Thief Proof Alarm Question

Any suggestions on how to thwart the thief?

I'm new to this alarm thing, didn't know anything about them until my truck got stolen. Never had an alarm. Of course now I want an impregenable fortress.

I looked at 4 alarms from 3 different manufacturers. How come they all use an orange wire for the starter kill relay. Wouldn't the thief just cut the wires or yank out the connector(s), then jumper 12 volts to the wire? Am I missing something.

Further analysis reveals that you can't use this wire to interrupt the starter if you have remote start. Well you can, but then you would have temporarily bypass it to start the vehicle. Instead of jumpering this wire you would have to jumper the remote start wires. I'm sure thieves that don't want to go to prison have done their homework.

It seems to me that placing the alarm in the cabin of the vehicle is not the best place. Generally its easy to gain access. I would think the engine compartment would be more secure provided there is an adequate hood lock; making it more difficult for the thief to tamper with the wiring.

Does anyone know of any alarms that meet industrial or mil-spec environmental requirements. All the ones I've seen warn you not to place them under the hood.

Outside of the initial nuisance of the siren going off what good are these alarms? Is there any way to make them thief proof? Are these alarms simply to slow the thief down? If so, any suggestions on the best method to accomplish this?

From what I can discern, those paging alarms may be the best solution. That puts pressure on the thief because they know the owner is going to show up at any moment.

No, there really is no "thief proof" alarm. If someone really wants your vehicle bad enough, they can load it onto the back of a flatbed and drive off with it, but alarms can be great deterrents and are only as good as the installation. In most cases, potential thieves will not attempt to break into a vehicle if they know the vehicle has an alarm or if they believe they will trigger the alarm while doing so. Obviously an alarm can not prevent someone from breaking into your vehicle, but they can make it more difficult to steal your vehicle and often they make the potential thieves look for another target. While paging alarms may notify you of a break in or even an attempted break in, you're better off creating a disturbance at the vehicle by sounding sirens & horns, and flashing lights. This will do more to scare off the thief and prevent further damage to your vehicle by drawing attention to your vehicle.

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I'm afraid I'm in concurrence with the previous two threads.  BUT a couple of things that you might want to consider are as follows:

In the last dozen or so years... I would have to say the number one method of choice to defeat an alarm system is to cut the power to the vehicle.  Keep in mind that this method is usually encompassed for the thief that just wants what's in the vehicle and not the vehicle itself.  Coincidentally enough, it was done to my first car with my first alarm.  They like to pry up on the hood of your car...(battery side), just enough to access the cable of your battery (usually negative side) and cut it with a cutting tool.  Believe it or not, it doesn't take that much effort to pry up enough to slide some heavy industrial cutters that would cut your battery and consequently the power to your vehicle and of course, your alarm.  Then they go to town, homeboy shopping network style.  I've also come to notice that thieves like to shoot out your window with a bb gun from a distance.   This act is virtually silent and renders the interior of your car helpless to the usually agile piece of crap that will shimmy inside to disconnect the alarm under your dash.  This is where a glass breakage sensor or a proximity sensor would be used. 

Back up batteries are, in my opinion, essential and virtually always not utilized.  Such a simple concept.  Power to alarm goes off, alarm goes off.  What's not to like?  Under the hood I like to use magnetic reed switches instead of pinswitches.  I've heard that thieves are wise to inserting a flatblade screwdriver to hold the pinswitch down while they lift up on the hood rendering your pinswitch worthless.  As far as shock sensors are concerned... boy that's a tough one.... only because I've never known thieves to be noisy, bump in the night people.  They're sneaky, quiet, caniving, ruthless, uncaring, dispicable escape artists that prey on every weakness in security you present to them.  Good Luck... It's tough to think like a thief when you're not a thief.  But I hope I was of some help.  Good luck and I like the way you think.

So far this looks like the most effective theft deterrent. However it lacks all of the nifty features of the more advanced alarm systems.

https://www.powerlock.com

Well done Mr. Youngblood! I see your skills haven't failed you. I was wonderring when you might reply to my E-Mail I sent you on your direct address? I hope you got it?

You are correct. If a theif really wants your car he'll take it on a tow or at gun point (which I have personally witnessed within the flip of a coins distance).

You are also correct about the immobilizer circuits found in many of todays vehicles. These can be added to many cars that don't already have them. Back up power is probably the closest thing to a thief proof alarm. This will usually catch them off guard but only the first time. Thats when they go get the tow. We all like to dress up our cars but that's exactly what attracts the thief in the first place.

Just like that beautiful gal you met some years ago swinging that short short skirt. Many heads turned but only one (I hope) ended up her man. I'll bet she doesn't dress up like that any more and if she does I'll bet you've got you're arm around her all of the night.

Well a thief only wants what he doesn't already have or can't afford. He doesn't have the hot babe and he can't afford her either. So he takes her when your not around.

If you really want you can hide the alarm just about anywhere, including the trunk. It just means you have a lot of extending of wires to do. If you believe someone will get into your vehicle then procede to disconnect your alarm from under the dash then don't put the alarm under the dash. Also use unconventional methods of wiring. Use all Black wires during your install and use labels as you connect them to thier functions. When your done peel off the labels. Besides who else will you have working on your car and what business is it of theirs where or how your alarm is wired. There are lots of ways to slow down a thief but shy of tying a string to your foot and to the doors of your car and sleeping in the living room armed and ready to defend your property, make sure you have everything insured including all add ons.

Yeah, maybe you're right. I thought the Control Unit actuates the relay module using a digital word. The module is bonded to the starter so there is no way to jumper around it.

Perhaps I misunderstood. If they use a 12V logic signal from the Control Unit then that can easily be jumpered. It wouldn't be better than anything else available. However if they are sending a digital word to the Module then it would be tamper proof. Only because they glue it on with epoxy. Of course some people may not like this alteration.

Hmmm, I'd better e-mail them for clarification.

Well, it appears the thief expects the alarm electronics to be located under the dash board on the driver's side. I suppose the best thing is to locate it somewhere else that is difficult to access. Maybe behind the passenger side air bag. I can see how installation costs can sky-rocket. The harder for the thief to get to it, so also for the installer.

I'm intrigued by the DEI offer to pay the insurance deductible if the vehicle is stolen, provided the alarm was installed by a certified dealer. Does anyone have any experience with this? Do they really pay off, or is it a marketing lie? This could help mitigate financial loss.

I notice that DEI doesn't post the terms and conditions of the warranty on their website. In fact customer service appears to be non-existent with the manufacturer. That doesn't give me a comfortable feeling.

I've started doing the leg work to find an installer for the new truck (Chevy Avalanche) I have on order. I've been to two installers that handle DEI products. Neither one knew anything about the GMDL4, PLDTA, WIN-DATA, etc. Modules that will probably be required for my vehicle. It made me wonder. I guess I should just call around and find someone who has worked on Avalanches. (Although I would think those modules would be used on other Chevy trucks as well.)

Can anyone make a recommendation for the Hollywood or Long Beach areas?

atomsite wrote:

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Neither one knew anything about the GMDL4, PLDTA, WIN-DATA, etc. Modules that will probably be required for my vehicle.

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I have always installed my alarms myself.  I definitely take the time to install it.  I also extend the brain away from the driver side and hide between the firewall and liner on the passenger side.  I even go to the extent of removing part of the dash to hide it.

I also cover all of my wiring with the same electrical tape that matches the  OEM to give it a more stock look.  I definitely do not use the fuse box for any power source unlike most installation shops. A lot of shops do use the fuse box for a quick install.

Just taking these few  extra steps make a world of difference when they try to hotwire or disconnect your alarm.  I also use both the horn and siren at the same time.  The more annoying noise, the more attention it gets.  There are still a few people out there that do care and tend to check things out if an annoyig alarm goes off. I'm actually one of  those people.  I guess I'm just a good samaritan.  I know what it's like to have your car broken into and wouldn't want to wish that on someone else.

John

I know you can do a better install if you do it yourself. However you won't get the DEI theft warranty. That's why I was trying to ascertain if it was legit or not. Has anyone ever heard of someone getting a payment from DEI? A lot of times they advertise these things, but when you go to collect they slam the door in your face.

If the warranty is not any good, its probably better to do it yourself. Unless you're extremely fortunate to find a good installer. But then how do you tell until after the job is done.

Atomsite, you seem to me an intelligent individual. I think you can do an alarm/remote start install yourself. Follow some of the directions in this thread. Find the unit that you like the best, and spend a day “getting to know your new truck”. As stated before, shock sensor, battery backup siren, are a must. I have my preference on remote starts, but not on alarm/remote starts. As to your question on DEI or Trilogix, DEI makes the best alarms, but are behind on remote starts and bypass units (GMDL1-4, PLDATA, ECT). Trilogix in my opinion is the leader in bypass kits, databus modules, ect. I have the luxury of living in N. Montana, where the chance of my truck being stolen, or even broke into is nill, so I don’t install alarms that often. But… If I had to choose an alarm/remote start, it would be the pager style unit from DEI. You can find some of these on Ebay. You are not limited on having to use DEI’s version of the GMDL4, PLDATA ect.. You can use the Trilogix with the DEI. You can do this yourself, may take a whole day, but you will know its done right. You also have us here at the12volt to give you some help if you run into any problems.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Too bad the factory service manuals for the 2004 Chevy Avalanche are $120. Plus they're not for sale yet. The wiring probably hasn't changed much from the 2003 model though. I would suppose the dealer could figure out what wires to tap into based on their experience. Or perhaps someone on the forum has access to the wire info.

Still, is it better to have the DEI warranty or is it better to install yourself. (Of course the theft warranty is only good for one year. Howabout their lifetime replacement warranty. Is that only good if installed by the dealer?) Does the dealer fix any vehicle electronics that they fry, or do they say "tough luck." Does anyone have any opinions or experience in this matter?

atomsite wrote:

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I've started doing the leg work to find an installer for the new truck (Chevy Avalanche) I have on order. I've been to two installers that handle DEI products. Neither one knew anything about the GMDL4, PLDTA, WIN-DATA, etc. Modules that will probably be required for my vehicle. It made me wonder. I guess I should just call around and find someone who has worked on Avalanches. (Although I would think those modules would be used on other Chevy trucks as well.)

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They are most likely going to use the 555L on it I belive thats that most common Bypass for the Passlock 2 system. Unless you have the Passlock 3 system in your truck.