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2002 bmw x5 no doorlock after rs


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chriskonzen 
Member - Posts: 10
Member spacespace
Joined: December 02, 2012
Location: Iowa, United States
Posted: September 02, 2014 at 7:16 PM / IP Logged  
We encountered an issue today while installing a RS in a 2002 BMW X5.
RS: Compustar CM7200 Brain With 2WG9SP Remotes
Unlock before start,lock after start has been programmed
Bypass: DEI 556U Key In Box (Factory Windings)-Using Grey Valet Key
Everything works fine except once the engine is running the door locks do NOT function. They work until the engine is running then for some reason the door lock cylinder is immobilized. I am grabbing the ARM and DISARM wire at the Drivers Door Module in the Door. We used Blue/Red & White /Black. Is there a work around that will allow the disarm and unlock before start, as well as re-lock after start to function while the engine is running. We currently get nothing from either wire once the engine is running. We have considered using the button on the console, but are hesitant due to the nature of the flip flop-We see conflict there. Has anyone ever seen this. Can anyone offer advice?
Customer would like the alarm disarmed prior to start, the doors to be re-locked upon start, and the option to unlock the door after the engine has been started with the aftermarket remotes.
Thanks in advance, Chris
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 12:09 AM / IP Logged  
Probably a failed door module at that age. The last one I did, I ended up at the console switch.
Your wiring colours are correct.
catback 
Silver - Posts: 703
Silver spacespace
Joined: August 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 4:20 AM / IP Logged  
howie ll wrote:
Probably a failed door module at that age. The last one I did, I ended up at the console switch.
Your wiring colours are correct.
I think it's likely functioning as designed much in the same way a host of cars with factory fobs that don't work once the car is started/key in ignition.
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 4:25 AM / IP Logged  
No sir, using the valet key should remove that function. Quick test, lock from driver's door with key and hold it in the lock position. If the windows/roof don't close then the door module is faulty.
catback 
Silver - Posts: 703
Silver spacespace
Joined: August 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 5:04 AM / IP Logged  
howie ll wrote:
No sir, using the valet key should remove that function. Quick test, lock from driver's door with key and hold it in the lock position. If the windows/roof don't close then the door module is faulty.
WITH the car running...I don't see OEM logic in ensuring to allow such things from the outside when logically the driver is inside the car presumably with the key. I don't play with a host of BMW's of all eras and packages but something tells me the logic of disarming the factory alarm on a running vehicle (not equipped with factory remote start) is illogical. That and that if it were broken then it would be broken and not work regardless of if the car is running or not.
chriskonzen 
Member - Posts: 10
Member spacespace
Joined: December 02, 2012
Location: Iowa, United States
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 10:29 AM / IP Logged  
We tested the functionality of the door lock cylinder from the outside. When the engine is off and the car is on standby. The factory key fob works fine-lock,unlock,trunk. When the engine is running nothing from the key fob works. Which we would expect for obvious reasons.
When the engine is off and the car is on standby. The key in the door turned to the lock position locks all doors like you would expect. The key in the door turned to the unlock position unlocks all doors like you would expect. The keys in the door HELD to either position rolls all windows either up or down based on whether it is being turned to lock or unlock. When the engine is running nothing from the key in the door works. Which we would expect for the SAME obvious reasons.
I get all of that. My question is: Has anyone ever seem this before and if so how they overcame it. My dilemma with using the console button (Yellow/Red) is that it flip flops.
That wire is a flip flop, how do you address the fact that the door locks wont respond in sync with the button presses on the aftermarket remote. You hit lock or unlock and it responds based on what the last command was. For example if the doors are unlocked you can hit either lock or unlock on the aftermarket remotes and the vehicle will lock. Now the customer has to remember what the position of the vehicles door locks are every time. Now say the doors are locked. The customer hits lock or unlock on the aftermarket remote and the door unlock based on the premise that they were locked prior. How can a customer be expected to remember whether it was locked or unlocked a day before. This is not even mentioning the fact we would like it to unlock and re-lock after start. The sync is bound to be off at some point in operation. Advice?
catback 
Silver - Posts: 703
Silver spacespace
Joined: August 13, 2002
Location: Canada
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 11:58 AM / IP Logged  
You either design a state monitoring circuit that monitors lock state or you can 5 wire the lock motor.
I don't think the state being out of sync is a big issue if your only utilizing central lock button once remote started. Factory disarm will unlock, the RS will lock after startup, the owner will unlock to get in. Locking after pit-stopping and getting out is where I just don't know how that'd go.
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 3:55 PM / IP Logged  
Is there a key sense wire on US versions?
chriskonzen 
Member - Posts: 10
Member spacespace
Joined: December 02, 2012
Location: Iowa, United States
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 6:28 PM / IP Logged  
Howie- I read a thread about one of the ignitions acting as a key sense. In that particular thread he had mentioned using a pulse timer and a relay to engage the ignition for start then break the circuit for the lock command then re-energizing for the remaining start sequence. That option sounded like a check engine light waiting to happen. I opted against it.
Catback- The 5 wire on the door lock motor is looking like a viable option at this point. If I chose that option could I wire one door and assume all other motors would follow suit or will we have to 5 wire all doors for all doors to lock or unlock? One last side question, lets assume I chose the central door lock to operate some of the funtions, how would I differentiate the circuits with the remote start. Do I use arm and disarm while the engine is off then use a possible second set from the CM7200 to operate the central lock while its running (say rearm and another programmable circuit from the brain. How do you see that playing out in your head. My hesitation comes from the fact that our remote has a separate lock and unlock button on the aftermarket remote. The customer could hit lock or unlock and get the opposite result at any time within the vehicle. I'm just trying to entertain all options. Many thanks.
Ween 
Platinum - Posts: 1,364
Platinum spacespace
Joined: August 01, 2004
Location: Illinois, United States
Posted: September 03, 2014 at 9:22 PM / IP Logged  
Hi,
The keysense is part of the EWS immobilizer system. Are you referring to this post? https://www.the12volt.com/installbay/forum_posts.asp?tid=68414. You can test the keysense issue assuming you have two keys...leave one in the ignition cylinder (valet key perhaps) and try using the other, either manually or via remote.
Mark
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