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Fiberglassing to Plastic


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bigpete123 
Member - Posts: 23
Member spacespace
Joined: February 09, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: May 31, 2006 at 11:47 PM / IP Logged  

Hello.

I know this topic has been covered a lot.  Please hear me out since I have read every thread that I could find on the subject.  It seems like the only real viable solution to the problem of fiberglassing over plastic is to drill many small holes in the panel, etc etc.

Here's what I'm doing.  I would like to install 6" Focal speakers in the lower sections of my doors where the map basket is (as close to the hinges as possible).  Here's a picture of my door to give you an idea:

Fiberglassing to Plastic -- posted image.

The speakers are quite a bit deeper than the map basket, so I need to build it out a bit.  I also want it to have a factory look.  In other words, just gluing the rings in place with dowels and stretching fleece over it isn't what I want to do.  I want to use a combination of hardboard and fiberglass to keep the thing has angular-looking as possible.  But I want to use the factory mounting locations of that map pocket.

So what I want to do is cut out that panel so that only the edges are left.  Then I want to use the dowel method to attach the pieces of hardboard what will be cut to the proper shape and size.  The hardboard will replace the section that I cut out of the plastic panel, but the dowels will hold the hardboard a few inches farther away from the door that the orginal panel was (i.e. the panel will be deeper).  So obviously there will be gaps between the hardboard and the remaining plastic pieces of the OEM panel.  The wood will then be connected to the remaining factory plastic panel via fleece and fiberglass.  So now that I've described my plans, here's the question (sorry, that took me a while, but I want to be clear about what I'm planning):

Since fiberglass resin likes fleece, and fleece can be glued to plastic, couldn't I just use some adhesive to glue fleece material to the plastic and then use the same old fiberglass application process?  In other words, the fleece would be the "middle man" between the plastic and the fiberglass.  Will this work?  If not, please propose other solutions!  I've never done fiberglass, but I'm a quick learner and I've done TONS of research on the subject.

Thanks guys!

Peter

bigpete123 
Member - Posts: 23
Member spacespace
Joined: February 09, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: May 31, 2006 at 11:56 PM / IP Logged  

Okay, I re-read what I wrote and I just want to make it crystal clear what I'm talking about.  It's hard to describe without drawings, so here's my classy attempt in Paint.  The red stuff is what I will build out of wood.  The gaps will be covered via the fleece thing.  Okay, I'm done talking.

Fiberglassing to Plastic -- posted image.

djfearny2 
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Joined: September 23, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 1:28 PM / IP Logged  
resin does not stick to plastic well. you would have to drill holes in the plastic to create plastic rivets. so you can rap the item in fleese and use a layup adheasive which will keep its stick in the presence of resin which makes most glue loose its adhesive properties. than spray the layup adhesiveon the pannel attached the fleese to the panel as well as drill like 1/4 holes through the plastic peice behind the pod your making and tape the back side so it fills up hols and make sure you saturate fleese so it drips to plastic and fills holes underneath so it will be solid. like i said you creating like rivets in the plastic. because if plastic is bent the resin will peel off.
Jon
Installer/Help Technician
---coral springs florida---
mecp certification is not always needed. I have it and it has not helped me out at all. my experience out shines it.
bigpete123 
Member - Posts: 23
Member spacespace
Joined: February 09, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 4:07 PM / IP Logged  

Thanks for your reply!  I'm not sure I followed all of that.  I'm going to try and repeat the steps in order.  Tell me if I have it right:

1) Drill small holes in the plastic

2) Tape the backside of the panel so that the resin will accumulate and harden (i.e. so that it won't drip through and so that it will pool up at the bottom of the hole forming "rivets")

3) Drip fiberglass resin into the holes to make sure they fill

4) Apply layup adhesive to the outside of the plastic panel

5) Stretch the fleece over the plastic (where the layup adhesive is)

6) Saturate the crap out of the fleece with resin so that it "connects" and adheres to the resin in the holes

7) carry on with regular FG layup procedures.

Is that how it goes?  Do you have an example of a layup adhesive?

Thanks!

xclusivecustoms 
Member - Posts: 24
Member spacespace
Joined: February 13, 2005
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 8:57 PM / IP Logged  
You need to put fiberglass on the backside of the 'rivets' as well, otherwise they will tend to break easily. I also prefer to use a thickening agent in that particular application so that resin is not the only thing holding the pod on the door.
xclusivecustomsinc.com
djfearny2 
Silver - Posts: 810
Silver spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: September 23, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 9:03 PM / IP Logged  
yes thats right pretty much but as customs said to build up resin for rivets behind . when you put tape on allow a small pocket just beneath hole so a small pool can for creating a backing. and you can use a product like cabasil available at some boat places or from selectproducts.com
Jon
Installer/Help Technician
---coral springs florida---
mecp certification is not always needed. I have it and it has not helped me out at all. my experience out shines it.
bigpete123 
Member - Posts: 23
Member spacespace
Joined: February 09, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 9:23 PM / IP Logged  

Thanks a lot guys.  I'm assuming cabasil is the layup adhesive, right?  And what is an example of a thickening agent?  Sorry for all of the questions, but this chemistry/chemical stuff really throws me off!

xclusivecustoms 
Member - Posts: 24
Member spacespace
Joined: February 13, 2005
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 9:33 PM / IP Logged  
Cabosil is a thickening agent. Mix it in carefully and let it set for 15 minutes before adding your catalist.
xclusivecustomsinc.com
bigpete123 
Member - Posts: 23
Member spacespace
Joined: February 09, 2006
Location: United States
Posted: June 01, 2006 at 11:47 PM / IP Logged  

Great, thanks.  I only have one more question...  What is a layup adhesive or some other example of a glue that won't lose it's adhesion properties when it comes in contact with FG resin?


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