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power window voltage drop


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a471789 
Member - Posts: 33
Member spacespace
Joined: October 23, 2006
Location: Indiana, United States
Posted: August 17, 2008 at 11:06 PM / IP Logged  

In my car when I am rolling up multiple windows at once, they do not seem to rise as quickly as if I were to roll one up at a time.  I have thought about installing a small capacitor in series with the power window wires, because it appears as if there may be some sort of voltage drop across the circuit as multiple window motors are being powered simultaneously.  My main concern in doing so is that I might supply too much current to my window motors and fry them.  I could also install an inductor as it would provide more current...but I'm not certain.  Anyone have any ideas?  I know before I take this step, I should probably take apart my door panel and meter the voltage at the window motor as I roll one window down and compare it to the voltage when I roll two windows down simultaneously.  I could also measure the current changes; compare the current of one window versus multiple.  I may be dumb in trying to fix something so small, but when I see an issue....I try to resolve it - no matter how small.

Brent
MECP Advanced Installer
"I don't claim to know it all, just more than you."
reax222 
Copper - Posts: 220
Copper spacespace
Joined: March 11, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 12:06 AM / IP Logged  
I think it's a wire size/length issue. Most power window systems run power from the drivers switch to all the windows, and not just a control. I think the perfect solution would be relays and their own independent power wires. However, your talking 8 relays and a pretty good run of wire. You would still be using the stock system, but it will probably cause problems with any auto up/down or add-on power window modules.
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 2:41 AM / IP Logged  
First what vehicle, here are two suggested fixes, one spray WD 40 into the window channels- don't laugh it works, then see if your windows run up and down smoothly. Second if there are 4 windows, on the second pair use a 628t timer (is that the right part number) on the trigger wire between the first and second pair set to a 7 sec delay so one set is finished before the second set starts.
i am an idiot 
Platinum - Posts: 13,670
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: September 21, 2006
Location: Louisiana, United States
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 5:11 AM / IP Logged  
Good morning Howie, I don't think he has window modules.  He is having this problem when he is rolling the windows up with the switches in the door.  My Honda has the same problem, if I could figure out how to get the door panel off, I know lubrication would do the trick, if I grab the window and help it, it comes up much faster.
sparkie 
Platinum - Posts: 2,061
Platinum spacespace
Joined: November 06, 2003
Location: Canada
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 8:12 AM / IP Logged  
This is normal for most vehicles. You can check a few things to make sure all is well and stays that way. As mentioned, you should make sure that each window track is very clean to reduce friction. Use some gentle cleaners on the fabric and foam slides that the window goes through on each side of the door frame. Use grease on moving mechanical parts within the door. Make the window guides are adjusted correctly and don't put too much pressure on the window as it moves. Use a digital volt meter to measure for voltages drops across each switch and the grounds for each power window motor. You can also measure for voltage drops from the battery to each motor as it operates. Checking for voltage drops is the correct method of determining if you have a wiring problem like corrosion. A voltage drop of 0.2 volts across a circuit or switch is considered normal. A drop of more than 0.5 volts across the whole circuit indicates a problem. Don't forget to check and clean the battery terminals and battery ground.
sparky
a471789 
Member - Posts: 33
Member spacespace
Joined: October 23, 2006
Location: Indiana, United States
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 9:04 AM / IP Logged  
I have a 2002 Chrysler Concorde.  I'm dealing with the factory motors, powered by the factory switch.  I know it's not an issue such as lubrication, and most likely not a connection/corrosion issue.  Like I said, when I do one window at a time, it is fine.  It is when I roll up multiple windows simultaneously, I notice the lag.  THAT is what makes me think that there is either a voltage drop or the motors aren't getting enough current to be able to power the motors at the same rate as if they were individually being powered.  After all, it's the same source...the same relay assembly....powering all four motors....only a specified amount of current can be applied from the factory source.  I also realize that it is normal.  However, I'm abit anal about this and it would be cool if I could apply my 12v knowledge to improve upon the design.  If I'm just being stupid, tell me.  I occasionally have bad ideas.  I know if a customer complained about this to me, I'd punch him in the face....but I'm really just curious whether I could affect this.
Brent
MECP Advanced Installer
"I don't claim to know it all, just more than you."
sparkie 
Platinum - Posts: 2,061
Platinum spacespace
Joined: November 06, 2003
Location: Canada
Posted: August 18, 2008 at 12:07 PM / IP Logged  
OK you are being stupid. No just kidding. There isn't a problem. Your car's electrical system isn't designed to provide full current output all the time. Think of it in terms of water pressure. If you turned on all the taps and flushed all the toilets at once, you would notice a drop in water pressure. The only way to reduce this would bbe to make a massive upgrade to the vehicle's power supply. Larger power & ground cables, high output alternator and maybe additional batteries. Your alternator is only designed to output enough current for normal peak loads in the car. It can only put out so much at a certain engine RPM. Increasing the RPM's will allow it to output more current. What you want to do is way too much work and cost. All cars do this.
sparky
still_walkin 
Silver - Posts: 644
Silver spacespace
Joined: April 18, 2007
Location: California, United States
Posted: August 20, 2008 at 7:02 PM / IP Logged  
If you are having problems with voltage drops on the windows it could be a loose wire on one of the switches . When you ue the window switch on the door that the window is on and you don't notice a change then check your master switch. Get thre helpers and have each of them to a door and try the same thing with the windows and see if you get the same results. If you do then its like its posted above update the charging system
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