viper 5901 with no key into 86 conquest
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=130577
Printed Date: May 17, 2024 at 3:28 AM
Topic: viper 5901 with no key into 86 conquest
Posted By: mazda 6t9
Subject: viper 5901 with no key into 86 conquest
Date Posted: February 10, 2012 at 6:32 PM
So I have a Viper 5704 going into a 86 dodge conquest. This is my personal track car. The key and ign lock has alreay been deleted. The car has 2 ign, 1acc, and 1 starter. its a wire to wire ordeal with the heavy gauge wires coming from the RS. Ign 1 pink, Ign 2 pink/white, acc orange, starter violet. strait foward.
Can i use low amp negative auxillary outputs of the RS to power up the relays in the RS through micro negative grounded switches? So i would supply a ground though lets say the starter button to the negative violet wire from the Viper RS module.
I know the IGN can be split with diodes to the pink and pink/white negative wires and the ACC would need its own switch also(no prob). I would have a hidden ign switch that would do take over and supply a +positive to the large pink through a relay.
Trying to go completely keyless except a 2way remote. Might even look into rfid for ign takeover.
Please post any thoughts. Keys on a track car sucks
Replies:
Posted By: Mike M2
Date Posted: February 10, 2012 at 6:52 PM
Well my first thought was i hope you need to turn the ignition off fast in an emergency...
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Mike M2
Tech Manager
CS Dealer Services
Posted By: metz35
Date Posted: February 10, 2012 at 7:27 PM
Why even use a remote starter. Just a toggle to ignition relay and a start button. I highly doubt you would use accessories in a track car. ????
Posted By: mazda 6t9
Date Posted: February 10, 2012 at 7:32 PM
It will still see the street and is for show also. Just trying to lose the key and still keep the 2way RS.
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 10, 2012 at 8:47 PM
if you are using negative outputs to control the relays currently, the negative out from the remote start would work fine.
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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
Posted By: mazda 6t9
Date Posted: February 11, 2012 at 12:43 AM
No relays yet. I am hoping to back feed them through the Viper Remote start AUXILIARY output wires. NOT piggy back them except the ign just for RS takeover.
It says in remote start inst manual
Note: Wires 1-4 on the remote start auxiliary outputs are wired to the (-) triggers for the ONBOARD remote start relays and are NOT diode isolated.
So if I ground these wires without the alarm armed should i be able to use the remote start relays to turn on ign, start, then acc after started.? I would be using the micro switches on a panel. Maybe have the ign hidden.
Start button will be led s2000 style to fill the old large key hole.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: February 11, 2012 at 11:16 AM
Use a switch similar to a lighting switch, i.e. off, on circuit 1 ACC, and on circuits 1 and 2, ACC and IGN which works as off/on/on and a push button switch for start, various circuits being added with fuses and relays.
Then add the R/S. OR, contact (PM) Kevin Pierson at KP technologies, he manufactures push to start devices.
Damn, I normally never answer posts beginning with "So", it means the writers can't write English properly so what's the quality of their work like.
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: mazda 6t9
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 10:23 AM
Howie thank you for the info. I figured some micro or trick looking switches can be used on the acc and start as long as they give me - out. Less relays the better.
I am trying to come up with a simple enough rfid card that i can put in my iphone case in the rear. So I could smart start and then do ign take over by putting my Iphone in a specific locatin. as long as the phone stays in the "holder" it will keep the ign on. I was thinking keyless rfid but might have found something cheaper and cooler. still searching. Wiring will start as soon as my ricer start switch arrives.
Not to get too far off topic but. How the heck does the LARGE gauge pink wire that puts out a IGN power upon remote start know when you turn the key and power it up? so how does it see positive when it is putting out a positive to the IGN?
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 10:40 AM
That's a case of don't think about it, it'll drive you potty!!
The pink acts as an ignition input sensing wire to tell the alarm part that the ignition is on but also as the ignition output wire.
I was also thinking that you could also run the whole shebang from the WHITE/ blue aux wire, simply a momentary switch press once etc. to start the car, except you would still need to switch ignition once you entered the car then flick that switch off to turn off the engine.
That would satisfy the safety requirements, but give you no separate control over the ACC circuits.
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: offroadzj
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 11:04 AM
I always thought that the Pink ignition wire was an output only. The remote starter doesn't know that you put the key in the ignition and it just simply shuts down when you push on the brake pedal... but if the key is in the ignition then the factory ignition switch is maintaining power to the vehicle. If you remote start, put the key in the ignition, then take it back out before pressing the brake pedal, the remote starter keeps the ignition running... it only shuts down by one of the shutdown inputs (brake, hood pin, neutral safety)
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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 11:13 AM
Kenny, the install sheet has it as an input/output. Now leave me whilst I watch an important soccer match from Birmingham (England*) and do a schematic for our friend.
*Oh the joys of a 42" Pana Plasma and HD, thank you BBC/ESPN/Sky Sports.
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: mazda 6t9
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 12:13 PM
thanks howie, hope your team pulls through.
The manual has large pink as a input and output.
So how does it just know you turned the key on? You cannot press the brake pedal before you turn ignition. So the ign key has to send it a positive signal in order.
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: February 12, 2012 at 12:14 PM
Shoot Man City won yet again, shows what happens when you take a middling team and spend a billion $ (£750 mil over 2 years) of oil money including 3 managers in 2 years.
This diagram should show everything and answer Mike M2's point about ignition kill, also separate control of ACC.
Procedure:
R/S running, turn off alarm and enter car, flick on ignition and ACC switches both should be latched, the ignition 2 amp, the ACC 10 amp power handling.
Foot down on brake pedal for takeover and away you go.
To stop the engine just turn off ignition switch. (I still think my original off/on 1/on 1 and 2 is simpler).
For normal starting, flick the ACC and IGN switches press the starter button.
Don't use any micros, they won't latch or hold the current required.
keyless_ignition_and_remote_start.bmp------------- Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
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