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Alarm will Not arm


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kenwood_nut 
Stock Boy - Posts: 227
Stock Boy spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2009
Location: Washington, United States
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 9:31 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote kenwood_nut
Greetings once again, friends! I'm back, this time with a problem! Sorry this post is so long, but I want everyone to fully understand what I'm dealing with here.
I just bought a 2001 Honda Civic LX and was handed a remote with the keys! Yep, it has an alarm in it. But it didn't work. I went to replace the remote battery, only to find out someone had double-stacked TWO 3 volt batteries in it instead of the ONE 3 volt battery is was supposed to have. This resulted in the remote being fried. I confirmed this through DEI, who manufactured it. The alarm (although many people claim it's NOT an alarm but simply a keyless entry system, which is incorrect) is an Automate 410. I found out that all Automate alarms are strictly sold and installed ONLY by car dealers, not sold in stores. Well, after installing car audio and security for 40+ years, I just figured I would replace the existing Automate module with my brand new ScyTek alarm I bought to put in my previous car but never did. This would make it easy. All I would have to do is connect the new wires to the existing ones. HOWEVER, upon further inspection, I discovered that the original installer left more than half the wires disconnected! Plus, they had the siren wire hooked to the car's horn wire, so when the alarm activated, the horn would honk steady for like 60 seconds instead of short bursts. It was sending constant voltage to the horn. Idiots!
So, back to my problem...
I was able to easily replace the alarm module with mine. I just had to cut the existing wires and connect the new ones. Sounds easy enough. Because the original installer left most wires disconnected, I only had to connect 4 wires from the main harness, plus the door lock and unlock wires, the valet button, and the LED wires. No problem. But the original Automate wires that were supposed to be connected to other stuff were still not connected. I wanted to make sure the new alarm worked first. No luck! I would NOT arm, nor would it lock the doors! I tested the module's lock and unlock plug and discovered it was grounding when you pressed the unlock, but not grounding when you press the lock button on the remote. Just like the old alarm! Yes, the lock wire is connected to the car's correct wire. It locks the doors when I run a ground wire to it, but not froe the alarm!
So now what? Well, I decided to go BACK to the original Automate alarm! I found a brand new remote on ebay for $7 and bought it. Last night, I disconnected the ScyTek alarm and reconnected the Automate, but remembered I would have to program the remote. It didn't work! The dealer installation guide says to program a remote (they call it "learn"), you follow these steps:
1. Turn key to RUN position.
2. Press the valet button the number of times that correspond to the channel number you wish to program. They then give 9 options, where you press the valet button up to 9 times depending one which function/button you want to learn. "Do NOT release valet button."
3. Press the button on the remote that you wish to use for the function you selected from the list of 9. The horn will honk once to confirm the code was learned.
4. Once the code is learned, you can release the valet button.
Well, guess what? This did NOT work! It didn't program or "learn" the new remote! I even replaced the battery, thinking the new one sat too long and was low. No luck.
SO... any suggestions? Tips? Anyone else have problems with an Automate alarm or keyless entry? I'm ready to buy another alarm and start from scratch so I know it WILL work right! Oh, by the way, my ScyTek Astra A20 alarm, even though brand new, was purchased over a year ago, and ScyTek does NOT give any warranty unless an authorized dealer installs it, so I'm screwed there.
Sorry for the long novel. Thanks for reading it if you did.
kenwood_nut 
Stock Boy - Posts: 227
Stock Boy spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2009
Location: Washington, United States
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 9:40 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote kenwood_nut
PS... the reason I claim the Automate 410 IS an alarm and not just a keyless entry? Simple: because the installer manual says it! Okay, plus because of the wires and functions.
Here are the wires from the 12-pin harness:
Orange: - ground when armed output (controls starter kill)
White: - parking light output
WHITE/ Blue: - 3-channel validity output
BLACK/ White: - dome light output
Green: not used (then WHY put it there? LOL!)
Blue: - 2nd unlock output (used to either unlock one door or all)
Violet: not used (again, why put it there?)
Black: ground (DUH!)
Yellow: + ignition switch input
Brown: - horn honk output
Red: + constant 12 volt input
RED / White: - 2-channel validity output
So, although it has no actual "siren" output, it honks the horn in the same manner. If this was only a keyless entry, I doubt it would have parking light flash, panic, horn honk or even a built-in starter kill with relay. The installation manual clearly calls it an alarm AND keyless entry, not just a keyless entry. THAT is the reason I say it's an alarm too. Just wanted to clarify that I'm not trippin' here.
howie ll 
Pot Metal - Posts: 16,466
Pot Metal spacespace
Joined: January 09, 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 10:33 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote howie ll
Take green to a door trigger.
check your ignition input, does it go to BLACK / YELLOW on an 01 honda?
davep. 
Gold - Posts: 624
Gold spacespace
Joined: May 27, 2011
Location: California, United States
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 11:45 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote davep.

kenwood_nut wrote:
PS... the reason I claim the Automate 410 IS an alarm and not just a keyless entry?  I doubt it would have parking light flash, panic, horn honk or even a built-in starter kill with relay.

I'm not familiar with the Automate, or the 410S, but I am familiar with the DEI 211 which is a stand-alone RKE. The 211  has all the functions and wires you cite that the Automate does. But the 211 is not an alarm. It doesn't have shock sensors, or inputs for sensors, and does not sound the horn with the door triggers. The horn-honk connection is for panic or lock/unlock notification. Sure, the starter kill functions the way an alarm does so it offers some protection if the remote isn't available to deactivate the starter kill.

But the big difference between an alarm and an RKE is no sensors or inputs for them, no siren output, and no reaction to door triggers other than lock and dome light function for an RKE..

Does the Automate have the blue wire Zone 1 "instant trigger" input that ALL DEI alarms have had since at least 1990? If it doesn't, it isn't an "alarm".

 EDIT / ADD: I looked at your wiring description again. That's the 'generic' DEI 12-pin harness they've had for decades. Pin 6 is blue. In your application, #6blue is "second unlock". When this harness is used with an alarm module, #6 blue is Zone 1 instant trigger. Nope. The 410s is not an "alarm".

davep. 
Gold - Posts: 624
Gold spacespace
Joined: May 27, 2011
Location: California, United States
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 4:52 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote davep.

howie ll wrote:
Take green to a door trigger.

I found and read the install manual for this unit. Neither door trigger is utilized, so no need to connect green to anything for any reason, including programing. To program, the yellow IGN must be powered-up. So either to the Honda's ignition wire, or to a temporary 12V source. The only function the yellow wire does is program, or dome lights on w/ ignition off. So without a dome light supervision relay, no reason to hook up the yellow, except to program it.

To the OP: I read the Install manual. I agree with you, that it refers to this system as "security" in many places. It also uses the terms "arm" and "disarm". These instructions are in many chapters and places word-for-word copies of other DEI system install manuals, including ALARM system Install Manuals.. In actuality, your system is a "security device" because of it's interface with locks and starter interrupt. But that does not make it an "alarm" in the colloquial sense.

kenwood_nut 
Stock Boy - Posts: 227
Stock Boy spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2009
Location: Washington, United States
Posted: October 11, 2015 at 6:55 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote kenwood_nut
Got Scytek back in and ran WHITE/ red, an unused 500ma negative output unlock wire and doors lock now. But alarm never actually arms. Oh well.
kenwood_nut 
Stock Boy - Posts: 227
Stock Boy spacespace
Joined: April 10, 2009
Location: Washington, United States
Posted: November 07, 2015 at 6:51 AM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote kenwood_nut
STILL same problem, but at least I'm able to finally use the remote to LOCK the doors as well as UNlock them by pressing the * button. Just waiting for my brand new Code Alarm to get here so I can start from scratch and wire it all myself like I've done all my life. This is the first car I've bought in my 40 years of driving that already had an alarm installed in it. And just my luck, the alarm hasn't worked since I got the car! I'll update this post after I rip out the alarm wires that are in it now and reinstall my new alarm that I KNOW will work.
davep. 
Gold - Posts: 624
Gold spacespace
Joined: May 27, 2011
Location: California, United States
Posted: November 07, 2015 at 8:23 PM / IP Logged Link to Post Post Reply Quote davep.

kenwood_nut wrote:
And just my luck, the "alarm " hasn't worked since I got the car!

That's because the 410 is not an alarm.  It's a Remote Keyless Entry system. With a Master Remote capability for use by new car dealers.


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