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increasing alternator output voltage?


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bigjohnny 
Copper - Posts: 293
Copper spacespace
Joined: September 23, 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 7:24 AM / IP Logged  
so Missing Link Audio makes a module that increases the output voltage of your alternator. I never bothered questioning this until someone on another board made one much that same that does the same thing.
Well MLA isn't going to give away any trade secrets and the guy who made one of his own won't share with others how it's built..... it's certainly no damn secret and I'm sure the info can be found on the net.
Well I'd like to save $200 and build one myself also.
How do these modules work, what do they do to make a higher output voltage, and where can one find the needed information to construct one of these units? Where do I need to look, what do I need to know?
(Yes I know there needs to be other batteries and such needed because you don't want to bump up the cars running voltage..... i'm only concerned with the construction of said units)
ckeeler 
Gold - Posts: 1,461
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Joined: June 20, 2008
Location: New Mexico, United States
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 9:05 AM / IP Logged  
what your talking about does not increase the current output of the alternator, only the voltage at which it charges. seems like a bad idea and i dont really see too much benefit for doing so. why would you want to increase the charge voltage to more than 14.4-15 volts?
alaisneo 
Member - Posts: 27
Member spacespace
Joined: May 18, 2009
Location: New York, United States
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 10:01 AM / IP Logged  
Yea I would only do that if your amp was unregulated and you could put what you want to it...other than that don't bother....what did you have in mind anyways?
I love sound
bigjohnny 
Copper - Posts: 293
Copper spacespace
Joined: September 23, 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 10:40 AM / IP Logged  

I'm talking about voltage(NOT current/amperage), and not into getting into a huge discussion as to why you want the output voltage higher... I'm wanting to know HOW it is done.

People are running there alts at a 15V+ charging voltage for seperate battery banks, and to feed more power to unregulated amps...... This stuff I know, I just want to know How its done, and how to build one.

I'm not even concerned with having one tbh cause my car couldn't run it right now... only one alt, and only one battery......

this is nothing more than a how do I do it thread.... simply for the sake of knowing, i want to know how to build one of my own.

at some point i will run more batteries, and I do believe my amp is unregulated so I could feed it more voltage.

KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 5:28 PM / IP Logged  

There are multiple ways to do it, just keep in mind that there is no such thing as "free power".  If you raise the voltage, it will pull more current from the alternator to allow for the increase in voltage.

Without doing any research at all, the "easiest" way would be to take the current voltage that is being outputted, oscilate it at a fairly high frequency (the higher the better most likely) and then run it through a custom wound transformer.  On the secondary side run a full wave rectifier  to convert it back to DC.

The key here is to use a high enough frequency that the transformer doesn't have to be outragiously big.  The higher the switching frequency (at least to a point) in to a transformer the more efficient it will be at creating power.

If I were going to build something like this I would do a lot of research in to switch mode power supplies and transformerless designs in general to try and eliminate the conversion from DC to AC back to DC.  I'm not 100% sure it can be done (I've never got too big in to power supplies) but it wouldn't take much research to prove or disprove the option.

Kevin Pierson
KPierson 
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 5:31 PM / IP Logged  
OK, I just looked in to the module you mentioned and what they are doing isn't exactly what I was describing.  It appears they are somehow manipulating the regulator on the alternators.  They don't make just one module for all cars, they make vehicle specific modules.  They talk about "adjusting charging curves" so I would assume they are adjusting the on/off duty cycle of the unit.  This is just a guess though.
Kevin Pierson
i am an idiot 
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Joined: September 21, 2006
Location: Louisiana, United States
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 5:38 PM / IP Logged  

I am not sure about the MLA piece, but a customer of ours has an alternator with an adjustable voltage regulator.  It will charge from 12 to 18 volts.  As far as I know it is an aftermarket alternator.  He has 3 alternators on his vehicle.  One for the 12 volt battery and 2 that are for the 16 volt batteries for the system.

I have no idea why you are wanting to do this, nor do I want to know.  If your amp does not have a regulated power supply, it will produce more rail voltage with the increased input voltage.  If the amp has rail voltage of plus and minus 48 volts with 14.4 in, the manufacturer is not going to spend the extra money on 63 volt capacitors and 150 volt output devices.  They will use 50 v caps and 100 v outputs.  When you increase the input voltage, the rail voltage will increase also.  So if you are using this in this manner, you really need to measure the rail voltage of the amp and check the caps to make sure that they are not already running on the edge.  Also give me the part number on the output devices.  They may all have the same number on them, or they may have 2 different numbers.

I hate it when the question gets answered while I am typing.   

bigjohnny 
Copper - Posts: 293
Copper spacespace
Joined: September 23, 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posted: May 20, 2009 at 6:59 PM / IP Logged  
i am an idiot wrote:

I am not sure about the MLA piece, but a customer of ours has an alternator with an adjustable voltage regulator.  It will charge from 12 to 18 volts.  As far as I know it is an aftermarket alternator.  He has 3 alternators on his vehicle.  One for the 12 volt battery and 2 that are for the 16 volt batteries for the system.

I have no idea why you are wanting to do this, nor do I want to know.  If your amp does not have a regulated power supply, it will produce more rail voltage with the increased input voltage.  If the amp has rail voltage of plus and minus 48 volts with 14.4 in, the manufacturer is not going to spend the extra money on 63 volt capacitors and 150 volt output devices.  They will use 50 v caps and 100 v outputs.  When you increase the input voltage, the rail voltage will increase also.  So if you are using this in this manner, you really need to measure the rail voltage of the amp and check the caps to make sure that they are not already running on the edge.  Also give me the part number on the output devices.  They may all have the same number on them, or they may have 2 different numbers.

I hate it when the question gets answered while I am typing.    

Like I said I'm not so much interested in actually doing this for use on my car, but I want to know how to build one. I can do the research and what not I just need to know where to look or what I'm looking for.
I would like to know how someone has built one of these on their own without having to spend $200 on an MLA module. It started a big thing because he didn't share the design cause he didn't want to take business from MLA..... but the way he posted it I felt he was just outright bragging for the sake of being a dick.... anyway its irrelevant here, it just got me curious as to how he did it.
I would like to learn how to build one myself so that I may share the design with others, without ripping off someone else, or simply using diodes to trick the alt.
the alternator with the adjustable voltage is most likely a Mechman alternator, that guy does some cool doodie, and if I'd had the money at the time I would have bought one of his.

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