2002 Camry starter kill via keyless entry

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soybeanstorm

Member - Posts: 22

Joined: April 11, 2003

Location: United States

Posted: April 11, 2003 at 5:23 PM / IP Logged

Ok, I have one for the genius installers out there:

I am trying to build a starter kill module that feeds off the factory keyless entry system, so there are several questions:

1) Where is the keyless entry module and does it send out a pulse of some sort on disarm (it has to right? if nothing to unlock the car). Color / location / polarity of this wire?

2) Given that I can tap into this pulse, I'd like to build a pulse extension circuit (once it receives the pulse, it will hold the pulse for 1 or 2 minutes).. this circuit will feed a relay that connects the starter wire, allowing me to start the car in those 1 or 2 minutes after disarm. Any idea how to build this circuit?

Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks!

auex

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Posted: April 11, 2003 at 5:52 PM / IP Logged

Not trying to knock you down, but if you could tap into the output for the unlock, what is keeping someone from using the unlock switch inside of the car from doing the same thing? You could build a passive starter kill system easily, just way too much effort in trying to tie into your factory keyless entry. Look here

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CruisinS&S

Copper - Posts: 225

Joined: February 05, 2003

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Posted: April 11, 2003 at 10:42 PM / IP Logged

If you tap into the unlock 2 wire it will work fine and would only be able to disarm w/ the remotes

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Chris Luongo

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Joined: May 21, 2002

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Posted: April 12, 2003 at 1:45 PM / IP Logged

You'd have to set up your system so that your starter kill will be disarmed ONLY if just the driver's door unlocks...make it so that if all the doors are unlocked at once, your kill remains active. Since a thief has no mechanism to unlock just the driver's door, your car will remain secure.

To do that, you'll have to make a setup that monitors the unlock motor leg of the driver's door actuator, and also monitors the unlock leg of the other doors.........both of these wires are blue/black......driver's door wire is in the kick panel, in the harness that leads into the door......the wire for the other doors is in the driver's running board.

It would take considerable knowledge of electronics to design a system like you mention.

It would be far simpler to buy a "keyless upgrade" alarm system, such as an Audiovox Pursuit PRO9232S, or a DEI Hornet 700T. These systems add onto the factory keyless, and turn it into an alarm system. If you don't desire a complete alarm, just hook up the starter kill only....don't bother to hook up siren, door trigger, shock sensor, etcetera.

I hear the 700T goes for around $40 on eBay. The 700T includes a starter kill output, but not the starter kill relay, so you'll also have to buy a relay separately.

soybeanstorm

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Joined: April 11, 2003

Location: United States

Posted: April 14, 2003 at 2:34 PM / IP Logged

Thanks for the feedback guys. I didn't realize aftermarket "keyless upgrade" alarms existed. So inexpensive, sounds like the way to go.

But, just for the sake of discussion, I'd like to know more about the keyless entry module. All the suggestions posted here monitor the door unlock.. after the pulse has been sent to the door unlock wires. Isn't the keyless entry a "module" somewhere on the car? .. that sends out signals to the unlock wires? Hence, can't we tap THIS pulse, instead of the tapping the door unlock pulse? (ie before it even hits the unlock wires).

Chris Luongo

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Posted: April 14, 2003 at 10:13 PM / IP Logged

The integration relay controls a bunch of things in the car, including the locks. The integration relay is part of the fuse box. I believe the whole keyless deal is enclosed in there as well, although I could be wrong about that. If you can get a look at a Toyota service manual, you might be able to find out more.

And yes, those keyless upgrade units work pretty well. I had never heard of them either, until I started at my current job, where we do a lot of dealer work. We use the PRO9232S all the time, and they are easy to install and very reliable. And we sometimes use them as a kill-only setup (no alarm features) as you describe.

soybeanstorm

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Joined: April 11, 2003

Location: United States

Posted: April 17, 2003 at 12:25 PM / IP Logged

Do you know how I can get my hands on a 2002 Camry service manual? I don't think the Haynes (or equivalent) manuals are published for the car yet.

Anyhow, I think I've figured out how to build the x Second starter enable/kill circuit. It's relatively cheap (under $10). Now I just have to find the main source wire the keyless entry sends on disarm (not the door unlock wires, if possible).

Chris Luongo

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Posted: April 17, 2003 at 7:58 PM / IP Logged

Well, you can always buy the manual from Toyota...it's probably like $100. Car dealers always keep a library of manuals for their mechanics...if you are friendly with anyone at a dealership, they might let you have a look. Also, regular independent mechanics can subscribe to Mitchell (alldata.com), which has the same information...maybe if you bring your local mechanic some lunch he'll let you play on his computer awhile. Or, look for a used factory manual on eBay.

But there must be some way to make your setup so that the starter can only operate if JUST the driver's door is unlocked....if all doors are unlocked at once, the starter stays off...I think I just thought of something to get you started.

All of the motor wires for the locks rest at ground. When the locks are operated, one of the motor wires (either up or down) removes the ground and turns to positve.

Get yourself a relay, and connect terminal 86 to the driver's door unlock motor wire, and connect terminal 85 to the passenger doors' unlock motor wire.

If ONLY the driver's door is unlocked, 86 will see positive, 85 will see ground......the relay will energize for one second.

If ALL the doors are unlocked at once, BOTH 86 and 85 will see positive, and the relay will NOT energize.

You can then take the contact terminals--- 87, 87a, 30---and do whatever you'd like with them. If you ground 87, 30 will make a ground pulse whenever ONLY the driver's door is unlocked...... or tie 87 to positive, and you'll get a positive trigger.

ADDED BONUS: You may notice that if you unlock your car doors using the key, one twist will electrically unlock the driver's door; a second twist will unlock the rest.

This means that even if your Toyota remote is lost or broken, you can enable your starter by simply unlocking just the driver's door with the key. You wouldn't want to be stranded someplace just because your remote's battery went dead.

soybeanstorm

Member - Posts: 22

Joined: April 11, 2003

Location: United States

Posted: April 21, 2003 at 9:45 AM / IP Logged

Chris,

Nice!! Very clever solution! I think this will work beautifully!

And you're right.. This is probably better than using the feed from the keyless entry module directly (if we can find it) because if the remote fails, you can still use the key to enable the starter... hm.. come to think of it, are you sure the driver door unlock wire is triggered by turning he key once? I thought it was purely a mechanical unlock of the driver door.. followed by the electrical unlock of the passenger doors on the 2nd twist. (I don't think I hear the driver door actuator going when I twist once, but I could be wrong).

Chris Luongo

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Joined: May 21, 2002

Location: Massachusetts, United States

Posted: April 21, 2003 at 9:08 PM / IP Logged

Yes, if you turn the key in the driver's door very, very slowly, you'll see the driver's door electrically jump open. And then if you twist a second time, the others open too.

On Camrys WITHOUT factory keyless, the first turn of the key is purely mechanical, and a second turn electrically unlocks them all.

Anyway, when you get this all done, I'm eager to hear how you did it. At the shop I work at, we occasionally get requests for for stater kill-only, running off the factory remotes.....the only way we know how to do it is to use a keyless-upgrade alarm and just not hook up the other alarm features. It would be nice if we had a more cost-effective solution.

Also, when the Camrys first started coming out, I carefully went through a few of them and found/verified all the wiring. Here's the link; it may help you:

http://www.carsound.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000976#000000

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