diy window module kinda

Hey everyone, I've used this site 1,000s of times, but I think this is my first post. I'm pretty descent when it comes to electronics, but this kinda has me stumped. I've talked to a few engineers at work, and they seem relatively stumped as well. What I'm looking for is some sort of schematic or diagram that will show my how to built a circuit. What I'm trying to accomplish is rolling my windows up AND down on the same AUX channel of my remote start. So basically, when I trigger the alarm, it'll send +12V to one contact (we'll call it pin A) then the next time I trigger the alarm, it'll send +12v to another contact (Pin B). Of course, Pin A and Pin B can not have +12v at the same time. Also, I know that my remote start system provides a ground trigger, but I can utilize a relay to change it into a +12v trigger if needed. One engineer at my work told me to look up a bipolar junction, but that just seems to be a transistor...IE a solid state relay, and that doesn't seem to be helping me...Do you guys have any input on the subject? Thanks for any help in advance!

Typical engineers! So they could not envisage a toggle or changeover system (triggered by the "on" edge) and a relay that stays energised whilst the button is pressed?

The toggle could be a flip flip or similar.

See if that helps them.
If they are the engineers that adjust locomotive steam valves or build structures then I retract my "Typical engineers!" above.

You can buy modules for this exact purpose. It would be much easier to buy one then it would be to build one, because to build one you have to build safety in to it (for both the window motors and people and animals).

The switching part is easy - you use two SPDT relays. The NC contact on both relays is connected to ground, the common of both relays is connected to the respective motor wire, and the NO contact of both relays is connected to 12vdc. You then energize the respective coil (one relay will be up the other down).

The trick is monitor to current going to the window motor and shut off the output when the current spikes. The high end units will do multiple windows at a time and will monitor all the currents at one time. The lower end units will do windows one at a time.

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Kevin Pierson

Thanks for the responses guys, I work in a scroll machining factory, so the engineer deal with the programing...mostly. As far as the protection, I have one touch modules (automatic circuit breakers) on all directions of all my windows. I've tested them on a closed Gatorade bottle and they do stop without too much pressure. I tried it on my hand and it does pinch it pretty hard, but not enough to do any actual damage. I intend to use relays for the set up of course, but how would that 2 relay setup do up AND down? My plans are to have both up and down fed off of the same ground trigger (or +12v trigger if need be). I'm at work right now, but I'll draw up a schematic when I get home, when I visually see it I'll probably understand it better.

I guess the schematic that I need help with is something that will energize one relay when it receives the trigger from the alarm, and then will energize the other relay the next time it receives the same trigger from the alarm.

Sorry, I don't mean to be posting multiple times like this, but I don't have access to edit my posts til I hit 50. This is what I currently have in the car, and it works fine. I'll be having the alarm system, trigger these: https://www.grandprixforums.net/showthread.php?t=82839

could this be a DEI 611T application?

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

I don't see how the 611t would help my situation. I have the windows on a solid state circuit breaker(one touch module) as it is, so I don't need a timer or anything like that. I need something that when it receives a trigger (+ or -, I change it to what I need it to be with a SPDT relay), it will output a trigger (+ or -) on Pin A, then the next time it receives the SAME trigger, it'd output a trigger (+ or -) on Pin B. If the 611T can accomplish this, please correct me. I haven't found many details on the 611T.

the manual is on this site and all over the www.

look for it.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

I've read it. The 611t doesn't look like it'll do what I want. All it does is connect the brown and yellow wires together when it's activated. That's not what I need. In order for it to work, I would need the brown wire to get a (+ or -) signal whenever the green wire was triggered (+ or -). Then the next time the green wire received that SAME trigger again, a (+ or -) trigger would be output to the yellow wire.

From what I can see, the 611t is basically a programmable relay. It can be timed, latched, have a (+ or -) trigger, and can be normally open or closed. All of them cool features, but I don't see how it would help my situation.

for some reason i thought the 611t had a 30, 87 and 87a like terminals.

vw used a mechanical latching relay for headlight dimming on the old bugs.

it had one terminal that got power from the headlight switch and then when another terminal was gpulsed a ground the relay would alternate route the 12v between 2 terminals for bright or dim headlight filiments..

Ones i have used in the past could be used in an inverted fashion by positive pulsing what used to be the ground and having the relay swap grounds between the other terminals.

they are cheap. you oughtta buy one a try it.

here is one on ebay.

https://www./itm/VW-Headlight-Dimmer-Relay-12volt-67-77-/231113597322?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35cf71a18a&vxp=mtr#ht_0wt_0

i will try to post pics of the inside of one tomorrow.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

Awesome, thank you. I look forward to pics. I wonder if there is a way to make it unlatched, so it'll only have contact when triggered, and be completely open (on both outputs) when off (untriggered).

here are 2 easy apps for the VW relay.
12v to 56
high beams to 56a
low beams to F
each time S is pulsed with ground, the coil draws the mechanical switch down for a moment changing the voltage from 56 to either 56a or F

another use is
ground 56
each time S is pulsed a neg the ground supplied by 56 switches from 56a to F or from F to 56a

with either confifuration, once the pulse is finished, the coil no longer consumes any power

i have used it where a fuel pump wire ran to 56 and the fuel pump was connected to F.
conected to 56a was a 528T relay the ran numerous sirens and some other unmentionables...
when S was pulsed by a totally seperate remote held by a person forced from their car, as the car drives away, that pulse would cut the fuel supply and siren up the car. after the 528t would stop, it would be re-sirened each time the car start was attempted.
the only way to re-activate the fuel pump was re-pulse the S with the extra remote while the fuel pump wire is re-energized. .... works like a charm.
but the system is completely independent of the cars regular alarm remote.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

i cant remember what this coil draws. if you use one of these, check its draw befor having an alarm channel trigger it. it may require a bosch relay to be in the mix.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

 

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

its gonna stay latched and i dont think it could be easily modded. but it could trigger a couple 528t relays or use schematics from the12volt to build a couple pulse relays.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.

What kind of alarm are you using? It may be possible to use the (-) when armed or the dome light output to create a "channel splitter".

I believe the Pac TR-7 has a channel splitter on it as well.

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Kevin Pierson

have you checked into the DEI 450T takes a single channel and turns into up to 6 programmable channels.

1 pulse could be win up and 2 pulses win dwn.

not exactly what u want but close. i love them.

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yuk
quiet rural missouri, near KC.
If your system moves you physically and not emotionally, you have wasted your money.