the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer
icon

2001 marquis headlights


Post ReplyPost New Topic
< Prev Topic Next Topic >
bostoncab 
Member - Posts: 4
Member spacespace
Joined: February 04, 2013
Posted: February 04, 2013 at 11:53 PM / IP Logged  
So I have a 2001 Mercury Marquis with 185,000 miles. Overall condition for the miles is good. The car is a taxi and I need to keep it running as well as possible for as cheap a price as possible until August.
The issue I am having now is
1) With the key turned all the way back towards you everything works fine. Headlights,running lights,interior and dash lights all work fine.
2) With the key turned to run or when the car is started none of the above works. No headlights. No running lights. No interior lights. No dash lights.
I have had a few people look at it and they are all saying the problem is the lighting control module. The module is sold re-manufactured by a1 cardone for $177 + $45 core. This is pricey and no stores locally have the part in stock at all. My last chance is a Ford dealer who has to order it or get it out of the junkyard and the only one locally who has it wants $150 for it with a 7 day guarantee. LOL NOTHANKSBRO!
So this is why I am here. It would be super swell to have interior and dash lights but I dont NEED them. The blinkers brake lights and any other IMPORTANT indicators I have not mentioned currently work fine with no problems.
Here is what i want to do I want to run power through a switch on the dash from the battery to the headlights and running lights. I need you guys to PLEASE help me by telling me what color wires in what approximate location of the body of the car I should be able to splice into to get these important systems working. I need a car that can run 24 hours a day not just in daylight hours.
Also if there is some insane reason why this wouldn't work and stay working for a couple of months that I am not aware of please make me aware of this? I need to get this working for the less than $50 wire,switch (s) will cost.
I am told the following diagram is for my car. I do not understand how to read this.
2001 marquis headlights -- posted image.
oldspark 
Gold - Posts: 4,913
Gold spacespace
Joined: November 03, 2008
Location: Australia
Posted: February 06, 2013 at 4:13 AM / IP Logged  
Fues #6 (15A) thru RED / YEllow to LCM (connector L2026?) pin #9... (I'm assuming different connectors as another pin/terminal #9 (L2029) is GND.)
However I suspect it is merely a worn or dirty contact in the IGN keyswitch since (1) they are known to wear, and (2) why would it work in the ACC position? (IE, it should still be connected when in the IGN position. IOW, ACC contact in the IGN position is worn out or dirty.)
The latter is dependent on how the LCM's internal logic has been designed, but such designs are usualy quite simple and primitive, especially in American cars (and French and ...).
(Hence...) Without assessing in great detail nor having specific knowledge, I would expect any competent mechanic or automotive electrician to check the IGN switch first, especially if they are relatively cheap. Of course they should be able to determine if that switch requires replacing BEFORE getting a new switch - I guess I'm merely advising non-testing trial-&-error DIY repairers.
And the LCM should be easy to test in principle.
Simulate the terminal #1 & #9 power with one or two 15A fused wires from the battery +12V.
Connect #1 and it should behave as you currently describe (ie, in ACC position). (Noting that #1 should still be +12V in IGN/RUN position. I suspect this is the power that is cutting out in IGN - it should only drop out in the START position.)
Then bridge from #1 to #9 or use a 2nd 15A fused +12V wire to #9. The lights should then behave as they should when the engine is running. If not, the LCM is faulty.
Disconnecting #1 with #9 still connected simulates cranking (starting). Usually lights - or at least headlights - are disabled during cranking.
I suspect you will be able to see the sanity of my madness... I have only considered the top LCM diagram in your pic.
Now I said "in principle" above. In practice it might be tricky wiring the above with the rest of the connector still in place (as required to supply other power etc).
It may be easiest to simply lift the power source side or fuses #15 & #6 and attach +12V to their free end (ie, the +12V goes thru each fuse to the LCM - do not connect the +12V to the source/IGN-switch side {even though I suspect no damage other than a blown fuse}).
Alternatively...
Some might cut wires and rejoin them later, but I don't like that.
Others might simply parallel the "bypassed power" (the battery +12V 15A fused leads) to the #1 & #9 terminals - maybe after opening up the LCM. But that could be hazardous (damaging) wrt to other circuits depending on how other things are interconnected. However this being a somewhat old vehicle, as I suggested, its electrics are probably very basic. Removing the #15 & #6 fuses should overcome such issues ASSUMING S2009 and S276 are mere connector or join labels and NOT switches or branches that involve other circuits.
How do you feel about trying the above?
Mind you, I make no guarantees and there is an element of risk. But IMO it is unlikely that problems will occur (except for you dropping or shorting wires etc, or NOT including fuses) other than fuses blowing.
Maybe I could add what is there to loose if you're already up for that $amount?... but that's more of a "logical" risk statement and not one of due-diligence nor let's play safe and not get me sued.
But I would also question why people are all saying it's the LCM instead of suggesting a switch issue. Do they know something that I don't, or do they like ripping of classy people like us that keep our older machines out of their hand$? (Should I say I rarely find the former to be true, or be more humble and say I almost always find the latter to be true?)
BTW, if it is the LCM, I'll bet that's fixable. It probably is primitive - it even looks like the BCM carries the full current needed for its devices (lights etc). (Don't tell me I'm right, AND that it's housed in the cabin, and they don't even use external relays for the headlights, demister, etc?)
FYI - I was recently surprised by the lack of sophistication of a modernish Jap car that had a so-called <whatever> Control Module. Though much power switching was handled by external relays, it was nothing more than a centralised collection of various formerly separate or remote circuits & relays. I was expecting integrated circuitry and "smarts" to handle the different functions. It's not what I would normally have called a control module.
Let me know if you want the test steps rewritten without the ramble...
But whatever happens, I wish you all the best. I like people that maintain new vehicles. (Yours is new. Mine is 1964.)
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: February 08, 2013 at 12:18 PM / IP Logged  
It's either fuse no. 6 at 15 amps in the central junction box or the box itself.
Unlikely to be ign. 1 circuit (live on run or crank) otherwise it wouldn't start so I disagree ref. an ignition switch fault.
Check that the RED / yellow from that fuse to terminal 9 on the LCM get's power at run and start.
oldspark 
Gold - Posts: 4,913
Gold spacespace
Joined: November 03, 2008
Location: Australia
Posted: February 08, 2013 at 6:33 PM / IP Logged  
I didn't consider a faulty fuse - I assumed that at least to have been checked (ie, swapped with the other 15A fuses on other circuits). Otherwise it would have been picked up as part of the testing.
And I'm not referring to a faulty IGN circuit, I referred only to a faulty ACC connection in the IGN switch. (Or that's how it should have read....)
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:14 AM / IP Logged  
OK but then it works according to the OP on ACC, that's why I specified that fuse.
You and I might do this logically, power source on down the circuit but Joe Public?
oldspark 
Gold - Posts: 4,913
Gold spacespace
Joined: November 03, 2008
Location: Australia
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:08 PM / IP Logged  
Yeah...
It's the "... had a few people look at it and they are all saying the problem is the lighting control module".
I'd assume that they were reasonably competent AND that that looking meant a BASIC check - ie, rotate the fuses; or at least a pull & inspect etc.
Of course if they were incompetent or mere Joes they could just as well have said "Nah mate, it's the engine. Buy a new car.".
[I did tell the story of the mate that sold his new SS Commodore after 2 years of intermittent stalling and checks by various mobs including warranty work? None solved it, but he did. In the week of its sale he found the hairline fracture in the relevant ATS fuse. I think that's where the definition of expert is a has been drip (ex-spurt).]
bostoncab 
Member - Posts: 4
Member spacespace
Joined: February 04, 2013
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:11 PM / IP Logged  
So I just got a gaggle of alerts that you guys were responding. Figured out the short was in fact in the box. The juice can take 2 paths through the box depending on key position. So I figured out which wire going into the box was hot with the turned towards you and jumped power to it from the battery with a 20 amp inline fuse. Its working perfectly but for how long is anyones guess.
What I would like is to find a place to tap into the wire after the box should this pathway through the box fail.
bostoncab 
Member - Posts: 4
Member spacespace
Joined: February 04, 2013
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:14 PM / IP Logged  
and yes at least three people including myself had previously put a test light on all the fuses both under the dash and under the hood for the hell of it..
Ford didnt start using these boxes until 1998 I will never understand why someone would put that much engineering behind...headlights etc. What was wrong with simple? Oh ya.. you couldn't sell $500 lighting control modules...
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:16 PM / IP Logged  
Score one for Superjew again.
No sunshine you don't have a short, what will blow 15 amps will most certainly blow 20.
Replace that 20 with your original 15 and you're on your way.
Don't even think about "alternative pathways" and don't listen to those effing idiots again
oldspark 
Gold - Posts: 4,913
Gold spacespace
Joined: November 03, 2008
Location: Australia
Posted: February 09, 2013 at 1:37 PM / IP Logged  
Ditto.
I'd like to say how they wasted my time, but as a wise man once said - "Amateurs assume...". (That's in Howard's signature in case my point is missed.)
I guess I've been spoilt again - so many replies in which I did NOT have to cover the basics.
Page of 2

  Printable version Printable version Post ReplyPost New Topic
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

  •  
Search the12volt.com
Follow the12volt.com Follow the12volt.com on Facebook
Thursday, April 25, 2024 • Copyright © 1999-2024 the12volt.com, All Rights Reserved Privacy Policy & Use of Cookies
Disclaimer: *All information on this site ( the12volt.com ) is provided "as is" without any warranty of any kind, either expressed or implied, including but not limited to fitness for a particular use. Any user assumes the entire risk as to the accuracy and use of this information. Please verify all wire colors and diagrams before applying any information.

Secured by Sectigo
the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer
Support the12volt.com
Top
the12volt.com spacer
the12volt.com spacer