power distribution

You were right - we are definitely of a similar mind re: vehicle selection (and lighting) You say you want fog lights...but then you reference "projectors". These are mutually exclusive. Please expand.

Just a note - I doubt H4s etc will be replaced. Like fitting HIDs, the whole assembly will be replaced. (I know H4 LEDs exist and there are HIDs than can be retrofitted, but I'm talking about a proper lighting system - not one that dazzles oncomers, ruins shell & lenses, and loses quality by putting up with old reflector/lens systems. LEDs for other lighting generally does not suffer the same problems.)

Re: fogs vs projectors: Haven't done all my homework yet. What it comes down to is, I want a small, powerful fog light. Not some $25 at Walmart Blazer job, but not some $200 item, either. Preferably with a yellow tone, as to me, it gives me the best return in terms of visibility in fog. Re: LED replacement of existing bulbs: just like I can buy an upgrade (Hella, Cibie, et al) that bolts in place of my original 6054 sealed-beams and lets me use an H4 bulb, surely there will be an assembly released to upgrade to LEDs. I realize that "in the Engineer's world", the housing made for $givenbulb does not work with $givenreflector. I also realize there are cheap, sub-optimal, aftermarket housings to adapt from 6054 sealed beams to H4s. I have them in my truck. My truck is... err.. "slightly modified"... (factory suspension cut off, solid axles front and rear, 6" of suspension lift, hydroboost braking... to just give the biggest mods). So my headlights are a bit up there. I've NEVER been flashed for blinding oncoming drivers, mostly because I am running a white bulb (blue bulbs are about the stupidest thing you can run- look at the physics of how our eyes work), but because I took care to properly aim them. So while I agree that these aren't optimal, I also know that the cheap $60 upgrade puts *A HELL* of a lot more light on the road, safely, making things more visible and making my vehicle safer for everyone involved. I've also had people tell me there's no way I can possibly design a suspension better than the factory, "they have experts who are paid to do that". Well, there's that.. and there's the fact my truck drives much better than it did stock. See, I'm a weird person- I follow Heinlein's axiom about experts: "Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it."

For headlights, LEDs are not a point source like HIDs, halogens & bulbs and hence they are unsuitable for substitution into "bulb" type shells. And each LED has its own reflector & lens, hence total "headlight" replacement. But when prices are acceptable, I'll upgrade my halogen headlights to LEDs. I never considered HIDs acceptable (in my case) and certainly now IMO they are past their use-by date. BTW, fogs are technically a low flat spread whereas projectors aren't (afaik). But with 1,000Lm LED torches available for under $100 (retail) I'd expect plenty of options for projector (spot) applications.    Blue headlight bulbs - yeah, a great idea. A subset of white light; we are most sensitive to green; and of course blue would never refract differently to white thru a lens... Alas guns are banned here so I just put on my 200W spots and aim for any blueish headlight that dazzles me. Cheap is relative. Cheap used to mean cheap price. I was blown by how good my cheap rectangular NARVA 150 x 85mm spots were. I reckon they outdid my quality 145mm (5-3/4") spots! And of course these days, consumables etc are cheap. Same for LEDs. To think I can buy 5050 or 3528 SMD LEDs for 10c each (in roll form). But automotive LED spotlights were around $500 a couple of years ago and now they seem to be under $200. And the uptake of LEDs in general has been huge... I expect LED headlights to be reasonably affordable fairly soon... PS - I totally support Heinlein's axiom, however don't confuse them with people that say "they have experts who are paid to do that"... LOL - that is such a ignorant else stupid statement!! (Maybe it was made by "experts" from other fields? That would be typical!)

burntkat wrote: Re: fogs vs projectors: Haven't done all my homework yet. What it comes down to is, I want a small, powerful fog light. Not some $25 at Walmart Blazer job, but not some $200 item, either. Preferably with a yellow tone, as to me, it gives me the best return in terms of visibility in fog.

Well, then! Allow me to repay your kindness with a little info to fascinate you whilst expanding your knowledge!! The usurious tithes collected by various agencies in association with cross-border shipping (the Cdn. government, various couriers, CanPost) are commonly & erroneously called "duty", when in fact most of the time they are taxes and/or brokerage fees. Likewise, the yellow-hued lights on the front of a vehicle are commonly & erroneously called "fog lights", when in fact that descriptor speaks to a beam pattern more than it does to a light [colour] temperature. Fog lights typically project a very wide, very shallow (top to bottom) beam pattern. Think of those street-cleaning tanker trucks that cruise around spraying water out of several nozzles. The water sprays in a pattern very similar to the light throw/pattern delivered by good quality fogs. The prevalence of yellow fog lights is mainly because they tend to be more easily visible by other drivers...as opposed to making it any easier for their owners to see by. This is by no means absolute; certainly there are people who feel that their yellow lights penetrate dense fog better than their headlights, for example. But... The other factor that is significant is the [optimal] mounting location for fog lights relative to the road surface; the lower the better. And it is that factor -- more than the colour of the lights, that contributes to that widely-held belief. Sadly, it is usually impractical to mount fog lights really close to the ground, because they are far more susceptible to damage from curbs, pavement irregularities & driveway entrances/exits. This limitation is even worse on trucks - especially 4x4's. The partial answer? Purchase good quality SMALL Lights that can be mounted low without too much housing dragging on the asphalt. And if the lights you choose have clear lenses...swap in amber bulbs! Hella used to have some pretty nice small lights that have a "FF" prefix in the p/n. They're likely still making those. Also look at PIAA.

BTW... (and please forgive me if I am rambling on about stuff you learned 25 years ago) The ideal [colour] temperature for yellow fogs is 4300K. The blue-ish HID's that many annoying people cruise around with are 8000K (approx.) and upwards of 10,000K they start to look purple.

Thanks guys- I know that fogs are wide flat beams, and honestly I don't know why I said "projector" when I meant precisely the opposite. Brainfart of the day. I also know that fogs are more a function of the light pattern than the color, color being used largely for other driver's awareness- that's the largest reason I want the fogs, although I do feel I can see better in a foggy situation with the yellowish light. I didn't realize that the lower mounting position was better for fogs. This has me thinking that it wouldn't be too difficult to mount them on my axle - bears further study! I didn't realize the Hella fogs were specified by FF prefixes- this is a great tip, as I'd love to have another set of Hellas on my truck, being immensely pleased with the 500 pencil beams (might be misspeaking here- they're a driving light, very much a "pencil" of light as opposed to the OEM assemblies)."Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it. - Robert A. Heinlein"

The layman theory is that fogs need to get under the fog - ie, fog often hovers several inches from the ground. But in any case, the higher the lights, the more that will reflect back to the driver. Hence "keep it low" with minimal upward beaming. IMO ronemca's description of a street cleaner's spray is excellent.      And IMO it is the fog light's 'spray' that is the most important; the color is secondary. (Hence my tolerance of modern cars with 'so called' fog lights despite them - technically - not being locally legal {in Aussietralia} to use in conjunction with other main beams.) But the yellow is a duality. Easier to see by others, but likewise better for illumination - especially in fog prone areas that may use yellow lane marking etc (not that white lines are good in snow either). I trust ronemca's claim that 4300K is the ideal (yellow) color for fogs - IMO that seems about right. (Hey man, that's testing my recollection of the CIE color chart etc - and that was the 1931 version! Not that I've used that since the late 1990s.) Alas when I drove competitively I did not use fog lights. Instead it was full on driving lights - in my case spots - and picking the appropriate gap between the trees to drive thru. (Rally driving by fog lights would have limited speeds to well under the 100+kph that was required for reasonable results.)

*drool* Rally racing.. NOW you're talking! I'm one of the rare Southern US men that Can. Not. Stand. that crap they call NASCAR... you want auto racing, let's drive through some twisties at 100+kph with the risk of falling off the damn mountain!"Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done, and why. Then do it. - Robert A. Heinlein"

burntkat wrote: Thanks guys < snip > I didn't realize that the lower mounting position was better for fogs. This has me thinking that it wouldn't be too difficult to mount them on my axle - bears further study!

Hmm. Methinks they would be 'WAAAY too vulnerable there...particularly since you presumably do NOT stay on nice, smooth asphalt at all times!!

burntkat wrote: I didn't realize the Hella fogs were specified by FF prefixes

Admittedly I've not looked at them for a spell, but AFAIK the "FF" prefix is NOT related to the "fog" application; I believe it's merely a model designation. Further -- and again I'm awakening long-slumbering neurons here -- the FF -series of lights are small, round-lensed lights. Ergo incapable of throwing a very flattened beam. (I was instead trying to think of small-ish, durable, decent-throwing lamps that could be outfitted to project YELLOW light for your application)

burntkat wrote: ...the 500 pencil beams (might be misspeaking here- they're a driving light, very much a "pencil" of light as opposed to the OEM assemblies)

You are correct - the 500's are not a pencil beam...although that designation is more ethereal than...say..."fog light" or "driving light"...both of which are designations that have some well-documented qualifying characteristics. I agree that the Hella 500's are excellent lights (as are the 4000x's I installed) but once you've experienced the Eagle Eye HID's you will be awestruck. NOW we're talking pencil beams!! If you could somehow freeze the beam pattern and detach it from the front end of the light you would end up with a white telephone pole about 200 feet long. And the diameter of your frozen pole would only flare slightly as it lengthened too - just like an actual telephone pole. (The beam pattern remains impressively tight even far away) It's amazing.