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myth on soldering!


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techker 
Copper - Posts: 70
Copper spacespace
Joined: April 24, 2002
Location: Canada
Posted: May 15, 2003 at 12:22 PM / IP Logged  
let see what other installers think of soldering!
many people say that soldering is awast of thime?if you no how to make a good conecting ,it is the same?
and they say that when you solder speaker wire,you can loose frequences ?
afther all solder is not a 100% conducter?
people think   installer/solder ???
what do you think?myth on soldering! -- posted image.
TomEllis 
Copper - Posts: 52
Copper spacespace
Joined: December 11, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: May 15, 2003 at 12:30 PM / IP Logged  
I like to solder ALL of my connections.
I have not heard the speaker wire theory, what frequencies would you loose?
even wire is NOT a 100% conductor, that is why there is a resistance per foot rating on them.
Just my input.
Tom
myth on soldering! -- posted image.
Velocity Motors 
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Moderator spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Electrical Theory. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Fabrication. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Audio and Video. Click here for more info.spaceThis member has been recognized as an authority in Mobile Security and Convenience. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: March 08, 2002
Location: Manitoba, Canada
Posted: May 15, 2003 at 12:31 PM / IP Logged  
I'll answer your question with a question....................... are the frequencies you loose going to be audible by the human ear ? If not, solder away to your hearts content as it is a more solid connection ( if done properly ) than a butt connector or crimp connector. *** Everyone has their own method of connections and there is no incorrect way of doing it. It may not be sanctioned by all installer's but the end result is the same. ****
Jeff
Velocity Custom Home Theater
Mobile Audio/Video Specialist
Morden, Manitoba CANADA
Blazermedic 
Copper - Posts: 128
Copper spacespace
Joined: February 06, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: May 15, 2003 at 1:16 PM / IP Logged  
I solder the connections on my own car, but I use crimp connectors when I'm doing installs at work. Solder is time consuming and not condusive to working in confined areas. I haven't ever measured any kind of frequency response in solder vs. crimp, but this has certain piqued my interest.
Cary
esmith69 
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Gold spaceThis member has made a donation to the12volt.com. Click here for more info.spacespace
Joined: November 26, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: May 15, 2003 at 3:44 PM / IP Logged  

I solder all connections under the dash (security/remote start), as well as most fm modulation connections.  Depending on what gauge the factory wiring is and what kind of mood I'm inmyth on soldering! -- posted image., sometimes when hardwiring a deck I'll use butt connectors, and other times I'll solder.

We use harnesses and crimp caps (using ONLY Klein-style crimpers) whenever possible for deck installs.  It's just so much faster than soldering.  Usually for speaker and amp wiring I'll use crimp-on spades and ring terminals.

Also another thing to remember is that inhaling solder fumes is not exactly the best thing for your health.  And really the only way to avoid inhalation when you're under a dash soldering wires is to stick a fan right next to your head to blow the solder smoke away from you, but we don't really have one of those just lying around (can you say OSHA violations????myth on soldering! -- posted image.)  Most of our installers smoke so it's kinda pointless for me to argue this point, but still it's one reason why I sometimes just don't feel like soldering.

Ethan
-----
"Patience, persistence, and perspiration make an unbeatable combination for success"
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techker 
Copper - Posts: 70
Copper spacespace
Joined: April 24, 2002
Location: Canada
Posted: May 16, 2003 at 1:28 PM / IP Logged  
ah ha! i see i pick up somme interested installers!myth on soldering! -- posted image.
but there is so many diffrent version.
i do think that the odore is very toxic and maybe canceris!
i solder under the dash only!when i don't i put a tie rap where the conection is.
i do not belive in t-taps or but conectors!!!
lets continue this conversation.it is very interesting... myth on soldering! -- posted image. myth on soldering! -- posted image.
2001rolla 
Member - Posts: 4
Member spacespace
Joined: May 13, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: May 17, 2003 at 12:40 AM / IP Logged  

You will never get a better connection than you will with solder. I have always soldered my connections but just like Blazermedic says, it's very time consuming especially if you don't do it right the first time. I use shrink tubing as well to cover each wire so I have no possibility of shorting. I then wrap the wires with 3M electrical tape.

ScotchLocks, T-Taps and Butt connectors all have the possibility of failure. far more than any solder joint I've made...

 

ronniestamps 
Member - Posts: 3
Member spacespace
Joined: May 06, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: May 17, 2003 at 2:19 AM / IP Logged  

Like pretty much all of you have said, soldering is time consuming. But, answer this... Why is there never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over? Anyways, every good installer has their methods to make a secure conductive connection, and by now they have perfected their method. For example, whenever I use electrical tape, I throw cable ties over it so that varying temperatures can't promote unraveling. If I use crimp caps, I cable tie the wires together just below the crimp cap to keep the wires as one. If I use butt connectors, I use NON-insulated and shrink tubing. However you do it, keep in mind that you will most likely be the one fixing it if it breaks.

On the frequency loss note... sorry guys, but that is total BS in the audio world. First of all, if solder had that much degrading properties, it would not be used on every single connection inside of your computer, especially the processors. Second, the only frequency loss solder would ever encounter wouldn't actually be frequency loss, especially not in the audible range, it would just be that you've exceeded the conductive capabilities of wire. For example, microwaves and lightwaves not soundwaves.

ronniestamps 
Member - Posts: 3
Member spacespace
Joined: May 06, 2003
Location: United States
Posted: May 17, 2003 at 2:28 AM / IP Logged  

oh, and third, on the frequency note.... aren't the leads on the actual speaker soldered to the voice coil? =)

bdl666 
Silver - Posts: 330
Silver spacespace
Joined: December 31, 2002
Location: United States
Posted: May 17, 2003 at 6:46 AM / IP Logged  
I personaly hardly ever solder a wire unless it's necessary. I use high quality connectors( I work for one of the best solderless connector companies on the US).
A butt connector or a pig tail (what you guys refer to as caps) can be just as secure as soldering a wire. You just need the right crimpper for the connector you are using. The best crimpers are the ratcheting kind, if they are adjusted right .Mine crimps at 60psi (mil spec).
And most of the bussines that the company I work for do is with the boat and truck manufacturing industry. And they crimp most of their wires. So don't waste your time soldering a wire because it gives you a better conection just make sure that you protect that the wires from corrosion, the real enemy on the automobile enviroment.I put a little amount of electrolitic grease on my connectors before putting the wires in and then crimp and tape the joint.
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