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two pair of tweeters

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yardy1980 
Member - Posts: 40
Member spacespace
Joined: December 06, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: March 21, 2007 at 3:27 AM / IP Logged  

Im currently switching out my system again and im installing the kicker RS65.2 6.5" series up front.   I already my little triangle window  piece modded with glass to house some clarions.  The kicker tweeter are way too deep and big to fit  so i wanted to know if it would be overkill to leave them there and also install the kickers with the tweeters either in my kick pannels   angling up  or just leave them ion the center of the speaker.    Would that be too much highs.  And if not, can i use the kicker crossover for both?   thanks

gary

haemphyst 
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Platinum spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Electrical Theory. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Audio and Video. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: January 19, 2003
Location: Michigan, Bouvet Island
Posted: March 21, 2007 at 10:28 AM / IP Logged  
Yeah... No, I wouldn't do that... Pick one tweeter, and use it. Tweeters are the ONE driver you don't want more than one of, close to each other... The comb filtering can be HORRENDOUS. Not to mention how WAY overly bright it'll be. The Kicker stuff isn't exactly "high fidelity", (in this reporters eyes) and they'll need all the help they can get. Placement is important, and (also in a generally accepted opinion) the sails are a VERY bad spot to install your tweeters in the firat place - too far away from the mid-bass. They need to go as close to each other as you can possibly place them.
If you are bent on using them both, you'll have to use a dedicated crossover for the second tweeter; you CAN'T use multiple drivers on a passive crossover system without drastically altering the crossover points and slopes.
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
coppellstereo 
Silver - Posts: 785
Silver spacespace
Joined: November 21, 2005
Location: United States
Posted: March 21, 2007 at 11:54 AM / IP Logged  
what is 'comb filtering' in tweeter applications? I've heard of it in televisions.
loosingmymind 
Copper - Posts: 103
Copper spacespace
Joined: August 24, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: March 22, 2007 at 9:47 PM / IP Logged  

Kenwood has a set that have a bulb in the crossover that (for a lack of better word) eats the distortion.  For my money it's the MA Audio tweets, or the RE Audio tweets for excelent sound. If you've not got much dough; don't laugh but the Boss tw-17 is a super sounding tweet for $20.

Dave

haemphyst 
Platinum - Posts: 5,054
Platinum spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Electrical Theory. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Audio and Video. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: January 19, 2003
Location: Michigan, Bouvet Island
Posted: March 22, 2007 at 11:20 PM / IP Logged  
loosingmymind wrote:

Kenwood has a set that have a bulb in the crossover that (for a lack of better word) eats the distortion.  For my money it's the MA Audio tweets, or the RE Audio tweets for excelent sound. If you've not got much dough; don't laugh but the Boss tw-17 is a super sounding tweet for $20.

Dave
1: The lightbulb, just like every other wire, increases in resistance as it heats up. This is a passive protection for the tweeter, the distortion still gets through. There is no "eating of distortion"...
2: If you think those are good sounding tweeters (any one of them), you've never heard good sounding tweeters. Ever. Overly bright, and WAAAAY peaky response... For 17 dollars each, you can have a good sounding tweeter in these... For two dollars more than your Boss suggestion, a TRULY good sounding tweeter that would WALK any of the others you listed, try this one...
While the cheap tweeter will never be considered "world class" those are far and away better products than you listed. I agree you don't have to spend incredible amounts of money, but those that you named are FAR overpriced for the quality of the sound you actually get out of them. I think you should listen to some of the other products in the Vifa line as well.
(Brutal truth time is over now... Sorry.)
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
loosingmymind 
Copper - Posts: 103
Copper spacespace
Joined: August 24, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: March 22, 2007 at 11:36 PM / IP Logged  

Wow. Ok. Well i'm only going on what i've heard and used. I'm not very good at the technical side of some things. Although I am very receptive to the "Brutal Truth"; and take it in as knowledge gained.

However, I think that "good sounding tweeter" is entirely a matter of personal taste and my opinions are based on nothing more.

Still support the tw-17!!! two pair of tweeters -- posted image.

David Fancher
USACi World Finals 2006
4th Place SQ PRO 601+
haemphyst 
Platinum - Posts: 5,054
Platinum spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Electrical Theory. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Audio and Video. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: January 19, 2003
Location: Michigan, Bouvet Island
Posted: March 23, 2007 at 9:26 AM / IP Logged  
What time WAS it when I posted that last night?!? Jeez, Dave.
OK, firstly, let me apologize... That's not like me, usually. I was attempting nothing more than constructive criticism, and I was apparently VERY tired, or wized at the wife, and I was taking it out on you. two pair of tweeters -- posted image.
You are absolutely right, and as I have always claimed, sound is a completely suggestive thing - what sounds good to me might not necessarily sound good to you. One of the things we try to encourage here is openmindedness and helpfulness... not opinion bashing.
So, re-read that post above, and translate it however you'd like, but filter out the venom, OK? Again... my apologies.
I might also mention (hopefully in a nicer tone) that the passive light-bulb protection in tweeter circuits is a very non-audiophile method of protection. A non-linear resistance curve is introduced to the wire, and this will affect the overall output of the tweeter in non-linear ways, not good... I personally try to avoid this type of "protection" circuitry. The light-bulb IS an effective method of protection, but I just like relays, or even better, a soft-clip circuit in the amplifier.
It all reminds me of something that Molière once said to Guy de Maupassant at a café in Vienna: "That's nice. You should write it down."
loosingmymind 
Copper - Posts: 103
Copper spacespace
Joined: August 24, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: March 23, 2007 at 9:43 PM / IP Logged  

Haemphyst; it's cool man. No worries. Didn't offend me; promise. Just shocked a little. I appreciate honesty! It's the only way to go.

I guess it's just that I work at a shop that is a retail store not directed totally at car audio. So most of my brands are mid to upper-mid line stuff. I build systems for the blue-collar mississippi boy. I've had to make decent quality stuff sound good enuff for the not-so-picky ear. But, i'm picky. See my dilema.

And i'll probably ber flogged to death here for saying this: But, I think it's not entirelly how popular or advanced the product is that makes a system sound good. I mean, I did pretty good this year in Kansas City  with a car full of nothing but entry level Sony product. The guy cady-cornered to me set up his sound with a lap-top for hours and hours. Stuff I don't know how to use. He left with a handshake.

I invite debate, and hope to learn something here. I think this site is an awesome tool for people who love to do what I love to do. If I say something that requires a whiplash ; hit me with it.  But your cool with me bra.

Dave

David Fancher
USACi World Finals 2006
4th Place SQ PRO 601+
loosingmymind 
Copper - Posts: 103
Copper spacespace
Joined: August 24, 2004
Location: United States
Posted: March 23, 2007 at 9:45 PM / IP Logged  

Hope everybody's advice helped you yardy1980! Sorry to get off topic man.

Dave

David Fancher
USACi World Finals 2006
4th Place SQ PRO 601+

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