Can’t figure out door locks!
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=60909
Printed Date: May 05, 2025 at 5:32 AM
Topic: Can’t figure out door locks!
Posted By: OwenZ
Subject: Can’t figure out door locks!
Date Posted: August 07, 2005 at 9:36 PM
Hi all,
I have a 91 twin turbo Nissan 300zx and am trying to install a Viper 800HF and aftermarket actuators. I've looked at their manual and have hooked up everything using the Reversing Polarity diagram on this site. But I cannot get them to work.
The actuator works in both directions when hooked up to the battery, so I am guessing they are +12V actuated. But the diagram here says "alarm output (-).
I know that my alarm is outputting 12V on the lock/unlock. And I know that using the above diagram, there is constant +12V at each of the lock/unlock outputs. Sooo, I guessed I had to wire the alarm to use negative pulses to actuate the door locks. Still no luck.
Couldn't find the Viper manual online so that I could show the diagram here, I've installed a 650ESP in another car pretty much the same way so I don't know why I'm having so much trouble with this one.
Anyone have any ideas? I'm currently only using the lock function of the alarm by grounding the other wire of the actuator.
Thanks,
Owen
Replies:
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 07, 2005 at 9:39 PM
Maybe I need to use the 4 Wire Reversal Door Locks setup?
Owen
Posted By: swamprat323
Date Posted: August 07, 2005 at 9:47 PM
make sure you have a GOOD GROUND on the 87a.
You are using the right diragram.
Posted By: jhgraham
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 12:32 PM
The diagram assumes a constant +12V battery source for the motors through the relay. It also assumes you have an alarm that supplies the –output. The –output comes from the alarm brain through the remote via two separate wires. A third wire may be used for second activation of all locks. This is also a –output that requires two presses of the remote.
To simulate the alarm brain you can use a 9Volt battery. Wrap some stripped bell wire on the terminals. Connect the positive side of the battery to the alarm ground. Use the negative side of the battery wire and touch the connection on either side of the relay, usually the red and black wire going to the door lock relay assembly. The door lock will move when the correct terminal it contacted. Oh yes, do not do this with the door lock relay plugged into the brain. Do not allow the wire to remain on the contact, as it only requires a short duration of 150 to 300mS. You should see the door motors actuate. If the motors work as required, check the alarm brain.
The brain supplies the – voltage only when the remote is activated.
There I go again assuming all alarms are like mine. Use at your own risk.
-------------
Knowledge is Indisputable, Opinions are Subjective.
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 3:08 PM
Thanks for the responses! First, yes, I have the 87a terminal, I'm using Bosch relays ordered from an online electronics store a while back. As to the -output, I may be confused on this, but the alarm provides the ground to complete the circuit, correct?
But when I measure, it's putting out +volts. I'm going to need to scan my alarm diagram and upload it, the diagram
is really confusing me...
 Are the 87,87a, etc to the left of the black block referring to internal brain relays? The only differences between the
top and bottom diagrams is how the H2/E and H2/F are wired, I have tried both (wired to the aftermarket actuators)
with no luck...I'm sure my ground is good as suggested in the above response but will try another location. Referring to the reversing polarity diagram, at the bottom, I assume the "to actuators" means to one actuator (if using one
actuator, and parallel wiring if using two actuators). I'm just trying to get one side working first as the car has some
internal wiring that uses the driver switch as the main central mechanism - driver's side locks/unlocks passenger side. I will also try the 4 relay method, as long as it works I don't care!
Thanks,
Owen
Posted By: jhgraham
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 4:57 PM
I am out of my league on this but as I understand, the alarm turns on the low power coil for lock and/or unlock. The relay in turn connects the high power 12V line. The brain holds this voltage for a pre-determined time. The wires from the brain are blue and green and connect to 85 and 86. Some brains have a (+) or (–) option on the door locks and depending on the relay requirements the wires may need to be reversed to operate properly. The brain relay voltage is toggled to (+) or (-) so you will see two different voltages, +/- on each wire. A (–) as shown on the fore schematic requires a (–) voltage from the brain. If the relay sees, (+) it will not turn on. If you reverse the blue and green wire, the polarity changes and the relays work.
Yes, your actuator statement is correct.
Worth a shot on my part, hope it helps.
-------------
Knowledge is Indisputable, Opinions are Subjective.
Posted By: mo12v
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 5:01 PM
Maybe I'm NOT following this:
U installed Aftermarket Door Lock actuators??
If so, doesn't the Viper 800 have it's own RELAYS built in??
If you are using 2 Wire Acuators without Relays.......
You would hook up:
WHITE / Black = GROUND
GREEN / Black = Lock wire on Acuator
VIOLET / Black = 12 volt Constant ( + )
BROWN / Black = GROUND
BLUE / Black = UNLock Wire on Actuator
VIOLET = 12 volt Constant ( + )
If you are using 5 wire Actuators with Relay package, then you would hook up as Negative Pulse from your Viper 800 .. Type B
-------------
MO
Don't Learn from Others Mistakes
You Might Be the One That Knows.
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 5:18 PM
I don't know why I'm so confused! I swear I didn't any trouble with my other z car! But yes, the actuators are 2 wire and yes the Viper has the relays built in. I did not ground the
white and brown wires as you suggested, the diagram says "not used"...so I didn't...the actuators were
actually in the car before I bought it used a little while ago, along with the alarm. Long story short, had to rip out the alarm and all its twist-tied wires covered with electrical tape, due to a problem I "thought" was
caused by the alarm. I was so pissed at the wiring that I ripped everything out without labeling (I know, stupid...
but I've done this before!) If you are using 2 Wire Acuators without Relays.......
You would hook up:
WHITE / Black = GROUND
GREEN / Black = Lock wire on Acuator
VIOLET / Black = 12 volt Constant ( + ) BROWN / Black = GROUND
BLUE / Black = UNLock Wire on Actuator
VIOLET = 12 volt Constant ( + ) Will that work? Using Type A, power would flow from the violet to the lock/unlock which will work the actuators.
One thing that hangs me up is, on the actuator, for Lock to work, Unlock as to be grounded and vice versa. Hence my attempt at using the reverse polarity setup. If I permanently ground both wires of the actuator, and then have the alarm do its outputs, would that work? Thanks again to everyone helping me with this crisis :-) Owen
Posted By: auex
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 6:23 PM
OwenZ] wrote:
WHITE / Black = GROUND
GREEN / Black = Lock wire on Acuator
VIOLET / Black = 12 volt Constant ( + )
BROWN / Black = GROUND
BLUE / Black = UNLock Wire on Actuator
VIOLET = 12 volt Constant ( + )
Correct. At this point you are too confused to think. This is one of those times that you need to do exactly as you are told even if you don't understand. Do this and it will work. This is the correct wiring for 2 wire actuators. Try this and it will work. Don't get confused do exactly as this says. Do now understand later. ------------- Certified Security Specialist
Always check info with a digital multimeter.
I promise to be good.
Tell Darwin I sent you.
I've been sick lately, sorry I won't be on much.
Posted By: mo12v
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 6:29 PM
OwenZ] wrote:
P>If I permanently ground both wires of the actuator, and then have the alarm do its outputs, would that work?
DO NOT ground both wires of actuators............
Hook up as described, this will be an alternating Ground from your Viper 800 ------------- MO
Don't Learn from Others Mistakes
You Might Be the One That Knows.
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 6:33 PM
OK, will do. Hook up as described by you, manual, other? Just want to clarify. Also, "not used" means Ground according to DEI? Thanks,
Owen
Posted By: mo12v
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 6:36 PM
NOT USED means NOT USED!!!!! Tape up and Harness up.......
-------------
MO
Don't Learn from Others Mistakes
You Might Be the One That Knows.
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 6:44 PM
Forgive me, but doesn't that contradict what you posted earlier regarding grounding them?
-----------------------------------------
WHITE / Black = GROUND
GREEN / Black = Lock wire on Acuator
VIOLET / Black = 12 volt Constant ( + )
BROWN / Black = GROUND
BLUE / Black = UNLock Wire on Actuator
VIOLET = 12 volt Constant ( + )
----------------------------
Well, no time to work on it tonite, it'll have to be tomorrow nite. Thanks again to everyone and wish me luck!
Owen
Posted By: mo12v
Date Posted: August 08, 2005 at 7:32 PM
The contradiction is in how you are reading it............
The actuator wires only go to the wires I have listed from your Viper 800 plug.
The GROUND only goes to the wires I have listed from your Viper 800.
The Constant 12 volts ( + ) only goes to the wires I have listed from your Viper 800. When the Lock / Unlock on the Remote is pushed, it will alternate the Ground thru the On-Board Relays WHITE / Black = GROUND
GREEN / Black = Lock wire on Acuator
VIOLET / Black = 12 volt Constant ( + )
BROWN / Black = GROUND
BLUE / Black = UNLock Wire on Actuator
VIOLET = 12 volt Constant ( + ) ------------- MO
Don't Learn from Others Mistakes
You Might Be the One That Knows.
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 09, 2005 at 12:51 AM
I'm an idiot cuz I still don't see it, I guess that's what pro installers are for. Anyway, I'll try it tomorrow and let you know.
Thanks,
Owen
Posted By: OwenZ
Date Posted: August 09, 2005 at 10:33 PM
Success! Thanks to you all for your help, this place rocks!
I still don't see how "taped up and harnessed up" mean the same as "grounded", but what I did was infact ground the BRN/WHT and WHT/BLK wires.
Thanks again. Now on to my next post :-)
Owen
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