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surface area or raw power?


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davngr 
Copper - Posts: 109
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Joined: October 20, 2007
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 11:07 AM / IP Logged  
the only time i would consider using more speakers as opose to larger speaker to generate more sound is if im after a certain type of sound since we all konw that 10 inch speakers dont sound the same as 15 inch speakers.
life is a comedy to think, a tragedy to feel
haemphyst 
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Joined: January 19, 2003
Location: Michigan, Bouvet Island
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 11:24 AM / IP Logged  
davngr wrote:
the only time i would consider using more speakers as opose to larger speaker to generate more sound is if im after a certain type of sound since we all konw that 10 inch speakers dont sound the same as 15 inch speakers.
Another generalization, which I am sure will soon be proven false.
The enclosure alignment, the driver geometry, the environment in which it is installed, the power applied... ALL will have an effect on the system results.
I can promise you that you would be absolutely AMAZED to hear that I have a single 10 in my car, and it will blow your freakin' MIND with how deep it goes.
A speaker doesn't HAVE a sound. It should always truly and faithfully reproduce what it is told to, by the amplifier.
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
DYohn 
Moderator - Posts: 10,740
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Joined: April 22, 2003
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 11:29 AM / IP Logged  

I can testify that haemphyst's TL driven by a 10" sounds like many 18's I have heard.

greenbronco, I guarantee I can take any 4- 6" of (your choice) and make them play "deeper" than 2-12's of (your choice.)  It's all about the enclosure alignment.

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davngr 
Copper - Posts: 109
Copper spacespace
Joined: October 20, 2007
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 11:46 AM / IP Logged  

haemphyst wrote:
davngr wrote:
the only time i would consider using more speakers as opose to larger speaker to generate more sound is if im after a certain type of sound since we all konw that 10 inch speakers dont sound the same as 15 inch speakers.
Another generalization, which I am sure will soon be proven false.
The enclosure alignment, the driver geometry, the environment in which it is installed, the power applied... ALL will have an effect on the system results.
I can promise you that you would be absolutely AMAZED to hear that I have a single 10 in my car, and it will blow your freakin' MIND with how deep it goes.
A speaker doesn't HAVE a sound. It should always truly and faithfully reproduce what it is told to, by the amplifier.

i would agree that a 10 inch woffer is all you need to have thundering base, but it might be a bit tuff to make a 18 inch woffer produce the same sound as a 6 inch woofer..  and that is waht i was talking about.

life is a comedy to think, a tragedy to feel
sedate 
Silver - Posts: 1,173
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Joined: July 03, 2004
Location: Colorado, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 11:48 AM / IP Logged  

Considering the OP:

One important concept that plays into questions like this is the idea of "Hoffman's Iron Law" -

The basic idea is that you can have 1) efficiency, 2) small enclosure size, 3) low-end extension -

Pick two.

I'm sure google.com or haemph or DYohn or stevdart have some good links on the subject.

"I'm finished!" - Daniel Plainview
greenbroncoguy 
Copper - Posts: 299
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Joined: March 27, 2003
Location: Florida, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 12:43 PM / IP Logged  
DYohn wrote:

I can testify that haemphyst's TL driven by a 10" sounds like many 18's I have heard.

greenbronco, I guarantee I can take any 4- 6" of (your choice) and make them play "deeper" than 2-12's of (your choice.)  It's all about the enclosure alignment.

I'm not saying you can't make a smaller driver slam; all I'm saying is that if you take 2 comparable drivers; same brand, same model, just 2 6"s and a 12" - do whatever you want to enclosure-wise to make the 2 6's slam as hard as you can. Then, do the same thing for the single 12" - do whatever you can enclosure wise to make it hit as hard as you can, the 12 will come out on top IMHO>. Whatever you can do to the enclousre for the 6"s to get alot of output, you can do to the 12"...

There's a reason no SPL guys use a wall of 50 6" drivers, that's all I'm saying...

-Matt

DYohn 
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Joined: April 22, 2003
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 2:06 PM / IP Logged  
Ah now you're changing the rules of the debate.  I was not talking about "slam" or "SPL," I was talking about "playing low" as in frequency response, which is what you said at first.  The size of the woofer has far less to do with FR than does the enclosure used.
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greenbroncoguy 
Copper - Posts: 299
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Joined: March 27, 2003
Location: Florida, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 2:44 PM / IP Logged  

DYohn wrote:
Ah now you're changing the rules of the debate.  I was not talking about "slam" or "SPL," I was talking about "playing low" as in frequency response, which is what you said at first.  The size of the woofer has far less to do with FR than does the enclosure used.

Point taken; I did say dig deeper in my first reply t this thread. However; keeping with the topic of the thread, I was talking about loudness overall - I should have worded my response differently. My apologies.

Also, much agreed on the box having a large impact on the total FR of the driver...

What I have been getting at all along, is that more, smaller drivers is not neccesariyl the best way to go about getting louder - you may be able to achive more with a single, larger driver...

-Matt

the_one369 
Copper - Posts: 80
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Joined: December 15, 2005
Location: Michigan, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 5:53 PM / IP Logged  
i see the debate has changed course a little bit and i should have been a little more clear first off space not an issue. im just alittle up in the air of if i should spend the money one just 2 12 inch woofers that can handle 600 rms each....or......should i buy 6 12 inch woofers that handle 200 rms each, summer is comin around the corner
jmelton86 
Gold - Posts: 1,228
Gold spacespace
Joined: February 07, 2007
Location: South Carolina, United States
Posted: March 18, 2008 at 6:04 PM / IP Logged  

What are the model #'s of the subs in question?

What amp(s) will you be using to power them?

How much trunk space are you willing to give up?

What kind of music do you listen to?

Do you want the bass to be really loud and not sound too great OR sound great and not be as loud?

2013 Kia Rio -90a alternator
DDX470HD GTO14001 GTO1014D (x3)
Big3 in 1/0G
1/0G to GTO14001
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