2005 honda pilot pkall programming

I have an Avital 4103 installed with a pkall in a 2005 Honda pilot. The remote start works and the bypass module programs successfully. However, the pkall eventually seems to lose the programming and goes back to behaving like it is straight out of the box. After going through the programming sequence again the unit works fine for a seemingly random amount of time and then loses it's programming again.

This is the second pkall so I'm pretty sure it's not defective.

One thing about my installation is that I have the keysense wire connected with the GWR on the pkall and 4103 status wire to avoid the domelight issue. This results in the pkall getting a signal to turn on when I insert the key for step 8 during programming. I still get the 10 flashes and it starts without the key so I've assumed that everything is fine.

Has anyone encountered this issue and figured out what the problem is? Any help is greatly appreciated!

It may very well have to do with those wires being tied together and back feeding. They need to be diode isolated or use the negative ignition wire from remote start to feed the key sense wire

What is the dome light issue you have having?

Like suggested already, I too suggest wiring the vehicle in the different manner. It's bad form to have the pkall override the immobilizer upon insertion of the key. Transponder keys also tend to do their thing and deactivate the factory immobilizer when the key is inserted. Basically a formula for a mess of unknowns.

Thanks to both of you for your input. I will rewire the keysense to the ignition output on the 4103 satellite harness.

@catback
In regards to the domelight issue, I read in another forum post here that the domelight would remain on after remote start so I was trying to be proactive.

I'll follow up after I get things rewired. Thanks again!

If you are not using the Avital 4103 to turn on the Rear Defogger, why not wire it up this way?

4-pin satellite harness diagram
Pin 1  BLUE     STATUS OUTPUT to PKALL GWR input

H2/5  BLUE/WHITE  (-) 200mA 2ND STATUS/REAR DEFOGGER OUTPUT to Honda Pilot Keysense wire.
Factory Default programming for this output is 2ND Status.

Both outputs are logically separated and no diodes required.

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Soldering is fun!

kreg357 wrote:

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If you are not using the Avital 4103 to turn on the Rear Defogger, why not wire it up this way?

4-pin satellite harness diagram
Pin 1  BLUE     STATUS OUTPUT to PKALL GWR input

H2/5  BLUE/WHITE  (-) 200mA 2ND STATUS/REAR DEFOGGER OUTPUT to Honda Pilot Keysense wire.
Factory Default programming for this output is 2ND Status.

Both outputs are logically separated and no diodes required.

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Thanks, that's a great idea. I already rewired using the harness ignition output, but maybe I should switch it to the defogger?

In regards to the pkall I noticed the wire diagrams downloaded from xpresskit.com and the book that came with the unit are in conflict about many things, but notably the sides of the security light wire that relay 1a(light grn) and 1b(ORANGE / brown) should be connected on. Does anyone know for sure? I have 1a wired to the ignition side and 1b to the vehicle side. Is this backwards?

Switched the 1a and 1b relay wires to different sides of the security light wire and no luck, same behavior.

I did determine however what seems to trigger the bypass to lose its programming. When I press the lock button on the OEM or 4103 remote it causes the pkall light to come on and wipes the programming of the pkall. I then go through the programming steps and it works again.

I have the 4103 lock and unlock connected to the wires coming from the factory wireless module next to the glove box, grn/blue(unlock) and pink/blk(lock).

I don't think it matters much but both of the Fortin install guides for the Key-OverRide-ALL have it the way you are presently wired.  ( The Fortin Key-OverRide-ALL is the OEM piece to the PKALL.)   Think all this connection does is keep the Security Light off during a remote start by opening the circuit.

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Soldering is fun!

Very strange...

Not sure how a Lock from the Factory remote is affecting the PKALL...

Have you mixed the 4103's GWA(Locked) and GWR outputs?

Why not use these wires for Lock & Unlock?

POWER LOCK   BLACK/ ORANGE (TYPE B), See NOTE #2   @ PASSENGER FUSEBOX, LIGHT GREEN 20-Pin Plug   
POWER UNLOCK       BLUE/ORANGE (TYPE B), See NOTE #2      @ PASSENGER FUSEBOX, LIGHT GREEN 20-Pin Plug 
NOTE #2: Test these wires while using the POWER DOOR LOCK SWITCH on the PASSENGER DOOR only.

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Soldering is fun!

First off, thanks for your assistance.

I guess I lied before. The OEM remote is not causing problems, but hitting unlock or lock with the 4103 remote wipes the pkall programming. So with the OEM remote I usually get a single blink when locking and double blink of the parking lights when unlocking. Using the 4103 remote I get a strange multi blink when locking and again when unlocking. I attributed this to the 4103 pulsing the parking lights a millisecond before the honda pulses them and causing a slap fight. Could this be causing the pkall problems I'm seeing? Maybe I should switch my lock and unlock to the wires you mentioned?

The reason I chose these lock/unlock wires was to maintain the stepped unlock feature. Don't really care anymore though.

I verified the ground while locked(not hooked up) and GWR(hooked to blue/white on pkall).

Here's my current 4103 setup:

Avital Wiring matchup:
H1/1 LtGrn/Black connected to blue alarm disarm wire in door
H1/2 GREEN / WHITE not connected
H1/3 Yellow not connected
H1/4 WHITE/ Blue not connected
H1/5 Orange not connected
H1/6 Brown connected to ltGrn/blue
H1/7 RED / White not connected
H1/8 Black connected to ground
H1/9 White connected to RED / yellow

4 pin satellite harness:
1 Blue connected to blue/white on PKALL
2,3 not connected
4 Pink connected to keysense

Heavy Gauge harness:
1 Pink connected to BLACK / YELLOW
2 Purple connected to BLACK/ white
3 Orange connected to yellow
4 Red connected to 12v constant (white)
5 Pink/White connected to WHITE/ black
6 Red connected to 12v constant (white)

3 pin door lock harness:
1 Blue connected to grn/blue
2 none
3 Green connected to pink/blk

Remote start harness:
H2/1 BLACK/ White connected to toggle and then grounded
H2/2 Violet/White connected to blue
H2/3 Brown connected to WHITE/ black
H2/4 Gray connected to yellow
H2/5 Blue/White - not connected

Everything looks good except the Avital Pink to Pilot Keysense.  Think I would use the Blue/White 2nd Status wire instead.

I'm sure it's done but Avital programming for the thick Pink/White wire to set it to ACC2 ( Menu 2, Item 6, Option 2 )
Also, the Parking Light jumper for (-) polarity output.

The only other thing would be the PKALL 4 Pin power harness.  Personally, I would cut the end off and make
direct connections to +12V & Chassis Ground at the 4103 Red and Black wires ( as shown in the install guide ).

You could temporarily unplug the Door Lock harness and see what happens.

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Soldering is fun!

Unplugged the door harness and got the same behavior of wiping the pkall.

Finally seem to have it resolved by going w2w with the pkall. What a pain in the butt. I'll definitely never go D2D with directed stuff again. I'm also going to spend some time this weekend and get the other stuff wired like you suggested.

Thanks again for all of your help!