activates a buzzer with the help of a transistor and a few resistors.   I'm sure I could use this to activate a transistor and a relay instead of a buzzer.    

There are a few things that I want it to do however that i'm not too sure about.   I need to make sure that once it activates for the first time the circuit will deactivate until my car is armed/disarmed again so its not constantly triggering. Other then that I also wanted to look into maybe using one of the OEM rain sensors commonly used to control windshield wipers. These actually sense changes in light caused by rain and mount on the windshield under the mirror typically. I really have no idea how they work though and dont want to buy something I cant use.   

I think this is a pretty sweet feature im surprised how little information I could find on it besides some VW in Europe come with one that will close its windows.

Any information or ideas on the circuit design are welcome! I know relays, diodes, LED drivers, and just starting to build circuits with transistors P/N channel and a few 555 timer projects.   


https://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?PartNumber=320-122

The rain sensors that mount to the windshield would be the best way to go. Not sure where to find one though and not sure if an OEM one can be interfaced.

On your TL you can raise the windows by double pulsing the key cylinder wire in the drivers door - you shouldn't need the 530T on the TL.

-------------
Kevin Pierson

https://www.raintracker.com/

i believe you can use the "fast relay" terminals as contact closure.
pink and orange connect when rain is present.

mark

Well there are a ton of them on ebay. Not sure how they work but depending on how the sensor works I might be able to figure out how rain effects the output, maybe I can get it to trigger a transistor.

As for the TL and the windows, I was aware it could trigger the OEM system to raise the windows but someone had told me it was a 7-9 second pulse on the arm/lock wire.   He drew me a diagram like this(below).      


[BUT The only reason was I was considering the 530T was because I was told I wouldn't be able vent my windows 2" like the 530T does without disarming my alarm in the process. Is there a way around this?

PS thanks for the link on the rain tracker I actually looked at it a few weeks ago but only briefly.   A bit more then I wanted to put into this project but I supposed I could get auto wiper functionality out of it, depending on how annoying it is.

I looked at the relay diagrams but you will need a pair of 530ts to vent your windows, those diagrams will unlock your doors when you vent.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Yes, using the disarm to lower the windows will require you to relock the doors. Based on the amount of controls you are going to need already to integrate the rain sensor to the windows I don't personally think it is out of the question to utilize the existing functions on the vehicle to close the windows. Your chances of finding a rain sensor that connects directly to a 530T with no added logic is going to be slim.

On the TL the arm wire will also close the sunroof - an added benefit in case it rains.

-------------
Kevin Pierson

Or instead of using comfort close, use that diagram BUT with aux 1 only the close side, (left hand relay) and stop when almost closed. Set the timer for 1 sec. less than window close time. You could use the rain sensor via diodes to trigger that aux 1 but you would need a timed device for say 3 seconds otherwise the relay will be latched, = flat battery.
Trouble is I'm very much in agreement with what Kevin says.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Actually if you just left the two back windows open a couple of inches, rain isn't going to be much of a problem, my only worry would be reduced security.
I used to live in Southern Florida and there we just started up and ran the engine for a few minutes with the AC on, but hey you've got a 5902 installed so why bring this up in the first place, R/S = heater, defog in winter, AC in summer

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

KPierson wrote:

---

Yes, using the disarm to lower the windows will require you to relock the doors. Based on the amount of controls you are going to need already to integrate the rain sensor to the windows I don't personally think it is out of the question to utilize the existing functions on the vehicle to close the windows. Your chances of finding a rain sensor that connects directly to a 530T with no added logic is going to be slim.

On the TL the arm wire will also close the sunroof - an added benefit in case it rains.

---

Thanks everyone for the responses! Where is the multi quote button??!??

If you saw my car you might say it already has to many controls lol.   I dont mind the work adding these gadgets and messing with my car is more of a hobby for me.   

Oh the other hand I really dread the thought of installing the 530T units because its not easy to run wire through the doors on cars these days.    Also I agree I really do want the sunroof tied into everything.   As for the logic between the rain sensor and the alarm thats where all the fun/frustration comes into play!

howie ll wrote:

---

Actually if you just left the two back windows open a couple of inches, rain isn't going to be much of a problem, my only worry would be reduced security.
I used to live in Southern Florida and there we just started up and ran the engine for a few minutes with the AC on, but hey you've got a 5902 installed so why bring this up in the first place, R/S = heater, defog in winter, AC in summe

---

I actually have no real concerns for security where I am, thankfully.    I also try not to make a habit of idling my car especially with the a/c on. Its hard on the engine especially when its 100 deg out.   Actually more then my comfort I vent my windows to keep the interior temperatures down because i'm trying to keep the plasticizers from leaking out of my plastics to a minimum lol.

Anyways back to the project...

Before I can start thinking about this logically I need to figure a few things out and a few of you seem to have experience with the TL specifically.

-What exactly is the required input to trigger full closure or fully roll the windows down?   I have heard it take a double pulse input and I have also heard a pulsed input for 7-9 seconds. Which is it?

-Am I going to need to purchase a bitwriter to get the functionality I need for any of these outputs?   (I am also using the iDatalink Bypass module if it matter)

-Is there any way I can make it so I vent the windows manually before I leave my car then arm the system without triggering them to roll up, but still have the ability to roll them up when I want to with the remote or the rain sensor with a proper trigger? I would be happy with this functionality if someone could walk me through it.

Again thanks for the help!

Did a 2008 TL a little while ago ( 2004-2008 should be the same).  Used an ADS AL CA with the ADS AL(DL) HA firmware.  Absolutely no issues.    Here are some pictures for the remote start and iDatalink connections. 

Due to space limitations at the steering column, I found it easier to grab +12v Constant and Ignition at the fuse box.

Here is the Immobilizer connector.  iDatalink recommends connecting exactly as shown in the install guide.

You can see the +12v Constant and the Ignition wires at the top of this picture.

As noted in the iDatalink guide, the door locks will work while the engine is running but the trunk release will only work with the engine off.

-------------
Soldering is fun!

roger555 wrote:

---

Before I can start thinking about this logically I need to figure a few things out and a few of you seem to have experience with the TL specifically.

-What exactly is the required input to trigger full closure or fully roll the windows down?   I have heard it take a double pulse input and I have also heard a pulsed input for 7-9 seconds. Which is it?

-Am I going to need to purchase a bitwriter to get the functionality I need for any of these outputs?   (I am also using the iDatalink Bypass module if it matter)

-Is there any way I can make it so I vent the windows manually before I leave my car then arm the system without triggering them to roll up, but still have the ability to roll them up when I want to with the remote or the rain sensor with a proper trigger? I would be happy with this functionality if someone could walk me through it.

Again thanks for the help!

---

The window control is accomplished by simulating the key in the drivers door key cylinder. This requires both a double pulse AND extended trigger. A 10 second pulse is more then adequate - you may be able to get away with less, but 10 seconds is a good number.

The problem with the 530T is the lack of flexibility it offers. You CAN make it so that you can leave the windows vented, but you will need to then be able to "command" the windows to raise (they won't auto raise each time you lock the doors). The command will need to last at least 10 seconds to make sure the windows go all the way up.

There are other window modules on the market that would with the TL that may be a better fit (and do the sunroof as well). You'll have to spend some time on Google and see if you can find something that will be a little friendlier to install (and perhaps not require wires to the doors).

-------------
Kevin Pierson

kreg357 wrote:

---

Did a 2008 TL a little while ago ( 2004-2008 should be the same).  Used an ADS AL CA with the ADS AL(DL) HA firmware.  Absolutely no issues.    Here are some pictures for the remote start and iDatalink connections. 

[

---

Thank you for the pictures!! Do you happen to know how the memory seat/mirror (Driver 1/2) setting will work with the 5902?      Also did you setup the alarm to control window closure?

KPierson wrote:

---

The window control is accomplished by simulating the key in the drivers door key cylinder. This requires both a double pulse AND extended trigger. A 10 second pulse is more then adequate - you may be able to get away with less, but 10 seconds is a good number.

The problem with the 530T is the lack of flexibility it offers. You CAN make it so that you can leave the windows vented, but you will need to then be able to "command" the windows to raise (they won't auto raise each time you lock the doors). The command will need to last at least 10 seconds to make sure the windows go all the way up.

There are other window modules on the market that would with the TL that may be a better fit (and do the sunroof as well). You'll have to spend some time on Google and see if you can find something that will be a little friendlier to install (and perhaps not require wires to the doors).

---

I've used the 530T units before on my acura legend. I was able to have all the windows roll up when I armed but then I could vent at 3 different intervals without unlocking my car. Seems like I could easily control it with a rain sensor also to raise the windows. However I would need another unit for the sunroof and wiring through the door is not desirable.

But what i'm saying is without the use of the 530 T Is there any way I can make it so I vent the windows before I park and leave my car. I then arm the system and they stay open, but still have the ability to roll them up when I want to with the remote by activating one of the aux channels?

Any thoughts on the bitwitter? Will I be able to set the alarm outputs properly through the manual programming methods?

Hey kreg357 did you direct wire the Idatalink to the alarm or does the datalink cord work well on the TL?

Used a Ultra Start U1272 and went the W2W route ( I always go W2W) .  Just a basic remote start with keyless entry.  The iDatalink module controls the cars' factory alarm and supplies a good Tach signal.  If you want the trunk release to work when the engine is running, go directly to the release switch in lower drivers dash panel, YELLOW /GREEN(+) wire at switch.  Didn't do total closure or memory seats.  Memory seats shouldn't be a problem with the Viper, but you will have to go into the drivers door.

Memory Seat 1      Blue / YELLOW (-)         Driver Door Module in door

Memory Seat 2      RED / Yellow (-)         Driver Door Module in door

-------------
Soldering is fun!

So everyone back to the rain sensor.    I don't want to use the 530T units and plan on wiring up with up/down using separate AUX output from the alarm like my diagram above.   

So is there a way I can active one of the AUX channels of the alarm from inside the car starting with a positive or neg trigger from the rain sensor?? (5902 alarm)

Also still no input on the bitwriter anyone?

NOOO dont abandon me!! No thoughts?

There are no external ways to trigger an aux output. And, even if there was, there is no option for a double extended pulse.

In my opinion, your best bet is going to be to get a hold of a rain sensor, understand how it works, and then develop your own control system to integrate with the OEM arm/disarm wires. The most complicated portion of what you are trying to do is to detect when there are drops on the window so that is why I recommend starting there.

-------------
Kevin Pierson

No one's abandoning you, we're all telling you to forget it!
Follow Kevin's advice, if he hasn't invented a module to do this, neither will you.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Thank Kevin I already have the sensor wired up and I have some ideas for a circuit for the double pulse hold circuit shouldn't be too hard.

and Howie you're an ass or is it walker ?   When did Kevin ever give me advise about giving up? and who said Kevin wanted to make a rain sensor anyways?    I'll be sure to post a video of it when I get to my install.

I actually did look in to doing exactly what you are trying to do a few years back. I found a decent source for a rain sensor but it was big, ugly, and expensive so I abandoned the project. I've already got the window control portion under control!

-------------
Kevin Pierson

Well this raintracker unit is very very nice! The sensor is small 1.25x1.25x.5 approx that mounts on the windshield and the sensitivity is adjustable.

It ties into your wiper system to automatically control your wipers as its main purpose

buttt It also has a headlight output to automatically activate your headlights when it starts raining & when it gets dark.

The headlight controller outputs a 12V signal that you can do whatever you want with basically!   If I used this output I could have my windows close when it rains and when it gets dark which is fine with me.   

I just need to figure out how to take that 12v output from the raintracker and convert it to a pulse pulse hold and trigger a timed relay to cut power to the unit so it doesn't continue to close my windows.

Pac Audio from aamp of america has a TR7 which can convert single pulses to almost anything, so you could get your pulse pulse hold. Also you could probably do some type Latching Relay set up to turn the power off to the rain sensor unit untill you disarm the alarm.

thecoolmankyle7 wrote:

---

Pac Audio from aamp of america has a TR7 which can convert single pulses to almost anything, so you could get your pulse pulse hold. Also you could probably do some type Latching Relay set up to turn the power off to the rain sensor unit untill you disarm the alarm. <!-- Product Status begin-->

---

Thank you for this! Looks like this will work perfectly and its pretty inexpensive!

Well I take that back, It almost solves my problem.   It appears the unit can convert a constant input to a (pulsed -pulse) but I don't see an option to latch afterward. However with option 13 If I can some how supply the unit with a pulsed input it provide a latched output after two pulses.

I have also been thinking I am planning on installing the 508D proxy detection unit and I want to wire it so the warn away triggers my windows up.   However without a 530T unit I still run into the issue of trigging the factory window control with a pulse/pulse hold.    

This feature is called comfort closure I should be able to activate it through the 5902 or the idatalink module I would think , instead of trying to recreate the signal myself.

I have my warn away rolling up the windows but I used Twindow window mods. I think they work FAR better than there directed counterpart. And the use a single ground pulse or latched to roll up or down. Here's ther number give them a call. 310-318-6680

I wonder If I could get the 529T to just activate my OEM system with a pulse-pulse/hold

I know we've had our differences on this topic but please hear me out.
I have a gut feeling that this job would be a lot easier with the 12Volt output from your rain sensor feeding a 528t timer module or the Pac if you have one to control one 530t per window pair and a 529t for the roof.
More money but simpler and more reliable.
Twindow might be a good product but it's unknown to me so I can't vouch for it one way or the other, I do know that if correctly installed, i.e. wired directly to each window motor wire, it will give you one-touch up and down for all your switches.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Sorry, you could also feed (diode separate) either the warn-away or the main trigger from the 508d to control the closers although I think you might need a mini relay to boost the output unless it's at least 100 milliamps.

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

Thanks howie I'm going to try everything I can avoid the window modules but it might come down to that in the end. I am leaning toward programming a little pix microcontroller to carry out the functions.

Since you have the knowledge and the time, you might be better off!
My work is constrained by time and KISS!

-------------
Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.

did you find a cheap rain sensor?

I bought the Raintracker RT-50A mentioned on the first page. I havent installed my alarm yet but I did install the raintracker and it is actaully a really awesome auto wiper system!

I will be able to integrate it to close my windows when it rains, but the autowiper system might actually be the more beneficial of the two!   I recently had a chance to test it out on a 1600 mile road trip where it rained off and on quite frequently in both bright sunlight and pouring while it was pitch black it performed flawless!!

It was $ 89 and I installed it myself of course

Have you decided to fit it for the comfort closure? Just looking for some updates I think thats a hell of a project. I'd like to do this on my f250 crew cab. Anyone know if I've got arm and disarm signals from the factory keyless that would work with the DEI modules also could I combine this theory with proper use of the 530's or 529's in conjuntion with the oem keyless? Thinking latched reverse lights triggers on unlock will be first but i'd like to try out this project if you work out the kinks...

I'm about halfway done programming a microcontroller to do the required functions. Its my first microcontroller project and its pretty easy to do! I'm using a PICAXE 18M2 and logicator to program it.

any updates?

Not a whole lot of time lately but I'm finishing my alarm install this weekend so that that I will be focusing on the rain sensor. Don't worry it WILL happen!

Any updates on this?

roger555 wrote:

---

Not a whole lot of time lately but I'm finishing my alarm install this weekend so that that I will be focusing on the rain sensor. Don't worry it WILL happen!

---

It's been about a year now, any updates on the project?

PS: you said something about a video, got a link up?

.

roger555 wrote:

---

I'm about halfway done programming a microcontroller to do the required functions. Its my first microcontroller project and its pretty easy to do! I'm using a PICAXE 18M2 and logicator to program it.

---

roger555 wrote:

---

Not a whole lot of time lately but I'm finishing my alarm install this weekend so that that I will be focusing on the rain sensor. Don't worry it WILL happen!

---

Roger555,

Your last post was in Sep, 2011... right at a year ago.

Got any updates on the project?


.

hello i want to know whats is up with this topic any updates and for the rain sensor i know that if the rain sensor senses rain it will activate and will send a signal to the 530 but if keeps sending the signal to the 530 wouldn't this drain the battery the unit has to
send just one pulse otherwise it will keep sending the signal when ever is raining any updates will be appreciated the best advise is to get rainguards