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06 f350 rs issues

Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=97989
Printed Date: April 28, 2024 at 7:44 AM


Topic: 06 f350 rs issues

Posted By: 410440
Subject: 06 f350 rs issues
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 11:00 AM

My customer has a 2006 F350 Diesel superduty, I put a NuStart {NU-(s) 8000} brand 2 way starter in his truck last week, hooked up tach under the dash where my tech sheets told me to, set the diesel timer blah,blah, blah, so here is the issue,  everything works just fine and dandy when its warmer outside or in the afternoon, but in the morning when my customer goes to start his truck, it will fire and run for about a minute then stop, Ive tried a few things but to no avail, has anyone ever had this type of issue? it starts and runs fine during the day and warmer temps, but in hte morning it only runs for like a minute or two before shutting off?

Thanks Guys.

Matt



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada



Replies:

Posted By: usabuilt
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 12:26 PM
On cold days it may idle quicker resulting in a tach signal that is different than when you programmed the tach when you installed it..If this is the problem, try programming the tach while racing the idle slightly..you could also see what the tach reading is when the truck is cold verses warm..

What "fix" did you try allready?




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 1:25 PM

Ive tried reprogramming tach to various idles, lower and higher, regardless when the truck is cold the idle shouldnt change enough to effect the R.S.

Ive tried replacing the brain for a newer one, and reprogram the glow plugs for a little shorter, maybe overheating glowplugs on a cold morning?



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: KarTuneMan
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 1:37 PM

Why would the tach (or being hot or cold) have anything to do with "run time"?

If the tach is correct, it's correct. The only thing an impropper tach setting would have any effect on, is starting or not,

and grinding. I believe these trucks have built in anti-grind.... so this really should not be an issue

Does your remote start have a built in timer for glow plug, or do you need to have the glow plug wire connected?



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Posted By: usabuilt
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 1:49 PM
Idle speed change DOES affect run time, if at start idle, is 3 to 4%
different than the resting idle it could cause the unit to shut down, I've seen it happen a million times.




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:21 PM

with the tech sheets i have it says use tach from under the dash. do you guys have any other locations to get tach and or voltage sense?

and any more ideas why it would not run in the morning but fine in the afternoon?



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: xtremej
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:24 PM
UH voltage sense requires no hook up, just a programing change.




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:26 PM

why in the manual then does it say to hook up the tach wire to alternator for voltage sense? 

   new to compustar, never hd to do VS before.



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: xtremej
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:29 PM
For tach go to tach, alternator to the stator wir on back of the alt. For voltage sense no hook up is required. Although we had 3 4200dx brains that would not do voltage sense last saturday.




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:41 PM

ahh ok i understand, i thought voltage sense was alternator sense, my bad thanks for clearing that up.

Now back to the issue at hand? ideas?



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: xtremej
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 4:43 PM
I would try setting it up for voltage sense and see how that works.




Posted By: KarTuneMan
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 7:42 PM

usabuilt wrote:

Idle speed change DOES affect run time, if at start idle, is 3 to 4%
different than the resting idle it could cause the unit to shut down, I've seen it happen a million times.

Can anyone else explain this to me?

It makes no sence at all. Everything that I know (and I am always looking to learn) tells me there is no way that the tach reading could effect the run time? At least with the Astro product...... The tach is used to stop the starter motor from grinding away at the flywheel.

Am I wrong here?



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Posted By: extreme1
Date Posted: October 15, 2007 at 8:48 PM
do alternator sense, works great on those trucks.

tach on those superduty diesels is problematic at best, they work one day then the starter thinks low tach and shuts down.


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Shaughn Murley
Install Manager, Dealer Services
Visions Electronics
Red Deer, Alberta




Posted By: usabuilt
Date Posted: October 16, 2007 at 8:40 AM
KarTuneMan,

If you use Astrostart you should notice that it has a "tach reduce" programming feature, either 800, 600 or 500..

I have seen this happen where customers have said it runs for about a "minute", which was more like 20 seconds..and the solution was to reduce the tach setting..

the tach signal not only stops the starter from grinding it also monitors the wire for inconsistent readings, and has over-rev protection..

BTW, If you bury the key on some Fords and it gets very cold outside, it could cause the system to not see a key and not start, I don't think it would start at all if this was the problem though.

BTW some of Astro's newest modules will have a tachless mode for difficult cars..




Posted By: kassdog
Date Posted: October 16, 2007 at 8:46 AM
I have had problems with these vehicles in the past also with tach. When I called up directechs they said that the tach signal is weak and you need a tach generating module to get it to work properly. Problem is I haven't been able to get a hold of one.




Posted By: usabuilt
Date Posted: October 16, 2007 at 9:11 AM
I think Kassdog hit the mark..and now that I remember I did add a tach gererating module on one of these..




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 16, 2007 at 11:02 PM

I got a hold of the customers whip today... yes i said whip.. ballin truck.

Anyway what i had him do this morning is go out to his truck and watch the tach when he R/S it. so he said the truck starts and runs at about 750 rpm for 3-45 ish seconds then idles up to about 1200 rpm (my theory: starts and idles to to get oil flow, then revs up to warm the engine with proper oil flow.. possible?)

anyway i reprogrammed the tach at about 1100, RS it when warm, idles at 750 ish doesnt turn off the remote start.. ok good on that stage, then while under remote start i hit the accelerator pedal and took er up to about 1200, still didnt cut off. so im thinking ok good, i found the mid point on the tach range and hopefully now its going to work, the customer will let me know tommorow the verdict and ill let you guys know. but if the junk still doesnt work im going to put a command start in the truck as i have never had a problem with these units and diesels, lets see what happens.



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: profuse007
Date Posted: October 16, 2007 at 11:57 PM
750RPM is pretty high for diesel, isnt it? The redline is like 4kRPM or so. I would guess those thing idle about 600RPM.

750RPM is more like gasoline/petrol vehicles.

I do not know too much about diesel but i know they have to be warmed up pretty well to drive bc of the extreme clearance bt the bearings. Thats how the distinctive diesel sound came from. Speeding up the engine would really go against that. again, i dot not know too much to really give a straight answer to your theory.



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Houston,TX
"The two most common elements in the universe are H+ and stupidity" (Ellison).




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 17, 2007 at 10:29 AM
I dont know if it is exactly 750, it idles at the first tick below 1000, so i set tach at about 1100 (first tick above 1k?) anyway still waiting to see what happens

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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada




Posted By: vitrox
Date Posted: October 18, 2007 at 8:14 PM

you can go to the crank positioning sensor for tach signal also.  i don't know the wire color but you can call up ford and prolly get it. or if anyone has access to alldata.

We've had to hook to the cps before with compustars.





Posted By: tedmond
Date Posted: October 18, 2007 at 8:43 PM
hey, dont use the tachless mode, its not reliable. The tach seem a little high for that truck, have you tried the alternator voltage sense? i have used that before on Easycar units, and they work flawlessly




Posted By: 410440
Date Posted: October 21, 2007 at 12:16 AM

Im going to try using alternator sense tommorow for the customer, its a nustart nus-8000, so compustart cm-3000 i think, anyway does anyone have the wire color and location for this "stator" wire, i know it says on the back of the alternator, but there must be an easier way to get it.

Thanks for the help 12volt.



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Matthew Robertson
Senior Installer
Best Buy Deerfoot Meadows
Calgary, AB, Canada





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