remote start only?
Printed From: the12volt.com
Forum Name: Car Security and Convenience
Forum Discription: Car Alarms, Keyless Entries, Remote Starters, Immobilizer Bypasses, Sensors, Door Locks, Window Modules, Heated Mirrors, Heated Seats, etc.
URL: https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=117787
Printed Date: April 28, 2024 at 8:56 PM
Topic: remote start only?
Posted By: angelars
Subject: remote start only?
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 7:52 PM
We bought a Viper 5902 (basically the same as a 5901) and we are (at this time) only trying to hook up the remote start part. We will install all of the other features at a later date.
When we try to remote start the car we can hear the relays on the main brain clicking, but the car doesn't crank.
We have violet and green wires going to the starter. We checked to make sure that they weren't reversed.
We have the pink ignition 1 wire going to ignition.
H1/2 red for constant 12 volts is going to battery.
H1/5 black is going to ground.
H2/18 BLACK/ white is going to ground for the neutral safety switch.
H2/17 brown is going to the brake.
The car is a 2010 Milan (same as the Fusion) and we are using the XPressKit PKFM D2D interface module for PATS.
We can't seem to get the PKFM to program. We put the first key in, turn the ignition on until the light goes off, then within 5 seconds we put the second key in, turn the ignition on until the light goes off, remove the key and push the remote start button, but it never starts. The light on the PKFM is supposed to stay solid for 3 seconds but ours just starts flashing (not the fast flashing for reversed TX/RX) just normal flashing, after we remove the second key.
If the PKFM wasn't programed, would that keep the car from trying to crank, or would it crank but not start?
Are there any other wires that we need to connect to get the remote starter to work? We are using virtual tach at this time, once we get the car to crank we will switch to the violet/white tach wire.
Also, when we run starter diagnostics it flashes 8 times, which supposedly means that neutral safety switch is shutting it down, but we have the brain set to Automatic tranny (via Bitwritter) and the black and white wire is going to ground, so I don't get why it's flashing 8 times. The neutral safety switch is in the ON position. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Replies:
Posted By: chadwa2003
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 8:00 PM
The system comes defaulted in manual mode you need to put it in automatic transmission mode for the vehicle to start
Posted By: jim hunter
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 8:09 PM
do you have the accessory wire hooked up? what about the other 12v constant wires?you say the green and violet starter wires arent reversed but which wire is going where?also i am not familiar with this bypass but the new fords dont call it pats anymore its called secur-lok so imnot sure if this bypass is correct, also do you have the bypass wired correctly?(power,ground when running etc.)
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 8:15 PM
chadwa2003 wrote:
The system comes defaulted in manual mode you need to put it in automatic transmission mode for the vehicle to start
We switched it to automatic via the bitwriter version 2.7.
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 8:23 PM
jim hunter wrote:
do you have the accessory wire hooked up?
I thought that was for the heater/AC system so that it warms up (or cools down) the car...
[quote]what about the other 12v constant wires?[/quote]
We only see H1/2 marked as constant. Do you mean ignition 2 flex relay. We do not use that on this car.
[quote]you say the green and violet starter wires arent reversed but which wire is going where?[/quote]
Green = key
Violet = starter
[quote]also i am not familiar with this bypass but the new fords dont call it pats anymore its called secur-lok so imnot sure if this bypass is correct[/quote]
Yes, according to XPressKit this is the correct one for the 2010 Fusion/Milan.
[quote]do you have the bypass wired correctly?(power,ground when running etc.)[/QUOTE]
Yes, but I read in another thread while researching this that DEI has bad instructions, and you're not supposed to remove the second key, so I'll try that to see if that allows it to program.
Thanks for trying to help.
Posted By: 05gt
Date Posted: November 16, 2009 at 9:54 PM
main harness needs to wired like this for the milan H3/1 Pink (wire this to ignition 1 in the car) H3/2 RED / White (not used) H3/3 Orange (wire this to acc 1 in the car) H3/4 Violet (wire this to the starter wire in the car) H3/5 Green (not used) H3/6 Red (connect to 12 volts in the car) H3/7 Pink/White (not used) H3/8 Pink/Black (not used) H3/9 RED / Black (connect to 12 volts in the car) H1/2 Red (connect this to 12 volts in the car) H1/5 Black (connect this wire to ground) H2/9 Violet/White (connect this wire to the tach wire in the car) H2/17 Brown (connect this wire to the foot brake in the car) H2/18 BLACK/ White (connect this wire to ground and plug in the neutral safety 2 pin plug and switch to the on position) as for anything else reply back when you have wired this properly
Posted By: Mike M2
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 6:36 AM
Are both keys original Ford keys? we have had a rash of clone keys from Carmax lately, they won't work as a second key thus no bypass programming....
-------------
Mike M2
Tech Manager
CS Dealer Services
Posted By: Chris Luongo
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 10:25 AM
Not really sure if that car will kill the starter as part of the anti theft.....some Fords will still crank without a proper bypass, some won't.
Regardless, the first step is to unplug the bypass temporarily, insert one of your good keys in the ignition, and leave it there. Try the remote start.
If the remote start works with the key in the ignition, your install is good....concentrate on what's wrong with the bypass.
On the other hand, if it still doesn't work even with the factory key, there is some error in the installation...correct that before worrying about the bypass.
Also, if you look at 05gt's post, well, it's been a while since I've installed a Viper so I don't remember exactly.
But, notice how there are three heavy gauge RED / strip wires? Red, RED / white, and RED / black? I think you only have one of the three hooked up to constant, while 05gt is saying that you need to connect one more.
Posted By: chriswallace187
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 11:10 AM
angelars,
You may find my description of PKFM programming here to be helpful. ------------- C Renner's Auto Electronix
My service is cheap, quick, and good - pick any two
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 11:25 AM
Mike M2 wrote:
Are both keys original Ford keys?
Yes, both keys are the original keys that came with the car. Thank you for trying to help.
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 11:35 AM
chriswallace187 wrote:
angelars,
You may find my description of PKFM programming here to be helpful.
LOL. Actually that's the exact thread that I found last night when I was researching this. I did try your instructions, but unfortunately it did not work. After the second key is inserted the bypass light does go out, but instead of glowing for 3 seconds afterward it starts flashing slowly again.
I think I need to focus on the other two red wire(s). Apparently something is not getting power when it's supposed to. I think I might have two issues here, the red wire(s) and the bypass. Once the car can start with the key in the ignition then I will have made enough progress to focus on the bypass, as explained above.
I really appreciate everyone help with this and putting me on the right path.
Posted By: 05gt
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 12:12 PM
refer to MIKE M2 post, I have had 2 ford rangers lately, one an 06 and the other an 07 that would not program at all, we tried various bypasses, it was later figured out that one of the keys was a clone key and that was why nothing would program
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 12:38 PM
OK we hooked up the two red wires and now the car starts with the key in the ignition.
Thanks so much to 05gt for helping us with this part of the install.
Now we just need to figure out how to get the bypass to program.... they advertise the bypass as being easy to install, but this XPressKit bypass isn't easy, it's frustrating...
Any suggestions are welcomed...
Posted By: 05gt
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 1:04 PM
i am looking at the install manual for the PKFM now, the only thing I can think of is check the ground when running wire to make sure it isn't getting any ground during the programming (this is mentioned in the TS part of the guide) if you didn't connect D2D the install manual doesn't even show 2010 or 2009, so are you sure this will work with the 2010's? have you confirmed with DEI, I think it will but you never know have you reset the module? have you loaded the latest firmware into the module? if you are running D2D you only need to hook up 3 wires, Ignition, RX and TX they are easy to install it is only 3 wires, but if you have a bad key or something then it will be impossible to install, unless DEI tech support has a way around this, maybe they can give you custom firmware that only allows 1 key to be used
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 1:30 PM
[QUOTE=05gt] the install manual doesn't even show 2010 or 2009, so are you sure this will work with the 2010's?Before I bought it I went to the XPressKit website and looked it up. On the website it says that this is the correct bypass for the 2010 Milan and Fusion. My guess is that they just didn't update the other materials they have. have you reset the module? Yes, and I also have reflashed it just to be sure. have you loaded the latest firmware into the module? See above. if you are running D2D you only need to hook up 3 wires, Ignition, RX and TX Yes, we are using D2D. Green goes to violet/gray of the car. Pink goes to yellow/org of the car, and orange goes to blue/brown of the car. You can see the factory wiring diagram below:  they are easy to install it is only 3 wires, but if you have a bad key or something then it will be impossible to install How can it be a bad key? The car is only a few weeks old and both keys start the car... I do appreciate you're trying to help.
Posted By: chriswallace187
Date Posted: November 17, 2009 at 1:56 PM
angelars,
Just to make sure, you are turning each factory key to "run", correct? Simply inserting it into the ignition won't do anything to program.
It's obvious, but make sure your TX and RX connections aren't reversed.
Also, just to reiterate, the programming sequence goes like this:
First key to "run"
Theft light on 3 seconds, then off
Key off and removed
Second key to "run"
Theft light on 3 seconds, then off. Wait a couple seconds.
Second key off and removed
Immediately remove keys at least 6 inches from the key cylinder and activate remote start. It will probably fail to start at this point.
Brake or remote shutdown
Wait 1 minute, turn either key to "run"
Key off
Attempt remote start - this time should be successful.
-------------
C Renner's Auto Electronix
My service is cheap, quick, and good - pick any two
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 20, 2009 at 1:44 PM
Our PKFM just started working on its own. Remote starter now works and I wanted to thank everyone in this thread for helping out. I don't know why it started working, but I checked for intermittent connections and found none. It has worked every time since so I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth.
I do have one other question though. I wanted to proceed and hook up the heater wire. According to what I've found the accessory wire is purple and green (see factory diagram below). However it's triggering a relay, and the other side of that factory relay is going to positive 12 volts. That should mean that I would need to connect a ground to that relay to turn on the heater, but I'm being told to send it 12 volts positive with the orange from H3/3.
Is the orange (H3/3) wire sending out a ground? I thought that was sending out 12 volts?
Posted By: angelars
Date Posted: November 20, 2009 at 1:51 PM
The factory diagram is below: 
Posted By: chriswallace187
Date Posted: November 20, 2009 at 2:34 PM
Angelars,
The fact that a heavy gauge wire from the remote start might be called the "heater" output doesn't at all mean that it has to power the blower directly.
On this car, if you've powered up the ignition, accessory, and start wires at the ignition switch, the blower should already be working.
-------------
C Renner's Auto Electronix
My service is cheap, quick, and good - pick any two
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