Printer Friendly Forum Posts - pats bypass recommendations

I hooked up my Code Alarm CA670 alarm in my Expy with a DEI 555P and it just doesn't seem to work right. I used the right alarm trigger wire but it seems to trigger it too early. do you have any recommendations? Which have you had best luck with? How is the Code Alarm PKF1?
I really DON'T want to take the pellets out of the keys or stick a blank key in the car. I just don't think that is the right way to do things.

What problems are you having exactly with the 555P? When you say it triggers too early, how? DEI is not listing the manual for a 555P, so I can not verify but doesn't it hook up using the data wires in the vehicle? The data wire hookup is the most reliable, and is the same as the PKF1.

First, post the exact model and year of your 'expy' then explain the exact problem and sequence of events and someone here may be able to assist you in fixing the problem.

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Installer, IT support, and FFL. I need less hobbies.

2000 Expedition.
The 555P does hook up to the data wires. I've programmed it correctly. What seems to happen is when I turn on the remote start, the ignition turns on and it for about 3 seconds. As soon as the ignition goes on, the light on the DEI 555 goes on, which I'm assuming means the PATS signal is being sent.
Then the remote start starts to crank the car. As it is cranking, the theft light on the car flashed rapidly and the car does not start.
I've read other posts that say the DEI 555 often does NOT work.

You have the bypass hooked up to the blue/black (-) 500 ma active out of the code alarm? The module should turn on as soon as you activate the remote start, and will shut down 4 seconds after the truck is running.

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Yeah, I am using the blue/black status wire which is what it says to use in the manual.
The remote start turns the ignition on for about 3 seconds before it actually cranks the engine.
As soon as the ignition goes on, the LED on the 555 goes on, so by the time it is cranking, the light is already off. This doesn't seem right, is it? I would think the light should be on when the car is cranking?

it seems like you do not have the input wire connected correctly, the light should turn on as soon as you try to remote start the vehicle. Also make sure you have a proper ground on the 555P. I know an installer should not really use a test probe in a alarm/remote start nstallation but if you know how to use it you should test that wire and see if the blue/white wire is getting a ground signal as soon as its remote started. That would phase out the issue with that connection and may isolate it to the 555P.

Just to add more to the problem you are having I read the manual on the 555P which is actually the same as N555P for Twelvevolts and read that you must make sure you ground the black wire properly because it may cause the 555P not to work properly(DO NOT USE a ground wire on the immobilizer harness). Also the input wire is the blue wire. Like I mentioned before you should check that connection first.

Enice-
The 555 is grounded to the same point as the alarm ground- the body. I am using the correct blue input wire too.
I'm not sure what you meant when you said " you must make sure you ground the black wire properly because it may cause the 555P not to work properly(DO NOT USE a ground wire on the immobilizer harness)". First you said that you need to make sure you have a good ground, then you said do not use a ground wire? Can you clarify?

On the factory harness there is also a ground. I just wanted to clarify not to use the ground on the harness. You made it clear that the ground of the 555P is connected to the alarm ground so next i would definetly check the input blue wire. Another way to test it is by using a multimeter. You could connect the red lead using(DC voltage) to a constant power source and connect your black to the blue wire. When you try to remote start the vehicle it should give you 12 volts right away if it doesn't then either you have the wrong wire or the wire is not programed properly on the brain of the alarm. I mostly work with DEI alarms so I really wouldn't know on the Code Alarm Side. On DEI alarms you can program that wire which is blue/white seperately if you use that wire. That wire is also a defrost but I use it as a input wire. Sorry for confusing you on the ground part. I was talking about the factory immobilizer harness

No worries on the confusion. I am clear now.

I think the problem may be that the 555 is sending the signal too soon. Again, MAYBE that is the problem.

When the remote start goes on, it first turns the ignition on for about 3 seconds- you know, the fuel pump goes on, gauges turn on, seat belt chime, etc. As soon as all the stuff goes on, the LED on the 555 goes on.
THEN, the car actually cranks over. By the time it cranks, the LED on the 555 is already off.
Should the LED on the 555 be on while the car is cranking? I guess that is my main question: if the timing on the 555 is right?

that is actually normal. It will illuminate for 3 seconds. This ensures that it actually is sending a signal. Did you use 2 keys to program the 555. Or did you use the same key twice?

Nope, used 2 keys just like the direction says.

So the 555 should illuminate with the ign. then not illuminate when the car is cranking?

In the program sequence see if the first key turns off the security light after 2 secs.. The second should also do it too. After both do that then you should remote start. If both dont do that then it will not program. Now, it seems like the box did not program correctly because the security light stays on. Make sure both keys are able to turn on the car. If anything you may try to get a 555F bypass. By the way, make sure the pink wire(connected to ign of the immbl. harness) is on the cylinder side and the the pink/wire is the other side.

When you tried to program the bypass, exactly what happened? When you program that particular bypass you should turn the first key to run (not start), wait for the theft light to go out, insert second key to run (not start), wait for theft light to go out, then remote start the vehicle. This is the same exact sequence as if you were to try and add a third key to the vehicle. The vehicle needs to see 2 different keys to program a third, and if you had one made by a locksmith it is possible that it is a clone of the first and will not work.

If you decide to use a different bypass, do yourself a favor and pick up a PKF1. The PKF1 just duplicates the code it reads so there is no need for 2 separate keys to program, once connected just start the truck with a key and programming is done.

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Installer, IT support, and FFL. I need less hobbies.

That is the exact sequence that I did. Do you think the 555 may be bad?

The only thing i would check last is the pink and pink/white wire. Make sure they are connected to the right wire and also not inversed. If that doesnt work then you can try using a bypass made by Fortin. You may look at the this link https://bypasskits.fortinautoradio.com/en/products/bypass_kits/pats-1/?year=2000&make=2&model=1172. Various alarm companies distribute this bypass This type of connection is easier because you only have 2 wires to hook up which is power(+) and remote input(blue/black wire) and a ring around the key cylinder.To complete the install you need 2 keys that are able to turn on the car and do the same sequence of programming on the 555P

Okay, so I just spent another HOUR working on this crap-box! I tried reversing the pink, pink/white wire to make sure that I didn't have those reversed. I am positive I have it the right way, but I just wanted to make sure. That's not it. I also double checked the ignition wire is connected to the correct wire. The ground is grounded to the body, where the alarm is grounded.

To program, I turned the ign on and waited until 2 seconds after the theft light went off. Then remove the key and did the same with the other key. Then removed both keys from the car (to make sure there was no interference) and tried to remote start the car.

When I do the remote start, the theft light keeps blinking quickly, indicating things are not right.

So do you guys suggest that I just try another unit? I doubt I can return it. Do you think I should get something differen-say the Code Alarm unit or the Fortin unit?

Ahhhh, this is wizing me off!

Try to ground the blue wire and remote start. Grounds are the leading problem for many units not working. Even the status input wire on the 555P might not be strong enough. There was a tip in regards to this by Direc techs.

The ground is run to a piece of bare metal on the body. I ran a ground from another bare spot where a bolt is. No difference...

The Code Alarm unit does not have another negative ignition output. I could use a relay and tap onto another (+) ign wire, but I think that might throw the timing off, so I doubt that would work. Maybe I'm wrong? I'm using the wire that in the Code Alarm book, it says is for triggering a PATS unit.

I think I'm giving up on the chit-box. What do you suggest I use instead? Anything that you have used that works ALL the time? I've read that the 555 doesn't seem always work.

On a sidenote, I disconnected the two pink wires that tap onto the two signal wires and when I went to start the car with the key, it didn't start and the theft light flahed quickly. I thought that was kinda weird? I mean, if I just disconnect the wires from the 555 to the PATS wires, I would think that it should start since the signal from the key would allow it to start? Don't know if this points to anything, but thought I would throw out this tid-bit.

When you cut the ign wire then the signal is not being received. In other words the car will not start because the wire that was cut must be connected back. If the 555p harness is unplugged then the wire is not "together" anymore. When you said a piece of bare metal did you mean that that metal can be removed? I would strongly recommend connecting that wire straight to the kick panel. sand off an area there to take off the paint and drill a ground. Now tap a wire to that ground and connect it to the remote start input of the 555p. DEI mentioned that sometimes the input from an alarm will not allow the 555p to work propery(may be too weak) so try to give it your own ground input by doing this. when your doing this then the box is gonna always be on. When you do this remote start the car. if it remote starts succesfully which is what we want then run a relay to give it a better remote start input when remote started. Hope you understand what im saying.

Enice-
Replied to your PM. I have both AIM and YIM, so its your preference.
I totally understand what you said and I tried as you said: cut the blue trigger wire and hooked it straight to a ground. I tried 3 different places and still no difference. One of those grounds is a stud that is welded onto the body, so I can guarantee that it is a good ground.