529T w/Honda Civic sunroof

A friend and I are trying to install a 529t window module to use with my Viper alarm to the sunroof.  I have a 2000 Honda Civic SI.  Does anybody know how to wire it specifically?  We tried figuring it out with a DMM.  We found the relay controlling the sunroof and were testing there.  But the way everything was working, we couldn't exactly figure it out.  Can someone please help with this ASAP?  We're trying to finish the install tonight or tomorrow morning.

Thanks!

auex]S wrote:

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rry but if you can't figure it out when you have the wiring in front of you then you shouldn't be doing it. I don't recommend you doing it in the first place. Sunroofs are nothing but trouble.

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Uh thanks..But I think I've had enough experience tickering with my car that I have a pretty good idea what I'm doing.  I just finished installing a remote start, window modules, etc. in my car, but the wiring for the sunroof is really funky with the different relays inline and the polarity switching.  I asked if anybody has done this before, if not and you don't have any useful information for me, please don't reply to my posts....

auex]S wrote:

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nroofs are nothing but trouble.

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I would agree if the sunroof has tilt, or mutiple positions. But if the sunroof only does open and close, it's just another window.

I am the friend who actually hooked up the 529T in Rizzy's Civic and felt the need to chime in on this thread.  First of all, nothing personal to you Auex, but if you've been doing this "professionally" and refuse to do a sunroof because you can't figure it out, well, I think you need to find another line of work.  By no means am I a "professional" installer, but I have yet find a system/project that I can't install.  I've installed numerous alarms for friends, family and myself.  I've installed 529s/530s, installed remote start on my manual transmission vehicle as well as remote start systems on many cars.  I've installed countless stereo/multimedia systems including my own Pioneer DVD system.  I could easily get a job doing this at a shop if I wanted to, but its more of a hobby for me and not something I would want to do on a daily basis. I can't quite figure out why you posted "if you can't figure it out when you have the wiring in front of you then you shouldn't be doing it", but yet you said yourself that you refuse to do them because you can't figure it out yourself, even though your a "professional"  Again, this isn't a flame at all, but your post wasn't beneficial by any means. 

Now, onto how it is actually done. (I won't charge you even though this is job training for you )

The other posters are corect in that you have to tap into the motor wires directly. A 529T cannot drive relays because relays won't show the 529 the voltage drop that it needs for it to shut of.  If you tap into the motor wires directly, from the open position the sunroof will go to the closed position and then immediately to the vent position.  The exact opposite will happen when you reverse the polarity.  It will go from the vent position, close and continue to go fully open.  Basically the closed position on the sunroof is more of a halfway point between the motor beeing fully open (sunroof open) and fully closed (sunroof vented).  When the sunroof motor is fully extended the sunroof is in the vented position.  The trick was trying to make the sunroof stop a the appropriate position (sunroof closed) and not complete its full cycle.  Just as the switch does it.

Here's how the sunroof switch works.  It has 4 wires, one is a common ground and depending on which of the three buttons you hit on the sunroof switch (open, vent, close) the switch closes contact between the common ground and the corresponding wire for that switch, the sunroof moves in that direction.  Behind the sunroof in the headliner there is another set of relays (I think its called the tilt switch relay or something simliar).  When you physically hold down the close button on the sunroof switch, it trips the relay in the headliner and when the sunroof reaches the closed position, the tilt relay ceases power to the sunroof motor causing it to stop whent he sunroof is in the closed position. (The sunroof motor, however, is not fully extended).  Depending on which button your phsically pushing the sunroof switch tells the tilt switch relay what to and not to provide power to. 

Now here is how to make it work.

Wire the 529 like you normally would for a standard window or normal open/close non tilting sunroof.   The sunroof will operate, but from the open position it will close then vent. And from the vent position it will close and then open (not what you want).  The 529 has 2 (-) output during activation wires. (1 for each side of the 529).  If you hook this wire up to the close button output from the sunroof switch the 529 will actually be providing the power to the motor, but the system will also think you are physically pushing the close button ( - output from the 529 to the sunroof switch) causing the tilt relay to act correctly and it WILL stop in the closed sunroof position.

There is a little more to it, but I'm not going to go into great detail unless someone wants me to.  For instance, the sunroof switch doesn't have constant power so you have to use the ouput during activation wire to trip a relay and provide temporary current to the sunroof switch.  You will also have to diode isolote the ground when armed wire on the 529. Otherwise the 529 will backfeed a ground to the ground when armed coming from the alarm (also tied to the 530T) and the sunroof switch will cause your windows to go up as well.  If you don't have a 530 on your windows and you aren't using the ground when armed on your alarm, then there is no need to isolote the 529 with a diode.

If someone wants help on wiring a 529t to their tilting sunroof, I'll be more than glad to provide assitance.  It CAN be done and its really not all that difficult (only additional part needed was a relay and a diode). It just took me some time looking at the schematics and trying to figure out how the motor worked in relation to the sunroof switch and how I could duplicate it with the 529.  However, I don't recomend this to just anyone but if you can wire up the 529T where the sunroof opens and closes, but just doesn't stop in the closed position, your really not all that far off.

Cheers -Kevin

Kevenfwb,

If I may add my two cents as well. I would take auex's side on this one about the sunroof. Professional installer or not, the sunroof should be left alone, you will see why in a couple of months. By you stating they he doesent do them because he cant figure them out was way off beat. The reason he doesent do them is because he is SMART! When you own a proffesional shop you will see why sunroofs are generally not done. Doing this to your own or a friends car is up to you, but when you have a reputation to keep up on and constant "CUSTOMERS" you dont want the hassele with returns. Yiou can hook the sunroof up right and still it will get messed up. Give it time, I would say within six months and you will see his point of view!!!!!!!

jaurora wrote:

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Kevenfwb,

If I may add my two cents as well. I would take auex's side on this one about the sunroof. Professional installer or not, the sunroof should be left alone, you will see why in a couple of months. By you stating they he doesent do them because he cant figure them out was way off beat. The reason he doesent do them is because he is SMART! When you own a proffesional shop you will see why sunroofs are generally not done. Doing this to your own or a friends car is up to you, but when you have a reputation to keep up on and constant "CUSTOMERS" you dont want the hassele with returns. Yiou can hook the sunroof up right and still it will get messed up. Give it time, I would say within six months and you will see his point of view!!!!!!!

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And what exactly do you think is going to happen to my sunroof in six months?  If someone does an install on something and does it right, why would it all of the sudden "get messed up"?  I think that is a very bad assumption.  Kevinfwb has installed every remote start, alarm, window/sunroof modules, etc. in every single car I've owned in the past 8 years.  That's 4 cars...Never once have I EVER had a problem with anything he's installed.  Not only has he done my cars, he's done at least 3 or 4 of his own that I know of plus numerous other friends and family member's cars, so when it comes to "reputation", I think kevinfwb can hold his own.

Haha, and if auex were so "smart", don't you think he could do these types of installs without any problems and do them well enough so that his customers didn't have to return it or come back for repairs?

jaurora

I agree with you to an extent.  This forum is indeed intended to help people find solutions to their problems.  I have used this website several times over the past years, and I have found some valuable information.  As I stated in my first post, I am not trying to turn this into a flame thread.  But if I recall correctly Auex is the one who originally posted, "If you can't figure it out with the wires in front of you....." I don't particularly consider that advice.  An appropriate response would have been, "I don't recommend installing an automatic sunroof because......."!

This isn't meant to criticize you either, so please don't take it that way.  Why would installing a 529 blow a window motor? I've had a 530 on my windows for over 2 years and never had a single problem.  I also had a 530 and two 529's on my previous car and the sunroof on that car worked fine for several years as well, not ever a single hiccup.  Isn't the whole design of a 529 for a sunroof (or two windows in 1 direction). With the exception of the tilt relay, the sunroof motor works like any other motor.  Reversing polarity causes the motor to operate in opposite directions causing the sunroof to open/close.  There are ABSOLUTELY no exposed wires. Every single wire in the car was soldered. We removed the front fender in order to get access to the wiring harness in the door jamb so we could run the wires for the 530 through the existing rubber tubing, no exposed wires at all. 

I guess you could consider me a "backyard installler".  However, most systems I've installed have been in the front yard, so I guess I'm more of a "Frontyard Installer". I've never worked at a shop installing systems but I have absolutely no doubt that I could, and I have even thought about it before.  I am in college at the moment (Computer Science) and go to school during the day.  My work hours are severely limited due to school and I wouldn't be able to work during the day very much.   Do I claim to know everything? Absolutely not.  As almost any installesr will tell you though, 99% of the problems that people have with car electronics come from poor installation.  People trying to do their own installations with barely a clue of what their doing. 

Again, I don't intend on this being a flame thread and apologize if that is how it came out.  Rizzy posted a thread here a few days ago to see if anyone has had experience installing a 529 on a tilting sunroof and didn't exactly get a positive response.  Instead he was told if he can't figure it out, then don't bother.  Just my $0.02 -Kevin

On a side note about this forum. You are correct!! It is supposed to be a forum for helping people.  This is exactly why I posted HOW I was able to get the 529 to work on a tilting sunroof properly.  I think you will also agree with me that every Joe Schmoe who owns a shop doesn't necessarily do quality work.  I've seens shops who splice wires together without even using solder or wire crimps, just a little electrical tape. Not every shop hires MECP techs and in all honesty it isn't necessary for most installs.  The majority of shop installs are simple head unit replacements, or a basic 300ESP or similar.  I've been installing systems for over 10 years and I have learned through those years how to do proper, trouble free installations.  I didn't just post "HAHA I did it and you said I couldn't" keep in mind, I did actually post how I was able to get it done which may help somoene else who was having a similiar problem.

-Kevin

auex] wrote:

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Oh and by the way, Rizzi shut up ricer. SI! SI! SI! You just had to through the SI into your post.

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HAHA...For your information I put the SI in my name because Rizzy was already taken.  And how stereotypical of you and childish to call me a ricer.  You automatically think that because I drive a Honda Civic and it just happens to be an SI model that I'm a ricer.  The ONLY thing I have done to my car is replace the factory head unit and put this alarm in.  That's a ricer?  Damn....And please, don't tell me to shut up in my own post.  Again, if you have nothing of worth to add to a conversation, do the rest of us a favor and don't say anything at all.

Kevin,

This issue isent against you. I am happy that you do the installing on your own, doing it yourself is the best way to learn. The more you will do the better you will become. This wasent an issue with the install ect.  As with AUEX he hit the nail on the head with the problems that are caused. This is not only for GM vehicles, yes they are more vunarable, but the other makes and models can have the same issue. To be completly honest with you, Its your friend with the big mouth that doesent know when to quit and I myself would like to tell him to SHUTUP. Let him and AUEX battle it out. But hey keep up the installing and goodluck.