2009 honda ody touring viper 5904 issues
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=130677
Printed Date: May 17, 2024 at 11:26 PM
Topic: 2009 honda ody touring viper 5904 issues
Posted By: ngooo
Subject: 2009 honda ody touring viper 5904 issues
Date Posted: February 20, 2012 at 2:42 PM
Hi Folks,
I have an 2009 Honda Odyssey, and recently installed a viper 5904 with xpresskit DBALL.
I have tried virtual tach, tach (at injector) and now voltage sense. The common thing was that it worked the majority of the time but had some periodic failures using all three types of starter detection. I have tried replacing the battery.
What i have noticed is that it would usually remote start without any issues whenever i tried it in the morning. The failures would normally occur if i drove it during the day and left it for an hour or so, and tried to remote start it.
I have the bitwriter, so when it failed with virtual tach, i would try to increase the fine tuning to add more time but it wouldn't work, but would start with the key. when i had on tach sense, and it wasn't working i would try to incresase it to the max at 20, but it wouldn't crank over, but the key would work. On voltage sense, it would work at 1.2 setting, but when it would fail, i would try to increase that to 2 secs, but still it wouldn't crank over.
Today when it wouldn't remote start, i hooked up the volt meter on the ignition line coming out of the viper 5904, it would show only 12-12.2 volts when i activate the R/S, but it wouldn't crank over. i put the key in and start it, then turn it off. I would reactivate the R/S, and the ignition wire would show 12.4 volts and the R/S would work.
In virtual/tach/voltage, when it would fail, it would attempt to start but never seemed like it had enough juice to turn it over. Now i know that i am not getting enough voltage on the ignition line, what should i be checking for? Since it is a new battery, could it be something to do with the starter or alternator? Or should i look into getting a bigger battery?
Replies:
Posted By: offroadzj
Date Posted: February 20, 2012 at 3:08 PM
Virtual tach is not reading an actual tach signal. From what I understand, it is just a more accurate voltage sensing. Program the unit for tach sensing, learn the tach signal, and that should fix your sensing issue.
However, it sounds like it may not necessarily be a tach sensing issue. There have been a lot of issues with new honda batteries dropping too much and causing the remote starts to shut down. Connect your DMM to the r/s ground input and the main 12v + input as close to the unit as you can get. Activate the remote start and see what you get for voltage drop.
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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 6:44 AM
I am the same guy with the 8 pages thread, just thought i would recap to paint the picture of what i think the problem is.
Already did the tach learning, learn it as high as 1800 RPM, and it still had the occasional fails. It is definitely not the cranking time, as i switch to voltage sense and program it for a long 2 secs. When it fails, i could set the crank time for as high as i want, there just isn't enough juice.
I have already replaced the battery (spiral grid battery), voltage drop down to 10.Xvolts, lowest i have seen is the occasional 9.9volts.
The failure tends to occur usually when after driving, parking it for a couple of hours and trying to remote start. It's like the battery doesn't get back to full power in that short time of rest. Have never had a failure in the morning. Starting to wonder if it is the new honda batteries that drops to much, or is it the honda system that causes the large drops? It is not the crank times or tach signal, but the occasional insufficient battery causing my headaches. Since the battery is only a couple of months old, i don't think that is it? Wondering if i should run a power&ground line straight to the battery? Or would those DEI battery backup packs be useful in this case?
Any comments/suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 7:37 AM
go back to the dealer and have the alternator tested to see if its still working properly. sounds like the battery isnt getting charged.
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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
Posted By: offroadzj
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 9:03 AM
I would agree, get the alternator tested. But even Low 10's, High 9 voltage seems to be a pretty big drop for that car. I could see it if it were a larger v8 engine maybe, but not on that...
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Kenny
Owner / Technician
KKD Garage LLC
Albany, NY 12205
Posted By: itsyuk
Date Posted: February 21, 2012 at 2:42 PM
i would stick a battery charger on it for the 2 hours it off and then remove the charger and see if it starts. if it does every time, then you are on the right path with the battery/alt issues.
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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: February 22, 2012 at 6:39 AM
tedmond wrote:
go back to the dealer and have the alternator tested to see if its still working properly. sounds like the battery isnt getting charged.
The more i think of it, the more sense it makes. During the week, i never have the dvd player or heated seats on, and my drive to work is always long. Never have a failure in the morning or during day, after leaving work. The remote starts everytime.
On the weekend, we all load the van's system with the heated seats, navigation, and dvd player. It will be a short 15-20 minute drive to the hockey rink. When i come out an hour later, it is a hit and miss if the remote starter will work. and when it doesn't work, i tried increase the crank time on the spot to 2 secs, and it still wouldn't work. This is where i notice the voltage on the viper ignition wire is slightly a little too low to start it. It will sit a around 12.1-12.2 volts. After a few more unsuccessful attempts with the R/S, i'll put in my key and start it up, turn it off. I then try to read the voltage again on the viper as i try to R/S, and the voltage is reading 12.4 everytime. The key start somehow makes more voltage available to the R/S?
Somehow, when i load the system on the weekend, and go on a short drive, the battery can't fully charge everytime theory would make sense. And this is where it gets me, it so intermittent, just wondering if the alternator test will show a good test and i still might need to replace it if i want the R/S to work everytime. Will have to schedule appointment with the dealership soon.
Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: February 22, 2012 at 7:56 AM
it could be bypass related as well. If the vehicle fails to start one day via remote start, place a key into the ignition cylinder in the off position and try the RS. If it starts everytime, there is a bypass issues.
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Ted
2nd Year Tier 1 Medical School
Still installing as a hobby...pays for groceries
Compustar Expert
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: February 22, 2012 at 8:27 AM
good tip, will definitely try that on the next fail.
Posted By: blkrhyno
Date Posted: March 13, 2012 at 9:36 AM
Sorry bring this back up but did you ever figure this out ? I have the same issue with my 5902, it starts every single time I start it in the morning or evening when leaving work but never when I go for a short drive. I think because I program the tach when the car was cold that it only starts when the engine is cold. I was thinking of programing the tach when the car is warm but I was afraid it wouldn't start when the car is cold, anyone experienced this ? My tach is hard wired @ injector by the way.
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Protect what's yours.
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: April 26, 2012 at 8:02 PM
this thing is so insane. The things i tried to narrow it down: I purchased a new battery. learned the tach at a 1500 rpm, tried voltage sense, virtual tach, went w2w, went d2d. tested the electrical system at canaditan tire, was told the alternator was working great. I threw everything but the kitchen sink. My last resort was to install a 528T delay which didn't allow power to the Accessory until after the van started. since i tried voltage sense/tach/ and virtual tach, i don't think it is tach related. I believe it is power related and short drives is the key to this. My guess is that the battery gets drained with all the electronics on the short trip and doesn't get charged enough for the remote start after a short trip. Of course, that is just my guess. Not sure how i can prove that.
Posted By: blkrhyno
Date Posted: April 30, 2012 at 10:21 PM
I tried driving with nothing on in the car and the same thing happens. I've installed a 5904 on my friends car, same year, make, & model as mine and his car starts every single time. I ordered a dei 454t so I'm going see if that works for me, I don't know what else to try. I've been installing alarms for severals years and my personal car is the only one I can't get to work like it should, LOL.
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Protect what's yours.
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: May 01, 2012 at 7:45 PM
just curious, how will the 454t help?
in my case, i went to voltage sense, hardwire tach, bypass tach, virtual tach, all the same result. you should check the battery when it doesn't start, if it is like mine, the voltage is just not enough.
please come back and post if you ever figure it out. since i have delayed the accessory, i have had less failures, but still some.
Posted By: blkrhyno
Date Posted: May 06, 2012 at 7:40 AM
So I received the 454t on 5-3-12 I installed it on 5-4-12 and I have to say it works like a charm. My car starts on every single try now. If you decide to get it change your tach sensing to voltage. I think I'll pick up a few of these to keep on hand just in case.
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Protect what's yours.
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: December 12, 2012 at 8:32 AM
So its winter, and i want this thing to work 100% of the time, so i have purchased the 454T.
First question, if the BLACK/ grey wire goes to the tach input of the R/S, why would i change from tach sense to voltage?
Reading the installation guide of the 454T, it just shows the unit being tied to the alternator cable but no actual physically wire connections? Anyone with 454T experience, please kindly confirm?
Posted By: howie ll
Date Posted: December 12, 2012 at 10:05 AM
That's exactly correct, actually it's the best non-intrusive method of picking up tach, it "reads" the spikes in the battery to alternator feed by induction so no intrusive engine bay wiring,
Set your unit to tach and re-learn.
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Amateurs assume, don't test and have problems; pros test first. I am not a free install service.
Read the installation manual, do a search here or online for your vehicle wiring before posting.
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: December 23, 2012 at 10:02 PM
i am losing my mind with this viper 5904.
installed the 454t today, and it worked 7 out of 8 times today. the last time, van didn't start and i got the dreaded low tach signal on the fob. tach was learned at 1500 RPM.
I am just about to rip this thing out after a year of troubling shooting this viper system. Things i have done in the past year based on suggestions: 1) replaced the battery. 2) had van charging system tested.3) ensure i had good ground by drilling hole in steel under dash. 4) tried voltage sense. 5) tried virtual tach. 6) removed secondary accessory. 7) installed 538t and delayed the main accessory. 8) tried d2d. 9)tried w2w. 10) installed 454t.
Doesn't matter what i do, i am good for at least 2-3 failures a week. it seems like every once in a while the viper doesn't pull enough or pass enough voltage to start the van. Anyone else have any other input on these viper 5904 systems? i am so close to pulling it all out and just install a cheap prostart system from crappy tire to see if it is the R/S unit.
losing my mind. ugh.
Posted By: laziebun
Date Posted: December 24, 2012 at 7:07 AM
ngooo] wrote:
this thing is so insane. The things i tried to narrow it down: I purchased a new battery. learned the tach at a 1500 rpm, tried voltage sense, virtual tach, went w2w, went d2d. tested the electrical system at canaditan tire, was told the alternator was working great. I threw everything but the kitchen sink. My last resort was to install a 528T delay which didn't allow power to the Accessory until after the van started. since i tried voltage sense/tach/ and virtual tach, i don't think it is tach related. I believe it is power related and short drives is the key to this. My guess is that the battery gets drained with all the electronics on the short trip and doesn't get charged enough for the remote start after a short trip. Of course, that is just my guess. Not sure how i can prove that.
Could you maybe provide a diagram of how you wired up the 528t? Thanks
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: December 24, 2012 at 9:10 AM
laziebun wrote:
ngooo] wrote:
this thing is so insane. The things i tried to narrow it down: I purchased a new battery. learned the tach at a 1500 rpm, tried voltage sense, virtual tach, went w2w, went d2d. tested the electrical system at canaditan tire, was told the alternator was working great. I threw everything but the kitchen sink. My last resort was to install a 528T delay which didn't allow power to the Accessory until after the van started. since i tried voltage sense/tach/ and virtual tach, i don't think it is tach related. I believe it is power related and short drives is the key to this. My guess is that the battery gets drained with all the electronics on the short trip and doesn't get charged enough for the remote start after a short trip. Of course, that is just my guess. Not sure how i can prove that.
Could you maybe provide a diagram of how you wired up the 528t? Thanks
thanks to howie and others on this one https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=130232&tpn=6&PN=6
Posted By: laziebun
Date Posted: December 24, 2012 at 9:51 AM
Well my confusion is the 528T is 15amps max. The ACC wire is fused at 30 amps. Isnt that a no no...?
Posted By: pentavolvo
Date Posted: December 24, 2012 at 11:27 AM
can you over crank the honda odyssey? by this i mean if you hold the key after it starts will it grind the starter or not. many newer cars wont let you grind the starter. if this is the case i would set remote start timed crank and set it at 4 seconds. this will guarantee a long crank. this assumes you cant overcrank your car
Posted By: ngooo
Date Posted: January 02, 2013 at 7:18 AM
I have tried setting long crank times in the past. The issue is not crank time, but on some occasions, the RS doesn't pull enough voltage from the battery to fire it up. At first I was told it was the battery, so i tried two new batteries (redtop optima and regular battery), both had the same unpredictable failures. If i set it on long crank time, it just tries for a long time but doesn't have that extra to turn it over. If i use the key, it seems, like ti just pushes a little harder, not long, to get that engine to fire up. Anyone own a touring honda odyssey with a good starter? I am willing to try another starter.
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