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pac tr7 & dei 535t


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darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
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Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: October 28, 2016 at 7:33 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
Overview: I have installed this combination in my 2014 Tacoma to allow me to control all four windows using my Factory Keyless Entry. 1 DEI 535 for the Front Windows in 2-window mode, another for the Rear.
I have two PAC TR7, one tied to the 12V positive when driver door locks, programmed to look for 2 pulses in five seconds and then latch ground on the output wire for five seconds. This output is tied to the 'ground when armed' wire on the DEI 535Ts to roll up all four windows.
(LOCK TWICE CAUSES WINDOWS TO GO UP)
The second PAC TR7 is tied to the 12V positive when driver door unlocks, programmed to look for 3 pulses in five seconds and then latch ground on the output wire for five seconds. This output is tied to the 'auxiliary input' on the DEI 535Ts' to roll down all four windows.
(UNLOCK THREE CAUSES WINDOWS TO GO DOWN)
Problem: Occasionally the Roll Down function does not work.
After some troubleshooting, it appears sometimes there is just enough voltage being detected on the "ground" side of the motor during the unlock operation to trigger the first TR7(LOCK) which disables the roll down features and in fact, triggers a roll up.
Questions:
Can I use a resistor between the locking 12V on the door lock and the TR7 to reduce that voltage? If so, what value would I be going for? The TR7 is sensitve to as little as .8V so I need to get it below that.
Is there something else to consider? Other options? Are the TR7 just no good for this? No good period? I've considered using a relay to break the connection between the 12V LOCK and the TR7 during unlock but this feels like overkill.
If I cannot solve this, the solution will be to remove one of the TR7 and choose a direction to automate.
Thanks in advance!!!!!
-Rob
KPierson 
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Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: October 28, 2016 at 8:48 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote KPierson
I'm wondering if you are actually triggering the "up" TR7 before triggering the "down" TR7. Door lock actuators can be rather noisy, electronically and it's possible that the TR7 on the "lock" side is occasionally picking up signals from the "unlock" operation.
Have you tried recreating the problem with the windows half way down? If my theory is correct when the windows are supposed to go down, but don't, they will go all the way up.
I'm not familiar with the circuity on the TR7 but have worked with some other door lock hardware and it worked best with a very high resistance inline with a transistor. I would assume the TR7 has a transistorized input but I have no idea what kind of inline resistor there is. You can play around and I would start with around 1 meg.
Also, you mentioned something about the "ground" side of the motor. I would not reference the motor for ground at all. I am not sure if that was a mistake or if you actually meant it. The ground should be grounded to a solid ground point and the + input should go the "LOCK" and "UNLOCK" wires respectively.
Kevin Pierson
darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
Member spacespace
Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: October 28, 2016 at 9:00 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
Aloha,
Thanks for your reply. Some responses in line.
KPierson wrote:
I'm wondering if you are actually triggering the "up" TR7 before triggering the "down" TR7. Door lock actuators can be rather noisy, electronically and it's possible that the TR7 on the "lock" side is occasionally picking up signals from the "unlock" operation.
This is exactly what is happening, I didn't do a good job explaining it.
KPierson wrote:
You can play around and I would start with around 1 meg.   
I assume this is one megohm ?   
KPierson wrote:
Also, you mentioned something about the "ground" side of the motor. I would not reference the motor for ground at all. I am not sure if that was a mistake or if you actually meant it. The ground should be grounded to a solid ground point and the + input should go the "LOCK" and "UNLOCK" wires respectively.
Not a mistake. I am using the two wires going to the motor as my trigger for each TR7. There for the (+) wire for lock becomes the (-) wire for an unlock operation. My meter shows some small voltage off the (-) wire during each operation. This is triggering the lock operation.
Hope that makes sense and thanks again.
darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
Member spacespace
Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: October 28, 2016 at 9:03 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
And, No, i am not using the ground of the motor for my circuit. All the grounds are running to a dedicated location behind the kick panel. Thanks!
darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
Member spacespace
Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: October 29, 2016 at 7:30 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
An electrician friend of mind suggested using a 100 Ohm Ceramic resistor inline between the motor lock (+) and the TR7. I actually had one lying around and so far, it seems to have worked. The resistor did not affect the reading on my voltmeter, but according to my friend, it reduces "noise" on the circuit that may have caused the false triggers on the TR7.
Thanks,
Rob
darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
Member spacespace
Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: October 29, 2016 at 8:49 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
Nope. That didn't last. Still seeking recommendations
geepherder 
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Posted: October 30, 2016 at 10:32 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote geepherder
Why not use 2 relays- one for lock, one for unlock?
My ex once told me I have a perfect face for radio.
KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: November 07, 2016 at 11:47 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote KPierson
100 ohms isn't enough, like I said try a 1 meg (1 megaohm, 1,000,000 ohms) resistor. The high resistance will filter out most, if not all, of the noise and only allow the high voltages to trigger.
When using a transistorized input circuit to detect door lock pulses I used to use a 10K resistor. However, sometimes noise would cause undesirable operation. I am currently using 1.5meg and haven't had any issues with noise since I made the switch.
Kevin Pierson
darobman 
Member - Posts: 9
Member spacespace
Joined: October 28, 2016
Posted: November 08, 2016 at 12:53 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote darobman
Thanks again for your suggestions. So yes, 100 ohm was not enough. We had a 5000 ohm resistor lying around and that has cured the missed roll down symptom but sometimes it wont roll up. I suspect 5K is too much resistance. Not to contradict your suggestion but I cant see 1 Megaohm being better but i'm not expert.
geepherder 
Platinum - Posts: 3,668
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: October 27, 2003
Posted: November 09, 2016 at 12:06 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote geepherder
I still think 2 relays (with flyback diodes installed) would do the trick.
Connect one relay's coil terminal (85/86) to the wire that goes positive on lock, and ground the remaining coil terminal. Don't forget to install the flyback diode across the coil. Now connect terminal 30 to a fused 12 volts, and terminal 87 to the lock input of your TR7.
Do the same for the unlock wire.
My ex once told me I have a perfect face for radio.
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