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disabling through antenna


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tonto26 
Member - Posts: 41
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Joined: July 23, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: November 20, 2003 at 5:26 PM / IP Logged  
I was informed that theives can disable an alarm by using a jumper box, and running 12 volts through the cars antenna. If this is true, then how can it be prevented?
auex 
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Joined: December 23, 2002
Location: Arizona, United States
Posted: November 20, 2003 at 5:35 PM / IP Logged  
Haha, that sounds like a good way to do nothing. Even if they grounded the battery that they were using to "spike" the antenna with to the frame of the car, all it would do at most is blow out the tuner in the radio.
Certified Security Specialist
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tonto26 
Member - Posts: 41
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Joined: July 23, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: November 20, 2003 at 11:04 PM / IP Logged  
I was wondering, because even though it seemed like a ridiculous idea, i thought it might be possible that it would end up sending voltage to the accessories of the car, causing the alarm to think it was running. As a safeguard I thought of maybe adding a diode to the accesory input of the alarm.
auex 
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Posted: November 20, 2003 at 11:06 PM / IP Logged  
Don't even worry about it, it can't do anything. Like I said the most it will do is blow the tuner section of the radio. Also even if it did send power to the accessories, and it won't, that will not help the thief disable the alarm.
Certified Security Specialist
Always check info with a digital multimeter.
I promise to be good.
Tell Darwin I sent you.
I've been sick lately, sorry I won't be on much.
Teken 
Gold - Posts: 1,492
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Joined: August 04, 2002
Location: Aruba
Posted: November 20, 2003 at 11:40 PM / IP Logged  
Tonto26,
These are my thoughts and suggestions to your fears. I will not tell you exactly what area's of the vehicle need to be addressed, but will offer a few things you should incorporate into your system, if you want to be protected from these sort of threats.
These simple techniques will protect the alarm system, and those compoents that you require to be a deterrent.
The feed-back I am giving you is based on many years as a professional REPO man. Every alarm system I have encountered in 10 plus years all exhibit the same faults and no installer from California to New York has ever addressed these in a day to day installation.
Only those who I have spoken with, or shared information via forums such as these have had more chance of me not disabling their system in under 60 seconds.
This isnt an guarantee, that it wont be taken. If it takes us more than 3 minutes to deactivate the system from the time we say go.
I just simply tow it...
1) All outputs from the alarm CPU which interact with the vehicle system(s) should be fused. Stepped fusing is ideal.
2) Shunt isolated / voltage regulated power supplies powering the alarm will provide stable, and secure power source.
3) An isolated ground plane, also known as a floating ground. Will prevent ground loops, and feed-back.
4) Ferrite core beads placed onto critical wiring will reduce RFI interuptions.
5) A direct secndary *chassis* ground strap, that you see on most rear end of the vehicle's or similar placement will ensure a steady ground plane, and bleed off residue static discharge.
6) A powered back-up siren is a must, assuming any of the above is not in use. To provide a last line of defense, in alerting you or others of an attack.
7) As a last line of defense to a alarm failure, and to protect the vehicle from being taken (not from being towed though) is to ensure you have physical devices that are engine, fuel, ECU, etc switches / fuse(s) that must be activated to operate the vehicle.
Regards
EVIL Teken . . .
atomsite 
Member - Posts: 36
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Joined: November 13, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: November 21, 2003 at 8:54 AM / IP Logged  

Perhaps some transient protection could be added to the antenna cable. i.e. Gas discharge tube, thyristor, Metal-Oxide Varistor, etc

Theoretically a high voltage spike could propagate through the 12 volt power bus via the radio. However I would think that would fry the vehicle electronics as well. Making it somewhat difficult to start. Obviously you want to fry the alarm electronics and not the vehicle.

I would think the easiest direct access to the alarm would be via the parking lights. These are typically connected to the alarm for the blinking light affect. Again you would want to apply just enough of a surge/spike to take out the alarm and nothing else. Perhaps the alarms are already internally protected. Who knows because the manufacturer rarely gives out any usable specs.

atomsite 
Member - Posts: 36
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Joined: November 13, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: November 21, 2003 at 8:57 AM / IP Logged  
I doubt if 12 volts into the antenna would do anything. I was hypothesizing a high voltage surge into the antenna.
1kewlexpo 
Member - Posts: 33
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Joined: November 21, 2003
Posted: November 21, 2003 at 9:29 AM / IP Logged  

A stun gun can shock the entire vehicle and disable the alarm system and mess up most of the vehicle's circuitry.  It will disable the car and will be immobilized.  This will enable the thieves to get in the vehicle and steal what they want including your wheels.  They can't start it since most of the fuses are blown. But, they can steal parts of the car. A backup battery or siren doesn't help with this matter.

John

derek123 
Copper - Posts: 163
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Joined: October 09, 2003
Location: Canada
Posted: November 21, 2003 at 11:32 AM / IP Logged  

not mentioning any names, but there are a few alarms that can disabled the way you mention.

atomsite 
Member - Posts: 36
Member spacespace
Joined: November 13, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: November 21, 2003 at 4:04 PM / IP Logged  

If they blow up the electronics at least they won't get the vehicle. Chances are it'll be an expensive repair though. You could isolate the alarm system from the rest of the vehicle electronics. (i.e. DC-DC converters, opto-isolators, relays, etc.) Then add in some transient protection. That would require some work though.

I suppose a simple relay to control the parking lights would isolate the alarm. I only mention the parking lights because they are easily accessible. Theoretically you could do it on any of the inputs. However you would have to trip the alarm to access them.

That's why I like those pager style alarms. You know right away if your vehicle is being violated.

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