771XV vs 791XV
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=39233
Printed Date: May 11, 2024 at 9:21 AM
Topic: 771XV vs 791XV
Posted By: hagmanti
Subject: 771XV vs 791XV
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 1:44 PM
What are the differences between the 771XV and the 791XV? I've gone through both installation manuals (and both owner's manuals) and the only difference I can see are the remote (LED vs LCD), the AM vs FM thing, and a slight difference in how zones are set up...
I'm looking to put a 2-way remote start w/ security into a 2k1 Civic and it seems like the 771XV might save me a little money, especially since I'll need to buy 1 or 2 extra remotes...
Thanks in advance for any thoughts; sorry if this has been asked before (I searched on 771 and 771XV and found nothing except the AM vs. FM stuff mentioned above).
Me
Replies:
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 4:01 PM
you seem to have answered your own questions.... the only differences between them are that 1 is LCD and 1 is LED, as well as the fact that 1 is true Responder ( the FM system ) while 1 is AM-ASK similar to the Avital and Valet 2 ways.....
-------------
Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: Teken
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 4:20 PM
kgerry wrote:
as well as the fact that 1 is true Responder ( the FM system ) while 1 is AM-ASK similar to the Avital and Valet 2 ways.....
Please define true Responder for me.
Regards
EVIL Teken . . .
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 4:56 PM
Responder is an FSK FM based broadcast system... this gives greater range and transmitter stability as well as better building/obstruction penetration.....it also broadcasts and receives on 2 different frequencies, allowing for real time communication with the vehicle as opposed to the ASK AM system which receives and sends on the same frequency, which can cause a 20-30 delay before the unit pages the remote.....not great for security
-------------
Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 5:08 PM
BTW, i'm still a little torn on the LED models.... i like the fact that the remote is smaller, but still think the LED's look a little tacky..... the one thing i really hope is that they are easier on batteries than the 791 series remotes..... ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: hagmanti
Date Posted: September 16, 2004 at 5:55 PM
kgerry wrote:
.....it also broadcasts and receives on 2 different frequencies, allowing for real time communication with the vehicle as opposed to the ASK AM system which receives and sends on the same frequency, which can cause a 20-30 delay before the unit pages the remote.....not great for security
First, I assume you mean 20-30 second delay.
And if so, that's definitely not worth my time. However, I don't see why the use of one frequency should make that happen, unless you happened to be pushing buttons at the same time the vehicle was trying to page the remote.
Have you (or anyone?) actually seen a delay greater than 10 seconds in practice? How often does that occur?
Thanks in advance; I really appreciate the amzing stuff I've already found on this forum,
Me
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 17, 2004 at 11:59 AM
the problem with one frequency is that the unit pages for 15 seconds, then receives for 15 seconds, then pages again, you get the idea... so if the unit was just beginning to receive and the alarm was triggered it has to finish it's cycle and then page... whereas the Responder units can page and receive at the same time..... bottom line tho, they are both good units.... alot better than most of the no name crap out there..... ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: hagmanti
Date Posted: September 18, 2004 at 12:11 AM
kgerry wrote:
the problem with one frequency is that the unit pages for 15 seconds, then receives for 15 seconds, then pages again, you get the idea... so if the unit was just beginning to receive and the alarm was triggered it has to finish it's cycle and then page... whereas the Responder units can page and receive at the same time.....
Forgive me for being slow; I haven't worked w/ this system, and I'm having trouble wrapping my mind around this.
Are you saying that if I press the lock button on my remote, it may take up to fifteen seconds for the car to unlock?
I've _never_ installed or used any alarm / keyless entry that does that...
Am I inferring incorrectly? It's late-- I could certainly be missing something obvious...
I have to come back to the question-- does this sort of (unacceptably) long delay actually occur in practice? If so, how often?
Me
Posted By: Teken
Date Posted: September 18, 2004 at 10:30 AM
Personally I have never observed such a long delay from the time of activation of the desired button and the alarms CPU responding.
There are however short delays, from 1-2 seconds. Whether they all do this, I can only tell you from first hand exerience on 18 I have operated.
With respect to the page back issue kgerry, if you have some resources for us to review on this. That would be great to see. As I would like to learn as much about a product and its operation prior to relaying information to a client.
Regards
EVIL Teken . . .
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 18, 2004 at 10:55 AM
no the time to unlock is normal... we are talking about the static PAGING time...... i do my research on the product from the manufacturers website and the propaganda and technical white pages they send us..... i suggest y'all go to a dealer and get all the skinny on the various different models.... or is it easier to just sit on a stool in front of a monitor and let someone else educate you? there are substantial differeneces between the Responder models and the cheaper AM based 2 way models.... why do you think one costs 50-100 bucks more than the other? ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: wchavez
Date Posted: September 18, 2004 at 2:47 PM
Kevin's correct, the LED units do communicate one-way and slower but appear to be pretty bulletproof. the software the the brains of the 560 771 791 are all identical and the other benefit is you can program the lesser expensive companion remotes to the LED unit that come with standard DEI units instead the FSK 472 companion remote for the responders.
Posted By: hagmanti
Date Posted: September 22, 2004 at 12:21 AM
I'm sure Kevin is correct-- most of the people on this forum know quite a bit more about this stuff than I do.
I took his advice, and went to a few of my nearby authorized DEI dealers. None of them had installed a 771. So I'm still left w/o an answer to my basic question, and am going to try asking one last time.
I find waiting 20 seconds for my alarm to notify me that my car is being broken into completely unacceptable. However, I've never installed (or used) any alarm that _ever_ takes more than 5 or 6 seconds to page (even cheap Code Alarm BS).
Does the DEI 771XV actually (assuming no problems w/ transmission or whatnot), on a regular basis, take more than 10 seconds to page? I realize that there might be a theoretical possibility of it happening, but does that actually happen (say more than 10% of the time) in practice?
Thanks in advance for everyone that's willing to put up w/ my idiocy,
Me
Posted By: Teken
Date Posted: September 22, 2004 at 8:02 AM
I will redefine this for you. The unit doesn't actually respond to your command slowly. It is however slowly to transmit the information to you, because the power output is below the maximum 4 watts limit, which 95% are.
The 771 is still a excellent unit, and has less possibility for breakage. If its about value, and performance, then the 771 will deliver.
Regards
EVIL Teken . . .
Posted By: 2MCHPSI
Date Posted: September 22, 2004 at 10:03 AM
[quote]or is it easier to just sit on a stool in front of a monitor and let someone else educate you?[/quote] Why bother responding at all if you have this attitude. If it gets your panties all in a bunch, then do not respond..sheesh
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 22, 2004 at 11:38 AM
maybe i'm just a little thin skinned about people doing all their shopping and buying online.... i personally spend hours some days educating local people here on all the differences between different models and then they take that info and buy on ebay..... sorry if it seemed like i was PMSing.... as Teken said... the 771 is a nice little unit, i just put one ( Clifford 1.2 ) in my wife's car last weekend oh, and 2mchpsi, i realize with the whole 9 posts of yours you feel like you're really helping people here, but please dont even begin to criticize the 1100 + times i've offered helpful advice to other people on this forum.....just like the first 4 or 5 times i answered questions in this thread alone.... keep in mind many of us here are professionals, we do this for a living... i personally take an hour out of my day at 60 bucks an hour to answer questions and help people out, people who have no intention of ever buying anything from me..... ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: 2MCHPSI
Date Posted: September 22, 2004 at 11:47 AM
Never mentioned I helped anyone here. Never critized your helpful advice. Your 1000+ posts do not give you the right to be a jackass either. I am glad you give out advice, and seem like a good asset to this board. No need for BS drama in here.
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 24, 2004 at 2:13 PM
another little pet peeve of mine on the 771 series is that the LED doesnt stay on continuously... so it flashes when you start the vehicle and then goes out... and it flashes and beeps when the unit shuts off... but if you happen to put the remote in your pocket or purse and happen to miss the shutdown beep and then want to check later to see if your car is still running there is no way to know.... if it is still running and you hit it again it shuts the car off.... i like being able to look at the LCD screen and know at a glance if the car is running or not..... ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
Posted By: Teken
Date Posted: September 24, 2004 at 4:27 PM
I would prefer to have longer battery run time, then having to purchase 12 volts batteries every 3 weeks.
Personally, I believe that most owners / users will be more than diligent in observing the LED blink status, as well as being able to view the marker lights as another sign if the vehicle is on-off.
Obviously it doesnt help you if you're not in line of sight. But, there are pro's and con's of both.
Regards
EVIL Teken . . .
Posted By: kgerry
Date Posted: September 25, 2004 at 10:16 AM
sure there are... and i sell both models and like both.... these are just personal observations for people reading who may be considering one model or another..... this is how i spend my day with customers... i like this, this and this about model A... i like this, this and this about model B, etc. BTW, these units...both models, take a simple AAA 1.5 volt battery, not 12 volt batteries..... but yes, Teken is right, the LCD remote is a definate battery gobbler..... ------------- Kevin Gerry
Certified Electronics Technician
MECP First Class Installer
Owner/Installer
Classic Car Audio
since 1979
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