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Subs w/magnet out, Reverse Polarity?


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MBZ oe 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 2:52 PM / IP Logged  

>>The logic that the loudspeaker somehow "fires" into out out of the enclosure is faulty.<<

So when a sub is hooked up and mounted  normally, is if firing inwards into the enclosure or outwards?

boom, boom, boom boom....
DYohn 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 3:43 PM / IP Logged  
It is not "firing" in any particular direction.  The cone moves backwards and forwards with equal intensity.  The cone movement pressurizes and depressurizes both the airspace inside the listening environment and inside the enclosure.  It uses the airspace inside the enclosure mainly to dampen cone movement.  This keeps the speaker from overdriving and provides certain acoustic performance enhancements depending on the volume of air in the enclosure and whether is is sealed (relying exclusively on pressure wave transmission) or vented (adding the effect of soundwave transmission but reducing dampening and power handling.)  But I digress: at a very basic level it does not matter which way your sub faces or which way the wiring is connected, except as it relates to the electrical and acoustic phase of the system.  The speaker itself does not care.
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xtreamcc 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 4:52 PM / IP Logged  
thats what I thought, I couldn't understand how mounting a sub inverted without using reverse polarity could possibly cause any negative effects what so ever without there being phase issues caused by one sub in and one sub out.
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94legend 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 5:07 PM / IP Logged  

We've never did any kind of reversing the the subs which the back was facing out of the box in any customers trunk, But from reading all of these posts.

So it does not matter which way you face your sub, the wiring is still the same. Using reverse polarity, only if there is a phase issue.

ANeonRider 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 5:12 PM / IP Logged  
What I usually do is listen for a cpl hours with one polarity, then change polarity and listen to it again for a while. I then go with whatever sounds better.
MBZ oe 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 5:23 PM / IP Logged  

In my case, it sounds better with the speaker wires hooked up in the normal fashion.   These subs are just upside down right now for "fun". Just playing around with stuff until my new subs get here. If I had unlimited trunk space then I would build a box to mount them upside down, just because I think it looks cool. It does sound about the same though.

BTW, I saw a really nice plexiglass trunk enclosure that housed 1 13"JL7 up under the rear deck this weekend. Man that setup was nice! Must have had $$$ to burn. $30grand+ he said. It was definitely top notch SQ but hit some major SPL as well. Wish I would've had a camera. It was in a newer Brabus S500 FYI.

boom, boom, boom boom....
stevdart 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 7:42 PM / IP Logged  

94Legend, I remember a post you put up about a three-sub system with one sub in reverse.  Remember it?  That is a case wher you have to be certain that the inverted sub is connected in reverse of the other normally mounted subs.  Other than that, one can switch the wires to the amp all he wants, and one should actually always try it out, too, to see which phase sounds best from inside the car.  I just recently switched my sub amp to 180 using the switch, and it seems the bass is a little better that way.

And DYohn, please feel free to digress all you want.  When you talk, I (among others) am getting an education!    :)

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Alpine Guy 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 8:02 PM / IP Logged  

Huh, , whell, , i now know not to post after fiberglassing without a mask, wowa haha  My post didn't  make any sence at all, lol

Im just gona run 2 experiments by you and maybe you can tell me why they act the way they do.

#1  I put 2 woofers in a single chambered box, 1 woofer was connected + to +and - to -, and the other + to - and - to +, , the result was very little noise at all, ,but a whole lota movement, , when i hooked them both up properly the cone travel was greatly reduced, yet the volume was alot louder.         So you telling me polarity has nothing to do with anything there?

#2 I put the same 2 woofers in a sealed box with 2 separated chambers, wired them normally + to +, - to - on both woofers  and it was loud, , then i reversed the polarity on both woofers and played them again, the volume decreased by 1/4, and i could hear a humming.

All tests were done with my cda-9835, and 40 50 and a 60 hz test tone , mrp-t130, 2 8" fleemarket subs.

Experiment #1 is probably very whell cancelation because of lack of sound, but it dosn't explain the excessive movement when 1 sub was normal, and 1 was reverse polarity, but little movement when all is normal.

Experimant#2 i'll leave for your comments

im always game for learning, ,the more knowledge the better, if i am wrong, please correct me so i don't mislead anyone on this topic again.

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stevdart 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 8:24 PM / IP Logged  

My take on number 1:  If you had two woofers firing the same in an enclosure that was the proper size for the two drivers, they would each compress air in the box when the cones moved inward, and the compression would dissipate while the cones moved outward.  In this test you reversed one of the subs, and they shared the same enclosure.  Now, only one sub is compressing inside while the other is moving outward.  Result is little sound.  The extra movement you saw is due to the lack of damping action on the subs and too much air space.  The air space is twice what one sub would use, but with them firing at 180 degrees, only one sub is compressing the air at a time, while the other sub is decompressing.  Flappy cones is the result.  Proves that a great degree of cone movement does not necessarily result in loud sound, and in this case is caused by the improper air space in the box.

Test two indicated that the subs sounded better in one phase than the other.  Which is what we want to do anyway when it comes to subwoofer frequencies:  see which way sounds better.  The hum you heard is an anomoly, it shouldn't be there.  No answer for that.

Build the box so that it performs well in the worst case scenario and, in return, it will reward you at all times.
Alpine Guy 
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Posted: August 09, 2004 at 8:44 PM / IP Logged  

stevdart wrote:
 In this test you reversed one of the subs, and they shared the same enclosure.  Now, only one sub is compressing inside while the other is moving outward.  Result is little sound.  The extra movement you saw is due to the lack of damping action on the subs and too much air space.  The air space is twice what one sub would use, but with them firing at 180 degrees, only one sub is compressing the air at a time, while the other sub is decompressing. 

That the exact answer i was looking forward to hearing to prove my point the reverseing polarity does infact change the signal to the woofer.  Obviously if polarity did not matter like was stated before, y would the woofers act differently?????

Is there something im missing, , or am i right?

Thank you Stevdart!

2003 Chevy Avalanche,Eclipse CD7000,Morel Elate 5,Adire Extremis,Alpine PDX-4.150, 15" TC-3000, 2 Alpine PDX-1.1000, 470Amp HO Alt.
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