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delay relay on time


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rtm038 
Member - Posts: 41
Member spacespace
Joined: September 26, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: November 07, 2009 at 8:34 PM / IP Logged  

I'd like to power the coil of a standard Bosch 30-amp automotive relay through a "fading" power source.  From what I've read, using a fading power source will cause "chattering", which is something I'd like to avoid.  Is there a way to wire the coil so that the application of voltage to coil contacts will be delayed until the fading power feed reaches atleast 6 volts?  Also, is there a way to wire the coil contacts so that the coil immediately de-energizes once the voltage reaches 6 volts as the power feed fades out to 0+vdc?

i am an idiot 
Platinum - Posts: 13,674
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: September 21, 2006
Location: Louisiana, United States
Posted: November 08, 2009 at 4:40 AM / IP Logged  

The relay should not have a problem with the increase from 0 to 12, I think it takes more than 6 volts to energize the relay.  I do not think there will be any chattering in that phase of the process.  The chatter experienced upon the diminishing voltage is usually cured by a capacitor and a diode.  But before we try that, I need to know what kind of current the device is capable of.  I do not want to help you burn it up if it can not charge  a 1000 mic cap along with the devices it powers.

rtm038 
Member - Posts: 41
Member spacespace
Joined: September 26, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: November 08, 2009 at 6:13 AM / IP Logged  
Basically what I'm doing is using my dome light feed to control a relay that will be used to control the illumination of my headlights and reverse lights when I use the unlock button on my key fob (06 Expedition).  When I press the "unlock" button on the key fob, the exterior puddle and interior courtesy lights fade from Off to On in about 1.5 seconds.  When I get out and press the "lock" button, the lights fade from On to Off in about 1.5 seconds.  As far as specs on the relay, from what I've read, the pull-in voltage is around 8 volts, the drop-out voltage is between 1 and 5 volts and the coil resistance is 75ohms.
i am an idiot 
Platinum - Posts: 13,674
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: September 21, 2006
Location: Louisiana, United States
Posted: November 08, 2009 at 7:41 AM / IP Logged  

delay relay on time -- posted image. 

After re-reading your post, the above will only eliminate the chatter.  It will pull in when it pulls in.  That will be whenever it reaches the 7 volts you referred to earlier.  If it is taking longer than you like turning off, you may try a 470 mic cap.  

howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: November 08, 2009 at 10:40 AM / IP Logged  
Any one thought of another method, take a pulse from your lock trigger wire or a dedicated aux output if an alarm is involved, either time the aux or use a 528t timed relay from the lock wire to run the other lights?
dualsport 
Silver - Posts: 983
Silver spacespace
Joined: September 27, 2005
Location: United States
Posted: November 10, 2009 at 5:05 PM / IP Logged  

I don't think you need to worry about the chattering of the relay; that'd only tend to be a problem if your battery is being affected by the load, such that the voltage jumps up when the relay disengages, and goes up enough to engage the relay again. 

Relays have a certain amount of built in hysteresis that you shouldn't have a problem with this unless your battery is really weak.

More of a concern is that it sounds like you're driving fairly heavy loads, and switching relays slowly tends to be hard on the relay contacts, because the resistance goes up as you approach the point where it's at the turn on or turn off threshold.   It could possibly overheat the contacts and cause them to fail earlier than they normally would if you drive them fast and hard.

If you can use another control like Howie suggests it'd be better-  otherwise you could add a solid state relay driver, though it'd probably be more trouble than you want to bother with.  Or just try it as is; it should still last a while even with the slow switching, and it doesn't sound like it's a critical kind of function, being just headlights.

deja vu


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