kill door lock power when armed

hello. i am a newbie, and tried searching my subject to no avail.  this may be stupid/elementary, so i aploogize in advance. 

i have a 94 camaro with factory keyless and that passlock crud, along with K.E aftermarket alarm (didnt come with O.E. fobs when purchased-didnt know til i wired in the aftermarket alarm that it had factory KE).   can one install a relay to kill the power to the door lock switches when the alarm is hot?  on camaros, there is no door frame, so one could use a coathanger to push the unlock switch.  i figured just sticking a relay in (activated  from, say,  the trigger for the starter kill) would work. i wonder about the KE still working upon disarm.  doesnt the KE get all its power from the relay source (activated via the alarm lock/unlock triggers)? (could the KE work, even if O.E power was unavailable) ?   its late, and im sure this doesnt make sense, but hopefully you get what i mean.

please let me know your thoughts (or refer me elsewhere if this has been covered and i missed it). thank you all in advance.  great site.

draasch wrote:

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I would just install an anlarm....if you are going to trying the relay, why not protect the whole car?????

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draasch, thank you for the reply.  sorry, i guess i wasnt clear; i have installed the alarm.  whether or not any alarm is installed or not, the door lock switches remain alive when the car is off and locked, etc.  so i was thinking of adding a relay into the system to kill the power to the lock switch when the alarm is armed, so no one can use a coat hanger to pop the power lock switch. 

there is a system in, just want to try to make it better.  make sense?  thanks again for all replies.

that car is a positive pulse doorlock system, right?  why not simply interrupt the SWITCH wires that trigger the doorlock module in the car??  find the wires (baby blue and white or black?), and run a pair of relays much like you would a starter kill.  When at rest, the doorlock wires have continuity.  when alarm is armed, the starter kill output opens the relay, opening the switch circuit and killing them.  to add reliability, use the (diode isolated) pulse from the doorlock to energize the coil as well...this way the relay will only actually open when someone tries to use the switch while armed (versus the relay flipping back and forth on each arm/disarm)....seems like a bit of a pain, but it would work.  call it "doorlock kill"  !!

b

thank you very much for the info. that is what i was lookin for.  i was not sure what wires i would cut (it has rev polarity locks, IIRC, and factory keyless entry).  i have read how the rev polarity locks work, but really dont get it. 

 are you saying to basically use the existing  unlock wire i have already cut  (for my new keyless entry alarm)???? im thinking that if i use that wire,i would find my existing relay for unlock (for the alarm), and unplug the cut wire (running through 87A - the hot side of the wire from the switch).  i would run that through   87A  (and 86- as a trigger)  of a  new relay. hook85 to the neg output of the alarm.   and run a wire from 30 to 87A of the unlock relay i already have  for the alarm. the other relay (existing) for actually unlocking with KE would be closer to the locks (this new relay is upstream). 

does this  sound right?  im sorry, i am a newbie and try to pick things up as  i go. no formal experience, training, etc.  i apologize for my poor use of terminology and jargon. i try to imagine what i can based on what i know, which is not much. i understand the part about using the lock switch as a trigger (why i used the unlock trigger at 86 above), so the relay only has to switch when someone actually tries to use the switch with the alarm armed (good idea).  would i use a 4001 diode (im just now trying to understand diodes more? i understand their purpose, just not which ones are right for what application).  i have extra starter kill sockets, so id likely use one of those if that diode would work (i see no reason why not).

please let me know where i am wrong on my above schematic thinking.  or if you know an easier way to do it. if i knew how, i would have made you a diagram to illustrate this. i hope you can make sense of it. i really appreciate all of your help with this. thank you very much.

wiretapper wrote:

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 Your system is a reverse polarity 5-wire system. Go to the pass. kick and find the keyless module.  Then find the Orange wire that goes directly to the pass. switch. This is the doorlock power lead. Wire in a relay just like a starter kill relay on this wire and your doors will become dead when armed, but will still lock and unlock with the remote.  Try it.

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sweet. that is what i needed to know.  so just run (for instance):

 85: 12+ constant.  

86 : neg trigger  wire from alarm for starter kill.  

30: one side of the now cut  power-to-locks wire (orange)

87A: other side of cut wire (orange).

 ive been meaning to ask this and now is a good time.  does it matter which side of the wire goes to 87A and which goes to 30 on a starter kill relay/socket?   should the "motor" side be on one or the other terminal or does it not matter (ive never seen install instructions say it matters).  

thank you all so much. i think i tried to make it much more difficult than it is. good stuff. 

thank you one and all.

the pass side switch is the master switch. i figured this would be easy (like wiretapper said). i figure that even if i cut the power wire to the locks (orange wire), the keyless would still work (the relays for the alarm get power from elsewhere, so power being cut upstream is of no matter). if i understand you, you are saying it does matter (otherwise i dont understand the need for a pulsed unlock, as auex said i may need to do).  i really dont understand how any locks except for one wires (using different resistances for lock and unlock) work.  i know what they mean (definitions, i havent seen them. im one of those whom needs to see and play with stuff; reading about it doesnt cut it. LOL).  so thats why i ask the experts here. :-)  you keep me from making big mistakes or creating big headaches.

  i figured this would be easy (one more relay, no biggie).  but given what you all have said since auex responded (my thoughts were much like what he said - simple to do. ), but it sounds like a pita.  

teken, you make many good points. i know little to none about the items you suggest. i will look into them. 

 i know someone whom is intent on breaking in will do so easily.  i just want to prevent ad hoc thieves/kids from getting in easy.  its a sleep insurance thing.  if i dont do it and it would have been  easy to do, then if something happened, id kick myself. 

also, anyone know about the starter kill socket question from my last post (does it matter which wires are connected to 87A and 30?). 

thank you all for the help. im hoping to get a consensus on whether interrupting one wire will allow for the lock switches  to be killed (w/o further mods being needed to be made).  thank you all very much. i really appreciate it.

Evil, good stuff again, thanks.  do you know of a write up on doing the barrier in the door? im real mechanically inclined, but havent done something like that before. im not sure what im doing, as i really dont know how a slim jim works (i know it catches the linkage, but i dont have a good grasp of what exactly it grabs).  if i saw a write up, i would mimic it and all would be good.

thanks again.

sounds good.  i never knew where a slim jim grabs on, but ill check it out.  sounds like i should look at the knob linkage (camaro has the lock/unlock lever under the door handle, not a normal knob on top of the sill). also i ll look at the inner door handle linkage (IIRC, pullin the handle unlocks and opens the door. i imagine it would take quite a pull to move that linkage. LOL).   thank you again.  ill add it to the list : new door and saleen wing on the stang, two cd players and a changer to install,  crotchrocket carbs to check over and clean, and many more. LOL.  toys can be a pain.

thanks again. ill do that. still not sure about the door lock switch deal. i may just play with it, as there are different opinions on what to do and how it will change things.  that would be the next easy way to get in (coathanger and 3 seconds. i hate cars with no door frame around the window). thanks again. :-)