Printer Friendly Forum Posts - 5103 on ’01 navigator?

Hi Guys! Long time trawller, first time poster. Thanks for creating such a great resource, the wiring diagrams and instructions on the install process on your site have been great.

Background: I'm installing an avital remote start/alarm on my wife's '01 Navigator with factory keyless. The first step of the install went well, I hooked up the basic funtions, siren, hoodpin, antenna, etc. and the first test went well! With the key in the ignition (but not turned) the truck fired right up! Alarm also arms with no indication of bypassing any zones.

Problem: Next step I installed a PKALL bypass kit to get around PATS, but I can't seem to get it programmed. It just shows me a steady red light. I go through the programming cycle but I see the "theft" light blink immediately when i try to remote start, and it never starts. I also have never gotten the 10 flash confirm that the pkall has programmed.

D2D for connector 1
Conn2 as follows
Pink to ignition (the wire i soldered to the ignition harness)
Blue/white to orange off the remote start relay
yellow/black to pink on the PATS wiring in the column
PURPLE / white to purple on the PATS wiring in the column

Any ideas why I can't program this thing? Can someone double check my wiring?

I feel like this car is beating me! Any help is welcome!

Pics to follow, they are too big so I need to chop them down to size.

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

PATS wiring
posted_image

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

Here is the remote start relay wiring, I wired the pkall to the orange for running status blue/white. BTW, just had one of the transponder keys made by the dealership, it says stratec, not ford....could that be an issue?
posted_image

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

I don't have the PKALL install diagram, but my guess is that you have the wrong connection to the remote start relay harness. Most bypasses require the remote start status output (ground when running) connection. The way you have it right now it is connected to the (-) accessory output which loses its ground during crank... therefore your bypass is essentially shutting down when you need it the most. Change the connection to the blue wire from the harness instead of the orange and try programming again.

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

Also, when you had the new key made did you bring them all of the keys you had? As far as I know, all keys need to be programmed at the same time. A quick simple test would be to make sure both keys will start AND run the vehicle for at least 30 seconds. If not then you need to get both keys re-programmed together.

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

blue/white from pkall connect that to BLUE (-) status output of the 5103 or BLUE/WHITE (-) second status/defogger output.

i find it easier to jump the igniton wire instead of remote starting, if you dont have tach programmed.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

offroadzj wrote:

I don't have the PKALL install diagram, but my guess is that you have the wrong connection to the remote start relay harness. Most bypasses require the remote start status output (ground when running) connection. The way you have it right now it is connected to the (-) accessory output which loses its ground during crank... therefore your bypass is essentially shutting down when you need it the most. Change the connection to the blue wire from the harness instead of the orange and try programming again.

Glad you mentioned that, I probed it with my DMM when running......but never checked it during cranking!! I'll change that up tonight.

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

Ted: Can't you also temporarily ground the wait to start wire and remote start for programming?

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

offroadzj wrote:

Also, when you had the new key made did you bring them all of the keys you had? As far as I know, all keys need to be programmed at the same time. A quick simple test would be to make sure both keys will start AND run the vehicle for at least 30 seconds. If not then you need to get both keys re-programmed together.

Keys both work fine, so I assume they will program fine too.

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

tedmond wrote:

blue/white from pkall connect that to BLUE (-) status output of the 5103 or BLUE/WHITE (-) second status/defogger output.

i find it easier to jump the igniton wire instead of remote starting, if you dont have tach programmed.

My tach is voltage programmed, I didn't need to run a lead to a coil harness. It auto set the first time I fired the remote start (with key in ignition but not turned to defeat PATS)

Does this mean I should do the 12 volt jumper to ignition (manually tranny method)?

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

First of all, do yourself a favor and connect the tach. Tach programmed is the most reliable.. especially in climates that change drastically throughout the year (ie the Northeast). And yes, instead of remote starting during the bypass programming, simply jumper power to the ignition wire.

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

offroadzj wrote:

First of all, do yourself a favor and connect the tach. Tach programmed is the most reliable.. especially in climates that change drastically throughout the year (ie the Northeast). And yes, instead of remote starting during the bypass programming, simply jumper power to the ignition wire.

Will do, may not get to it tonight, might be first thing tomorrow. Do my TX/RX wires look right? I was a little confused if I should have the transmit wire of the PKALL hooked to the recieving wire, or the transmit wire for the PATS system..........I think I've been staring at the wires too long, I'm starting to see spots!

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

The PKALL install manual should tell you what pins to connect to. I don't know the wiring off the top of my head.

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

No luck....still can't get it to program. I even swapped the two PATS leads in case they were wrong. What a PITA! all i get is the solid red light..... I even tried the manual method, still no luck. I've rewired entire cars more easily than this by pass.

Any ideas?

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

i had the same damn issue. Key override all (same as pkall, as pkall is rebranded KOA from fortin)

I couldnt get the damn thing to program with 2 master keys, tried jumping ignition no go. Switched tx/rx nada. Went to the transponder ring tapped it there and still no go.

I finally got it to program by using a battery tender. Connect the vehicle battery onto a tender, run 2 extra wires to the bypass for power/ground. During program i jumped ignition with a push button, and it programmed beautifully.

The issue in my opinion was the voltage was fine, but during starting the big motor, the voltage drops to 9volts(verified with my dmm on constant 12v), and i guess it throws the bypass out of programming.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

and run tach, its so simple and much more reliable than virtual tach.

tach isn't the easiest to get to, but its fairly accessible. Large harness towards right side of car going into firewall. First large harness on top.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

actually i just read the post again. the issue is you have a stratec key. that is an aftermarket key that is programmed by cloning the first key.

that will NOT work wot program. you need 2 original Lincoln keys.
Your only option is to use a DEI 556u or Key in a box bypass.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

tedmond wrote:

actually i just read the post again. the issue is you have a stratec key. that is an aftermarket key that is programmed by cloning the first key.

that will NOT work wot program. you need 2 original Lincoln keys.
Your only option is to use a DEI 556u or Key in a box bypass.

The key is from the lincoln dealership, is it really a clone? They had the vehicle and original key for a day to make the copy.Ughhhhhhhh

One other problem (oh great!) The alarm locks the car with arming, but doesn't unlock with disarm. do i need to pulse the GEM to make that work? I feel like I've read postings on here where GEM only provides an unlocking issue after a period of time. Mine doesn't unlock even if I haven't locked it..... Any ideas?

Thanks again for the help!

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

because the key comes from the dealer, it doesn't indicate it was an original key. they prob had some lock smith come and clone the key. the keys are manufactured by strattec, but there is OEM and the STRATTEC branded keys. If your key has a lincoln symbol then its OEM. If it says strattec, the only way to program those are "cloning" with OEM a scantool is required.

the lock and unlock wires are at the keyless entry module. its mounted right towards the firewall, and its the connector to the right if your head is underneath the dash looking at the firewall.

so i had a 98 navigator for start only. the fortin bypass key override all module only requires one key to program and it worked without a problem. i guess your only option now is to sell that PKALL and pick up a fortin piece. Single original key works.heres the install guide
https://ifar.ca/download/1596/preview.html

maybe you can get an update for the pkall?

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

Well i guess we all learn something new every day... I never knew about the Strattec keys. I'll have to keep that in mind from now on.

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205

try programming the PKALL with the fortin manual. maybe that will work out for you.

If you try the "Manual mode" make sure you actually hit and release the programming button once.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

tedmond wrote:

the lock and unlock wires are at the keyless entry module. its mounted right towards the firewall, and its the connector to the right if your head is underneath the dash looking at the firewall.

I must be bumping into a colorblindness issue here, I hooked onto what I though were the thin Pink/light green and Pink / YELLOW wires that my diagram shows should be the lock and unlock wires, but I can only lock....no unlock....

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

tedmond wrote:

because the key comes from the dealer, it doesn't indicate it was an original key. they prob had some lock smith come and clone the key. the keys are manufactured by strattec, but there is OEM and the STRATTEC branded keys. If your key has a lincoln symbol then its OEM. If it says strattec, the only way to program those are "cloning" with OEM a scantool is required.

Son of a vondruke!!! I have a locksmith that offered me the key for $45 and I turned him down because I knew I needed the genuine product.......stupid stealership! Guess I am going back there next week, I paid $90 for an additional master, not a stupid clone!

thanks for clearing up the air on this one...man this install is like roadblock after roadblock.

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Xtant 3300X
BA Pro Series
JL 10" Thumpers

no problem, it can be tricky.

the easiest route is sell your PKALL and use a key-override-all. Single master key needed and it programs.

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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert

dubl0vert wrote:

I must be bumping into a colorblindness issue here, I hooked onto what I though were the thin Pink/light green and Pink / YELLOW wires that my diagram shows should be the lock and unlock wires, but I can only lock....no unlock....

What did the wires you tagged test as? Did they show ground when locking/unlocking?

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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205